Baltimore's 10 second reload.

[LuckyStarFan]

Would Baltimore be broken with a 10 second reload?  I don't really think so.  She is performing terribly in so many ways, and yet when you jump to the tier 10 Des Moines you find yourself in a niche but very capable ship.  There are of course other small differences between the two, but DM's most notable feature is her 6 second reload.  And yet DM is not considered broken or overpowered by most. 

 

Baltimore would still have her 'poor' arcs and range while the difference between New Orleans and Des Moines would be better bridged by a ship that reloaded in a reasonable time.  Baltimore's biggest complaint is nearly always the fact that she must get closer than other tier 9 cruisers to be accurate, but she then loses to torpedoes and gains no advantage against her peers in main battery DPM.

 

I'm sure there are many other ways to bring balance to this underperforming ship, but why not start with making her upgraded main battery capable of a 10 second reload?

[MrDeaf]

I figure Baltimore would require around 9s reload to be a competitive T9, but obviously that's far beyond what it was capable of, historically.

 

Don't get me started on ahistorical RoF of Mogami or Aoba.

[Special_Kay]

It's hard to justify such a value when she didn't have autoloaders, but it would probably go a long way towards redeeming Baltimore. Speaking from recent personal experience, you do not need a stepping stool to adapt to 5.3s reloads coming from 13s—it's very easy to get used to a 2.5x increase in rate of fire at those speeds—but neither would it hurt to have a gentler transition from New Orleans to Des Moines.

 

To be more direct, it would be better if we found a solution that didn't contradict Baltimore's reality so much. But failing the discovery of such a solution, that may work.

[AnatolyDyatlovDidNothing]

I figure Baltimore would require around 9s reload to be a competitive T9, but obviously that's far beyond what it was capable of, historically.

 

Don't get me started on ahistorical RoF of Mogami or Aoba.

 

USN cruisers were capable of 6rpm historically using a method called "Cue Balling".

 

From navweaps

 

Cue Balling - One of the major "sailor alts" (see below) used to increase the rate of fire of 8 inch (20.3 cm) guns on US cruisers of the World War II period. This involved using the rammer at high speed to strike the projectile and bat it into the breech. This meant that the rammer did not have to extend and retract past the much shorter and thus faster acting powder bag ram position. This unofficial loading method increased the ROF of these weapons from the standard 3 RPM up to 5 or 6 RPM, a significant improvement. The fact that the gun crews were able to do this on a regular basis and not damage the mechanisms is a credit to the designers of the mountings, who over engineered them to be resistant to such abuse.

 

This would apply to Pensacola, Indianapolis, New Orleans and Baltimore (and in the future Northampton and Wichita). While i do not think Pensacola needs this in game (just a concealment range buff) New Orleans and Baltimore could definitely use this as a historical basis for a 10 second reload. 

[Raptor_alcor]

Aoba got buffed something fierce to be competative at tier 6, there is zero excuse wargaming can ever give to not buff the reload rate of the baltimore considering this precident. 

[godzilla5549]

Baltimore should have a 13 second stock reload time.

 

With the upgraded guns, that make it 11 seconds.

 

With the RoF mod, that would make it 9.79 seconds.

[4bRbyHSSzZ6pk]

Roon has 7,8s reloads with the reload module. Even if you buffed the Baltimore that much, it'd still be inferior to the Roon in all but concealment and a slightly bonus to maneuverability that's pretty much irrelevant. There's no hope for Balti

[Raven114]

The minute we start making up equipment changes that are not part of the historical equipment capabilities. This game is dead, just a shooting galley.

[LuckyStarFan]

It's hard to justify such a value when she didn't have autoloaders, but it would probably go a long way towards redeeming Baltimore. Speaking from recent personal experience, you do not need a stepping stool to adapt to 5.3s reloads coming from 13s—it's very easy to get used to a 2.5x increase in rate of fire at those speeds—but neither would it hurt to have a gentler transition from New Orleans to Des Moines.

 

To be more direct, it would be better if we found a solution that didn't contradict Baltimore's reality so much. But failing the discovery of such a solution, that may work.

 

You bring up reality when none of the other tier 9 cruisers ever existed. 

 

This game continually nerfs USN vessels from their historical parameters for the sake of gameplay and then people actually support keeping such a useless ship as it is for reality's sake?

[4bRbyHSSzZ6pk]

The minute we start making up equipment changes that are not part of the historical equipment capabilities. This game is dead, just a shooting galley.

 

Let's take a look at the soviet trees, or the Zao, or half the german ships. The game is already so full of works of fiction that another one wouldn't really hurt it, it'd fit like a glove actually.

[the_majestic_eagle]

The minute we start making up equipment changes that are not part of the historical equipment capabilities. This game is dead, just a shooting galley.

 

game already has significant historical discrepancies in it, it's not gonna kill the game cause it's not a sim

[Captain_Dorja]

The only things in game that should be historical are ship names and ship models.

 

If a ship needs to go 400 knots and fire targetted F**cking Freaking Lazors Beam (sorry old Eve quote) to be balanced, there is no reason to not do it.

[Raven114]

I agree , it will be lucky if this game last's to its second Anniversary

[SpeedingBus]

The minute we start making up equipment changes that are not part of the historical equipment capabilities. This game is dead, just a shooting galley.

RIP World of Warship then because you don't seem how much has been altered to balance a lot of the ships.

