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Mahrs

Tactical TK?

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I just played a match where, in retrospect, it would absolutely have been the right call to very probably torp a green.  A Dunker maneuvered through the A cap on Estuary towards a friendly Konig.  The Konig was just trying to hide behind an island and reverse.  The Dunker rounded the island...I was at ideal torp range, but held fire because 95% sure the green eats at least one+ torp, probably sinks.  The only problem is, I am spotted...and the BB driver isn't an idiot, so his secondaries are on me.  I get smoke out, but it's too late.  Between using my damage control and getting blind fired by a Cleveland, I am on the way out.  The Konig got beat down hard, no surprise...and I burnt down shortly after.  The only chance my team had to sink that boat was for me to put torpedoes in the water and sink the friendly along with the red.  I didn't do it.  My team lost that flank, that objective and the match (we were trailing by one or two ships, but it was still winnable).  Arguably all because I didn't just take the pink and torp a friendly.  

 

What do you guys think?  Is the tactical TK ever appropriate?  Or do you just take your lumps an move on.

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I just played a match where, in retrospect, it would absolutely have been the right call to very probably torp a green.  A Dunker maneuvered through the A cap on Estuary towards a friendly Konig.  The Konig was just trying to hide behind an island and reverse.  The Dunker rounded the island...I was at ideal torp range, but held fire because 95% sure the green eats at least one+ torp, probably sinks.  The only problem is, I am spotted...and the BB driver isn't an idiot, so his secondaries are on me.  I get smoke out, but it's too late.  Between using my damage control and getting blind fired by a Cleveland, I am on the way out.  The Konig got beat down hard, no surprise...and I burnt down shortly after.  The only chance my team had to sink that boat was for me to put torpedoes in the water and sink the friendly along with the red.  I didn't do it.  My team lost that flank, that objective and the match (we were trailing by one or two ships, but it was still winnable).  Arguably all because I didn't just take the pink and torp a friendly.  

 

What do you guys think?  Is the tactical TK ever appropriate?  Or do you just take your lumps an move on.

I believe it should be appropriate, yet it is not realistic to implement it into the game :(

How can we tell it is an appropriate TK instead of a low tier pink dd rushing toward you right at the start of the game not suspicious at all?

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It is just a game, you don't kill a friend to win it.

 

This. I would've held my fire.

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This. I would've held my fire.

 

Screw that. You play for the objective. The way he described it, it sounded justifiable to me. It's a war game. Casualties happen.

 

Of course, the decision probably had some more factors to it. For starters, your track record for TK and stuff. If my record on TK was not too good, I would try my best to avoid friendly fire in all scenarios. If it was a none-issue, however, I'd have to make the tactical decision given the circumstances at the time. After all, forgoing the 50% bonus XP for the whole team to "possibly" save 1 player?

Hmmm. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. :izmena:

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IF the enemy ship was the LAST SHIP on their team, then, and pretty much ONLY then, and only if you are 100% sure your torps will hit and KILL him, would I fire on that ship... and after firing I would say EXACTLY that in chat if I had time to type it... but even that scenario is iffy.... but that would be the only instance where a TK would be "OK" and solidify a win...

BUT, again as said, it is only a game..... no need to kill a bud

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I'd fire the torps.

 

But then again, I'm an awful person. :izmena:

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i tactical strafe friendly planes as long as im taking more then what hes losing.

but this is a different case, i dont think so unless its ftw :amazed:

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If I had ages to think I about it, yeah I'd fire the torps and take the penalty. Apologize afterwards.

 

But in the heat of the moment? I'd probably hesitate and hold fire.

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I might do it if I thought it necessary for victory, but I would only do it being fully prepared to accept the consequences.

 

Of course, in 2k+ matches thusfar, I've yet to be in a situation where I felt it necessary. I have hypothesized about it before though. You might be interested in that, OP.

Edited by Special_Kay
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I wouldn't do it. I might try to get close enough that I wouldn't hit the friendly and then drop the torps if I could, but its not worth taking out a friendly and getting pinked in my opinion.

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Screw that. You play for the objective.

 

One of the primary objectives of the game is not to kill your teammates.
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Screw that. You play for the objective. The way he described it, it sounded justifiable to me. It's a war game. Casualties happen.