[ForgMaxtor]

It's hard to justify such a value when she didn't have autoloaders...

 

As noted, several IJN cruisers have already been buffed substantially beyond their historical theoretical max ROF.  But for some reason, USN cruisers have not, as of yet, been buffed in this way.  In fact, some USN cruisers (e.g., Cleveland) have had their ROF nerfed relative to documented historical ROF.

[AnatolyDyatlovDidNothing]

The minute we start making up equipment changes that are not part of the historical equipment capabilities. This game is dead, just a shooting galley.

 

Cue

 

Balling

[Special_Kay]

You bring up reality when none of the other tier 9 cruisers ever existed. 

 

This game continually nerfs USN vessels from their historical parameters for the sake of gameplay and then people actually support keeping such a useless ship as it is for reality's sake?

 

Taking for granted you're a USN enthusiast of one form or another, why on earth would you be displeased with my post? I basically said "I'd like a fix for Baltimore that isn't ahistorical, but if we haven't got one then your idea is worth trying." The only two reasons I can think of for a pro-USN player to take issue with that is either failure to comprehend or a jingoistic desire for ahistorical US supremacy. Your conclusion that I support the ship as-is is confusing to say the least.

[IronWolfV]

The minute we start making up equipment changes that are not part of the historical equipment capabilities. This game is dead, just a shooting galley.

 

Then we can bring Aoba down to historical reload right, which would be nearer to Furutaka at around 14 seconds. Or Mogami and her completely unhistorical reload. Or the fantasy ships and their absurd reloads right?

 

Or we can realize this isn't a simulator and balance trumps history.

[LuckyStarFan]

 

Taking for granted you're a USN enthusiast of one form or another, why on earth would you be displeased with my post? I basically said "I'd like a fix for Baltimore that isn't ahistorical, but if we haven't got one then your idea is worth trying." The only two reasons I can think of for a pro-USN player to take issue with that is either failure to comprehend or a jingoistic desire for ahistorical US supremacy. Your conclusion that I support the ship as-is is confusing to say the least.

 

I have nearly twice as many IJN games played as USN and as many Russian as American.  I am far from a USN enthusiast, possibly because they are so weak overall in this game.  I take issue with your first post because you immediately dismiss my balance suggestion because Baltimore did not have autoloaders in reality.

 

Who cares what loading system she had?  She could have had Oompa Loompas rolling shells across the deck yet she is still saddled with an inferior rate of fire in game compared to vessels which receive many more benefits than she does.  She is weak and many many ships with the same loading system or even inferior loading systems boast better reload speeds in this game.  It's time to stop handicapping USN ships which are the worst in their tier simply because they were actually built and saw service while napkin doodle #68979 could in theory make 50 knots and sling 8 inch shells further, faster and more powerful than any ship afloat could.

[ckupf]

I think I'm the only player who liked the baltimore. She could use the ROF buff, but I think shell performance buff would be better. The US made better 8" shells (particularly AP) than anyone else, which is not reflected in game.

[IronWolfV]

I think I'm the only player who liked the baltimore. She could use the ROF buff, but I think shell performance buff would be better. The US made better 8" shells (particularly AP) than anyone else, which is not reflected in game.

 

That's due to plunging shell fire the USN adopted, but it's. otherwise reflected in game. 

[HazeGrayUnderway]

Baltimore should have a 13 second stock reload time.

 

With the upgraded guns, that make it 11 seconds.

 

With the RoF mod, that would make it 9.79 seconds.

 

That actually looks quite enticing to give some sort of draw for Baltimore.  She really needs the help.

 

In contrast to that 9.79 reload time, stock DM reload is 6 seconds, Roon & Hindenberg with Main Battery oriented build can go down to 8.8 seconds.

 

If there is one thing that Baltimore didn't have a problem with was power in her guns... Getting those in action sooner would help.

[wadavid]

The only things in game that should be historical are ship names and ship models.

 

If a ship needs to go 400 knots and fire targetted F**cking Freaking Lazors Beam (sorry old Eve quote) to be balanced, there is no reason to not do it.

 

Exactly. Let's have a quick look at the wildly ahistorical stuff in this game that has somehow not ruined the playing experience:

 

• infinite reloads, including destroyers' torpedoes which had at most one reload carried
• magical "fix everything" button that resets every few minutes
• the game's scaling in general
• guns that hit stuff more than 5% of the time (partially due to the size/distance/time scaling)
• many of the ships' stats, and many of the ships, period
• etc.

 

Come off it with the historical accuracy nonsense, folks. This game is nothing like a simulator, and guess what? It's really fun. Maybe War Thunder will eventually add large surface ships in the naval arm of that game and offer hours-long realistic combat. The 20-minute-long romps we know and love called World of Warships uses historical ships and naval combat as inspiration for an arcade combat game that is very different from real-life WWII naval warfare. And it's still fun.

 

So, tirade aside, this buff would be a much-needed shot in the arm to an under-performing ship.

[onyhow]

I agree , it will be lucky if this game last's to its second Anniversary

 

Quit the game then. This isn't historical sim, game balance comes before historical accuracy, especially at T9 where most ships are fictional. Hell, even real ships have parameters buffed beyond their RL specification. Looking at you, Aoba.

 

If you want accuracy so much play other games. Maybe War Thunder or Silent Hunter.

[hoom]

I think I'd be down for RoF buff yeah.

With the Cue Balling thing there is even a better historical basis than for some stuff.