 

Of course, the decision probably had some more factors to it. For starters, your track record for TK and stuff. If my record on TK was not too good, I would try my best to avoid friendly fire in all scenarios. If it was a none-issue, however, I'd have to make the tactical decision given the circumstances at the time. After all, forgoing the 50% bonus XP for the whole team to "possibly" save 1 player?

Hmmm. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. :izmena:

 

I have TK'd once.  It was a while back...think I was grinding the Wickes at the time.  I did a bad read on what a friendly Bogatyr was doing, thought I could get the torps past him, I was wrong.  I had cut it close a few times, but that one caught us both out.  Since then, I have been much more conservative in my torpedo usage.  If there is a chance for torps on green, I usually either hold fire or coordinate the shot ahead of time.  I was pretty upset with myself for the pink the one time I earned it.  

 

I willing to take a high risk shot in this case...but, I didn't occur to me to "take the pink" for the sink until afterwards because my aversion to fratricide is pretty high.  I was mostly just curious if folks have done, or seen it done, and what/if there is etiquette for it.  It suppose it may be too contentious a tactic and too limited in application to really have much consensus.  

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Maybe just announce your intentions? Tough call, because few actually read the chat. Something like "Hard right, torps incoming to save you!" Typing all that can waste the moment too though. It would be nice to have one of the function keys for a custom message.

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What do you guys think?  Is the tactical TK ever appropriate?  Or do you just take your lumps an move on.

 

It's called danger close.  Sometimes you gotta risk fratricide when engaging the enemy.  It's a tough call.

 

It's often not a clear cut call (right or wrong).  It just is what it is.

 

I guess the main measure is attitude.  If you're pissed that a friendly got in the way of your shot, then "no", because the attitude is as much punishment on the friendly as it is damage to the opponent.  If you're thinking about the team (including the possible friendly casualty), then you have the correct attitude.  You don't want to hurt the friendly.  That's the hard call.

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What do you guys think?  Is the tactical TK ever appropriate?  Or do you just take your lumps an move on.

 

Funny thing, ISSM brought up a good point earlier.  Teamkilling a friendly right before they die can actually be useful to the team, as since that kill wasn't earned by the enemy, it won't give them points, you'll only lose points(which you lose anyway).

 

In a ranked battle, this could actually be very useful.

Edited by KTcraft

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Funny thing, ISSM brought up a good point earlier.  Teamkilling a friendly right before they die can actually be useful to the team, as since that kill wasn't earned by the enemy, it won't give them points, you'll only lose points(which you lose anyway).

 

In a ranked battle, this could actually be very useful.

 

And should be considered an exploit, no different than CV agreements. If the only way to win is killing a team mate, you lost....

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And should be considered an exploit, no different than CV agreements. If the only way to win is killing a team mate, you lost....

 

Think of it as destroying a ship to prevent capture.

 

A quick study of history will show this happened to several ships in WWII.  Sometimes it was a scuttle by the crew, and sometimes it was the job of the friendly destroyers putting torps in 'em. 

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And should be considered an exploit, no different than CV agreements. If the only way to win is killing a team mate, you lost....

 

Unlike CV agreements, one of the involved players-the TKer actually gets the short end of the stick turning pink, While the teamkilled would have died a second later anyway and even gets some compensation via credits.  

 

This is not an exploit in that it doesn't give you some obnoxious advantage over the enemy, any more then farming caps for exp is an exploit.

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Depends.  Given what you've said here, I would agree that putting torpedoes out would be the best thing to do - the Konig wasn't going to last long anyhow.  With any luck he might even have died before your torps reached him.

 

But, whether it would be worth the TK to save the flank is hard to know without seeing a player list.  If a decent number of those on your side have a general idea of how to pilot the ships they use, then yes, it would be.  If the team was anything like the teams from the weekends...nope.  Not a chance in hell would it be worth it.

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Your scenario is not making sense to me because it sounds like the friendly Konig is between you and the Dunk, if so, wouldn't the Konig eat all the torps?  If I'm wrong and the Dunk was somehow between you and the Konig and it looked like the Konig was going to die to the Dunk, I would probably fire the torps and warn the Konig that they were incoming.

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