Boyarsky

Comments on Prinz Eugen from NA Publishing Team

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I'm all for capitalism and what not, but Eugen just seems like a half assed cash grab on the part of WG. I love premiums and I love spending money on this game, but I don't love it enough to spend ~$45 real dollars for a ship I already own with a fancy paint job. The commander XP benefit is of dubious value for me since I already have Roon and I have Tirpitz to train BB captains.


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How about the marketing team decided that the ship will be so underwhelming that the only people likely to buy it would be the hipper lovers or collectors so why don't we soak them for as much as we can right away while the ship is seen as a limited available purchase.

 

The reasons people get pissed about your tactics is that you deceive and manipulate routinely and follow that up with more of the same.

 

You prey on the EU and NA player base's love of gaming to carry the free loading RU server. Considering western servers pay 80% of the bills if not more you could consider not milking the cow til it dies of dehydration.

 

FU WG, working as intended.

Cite your sources plz? I have never seen any evidence that EU and NA servers carry Russia or that we pay 80% of the bills. 


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ok then answer us this, why did WG got the P2P route on the ship this time? you've never had us wait to by lower level bundles before. why did you do it this time? and you should also rethink your strategy if you think we (the player base) will continue to allow this type of bundle shinanigan to be allowed in the future. its dumb, unfair for players who have set(limited) amounts of funds and if you add the posibiblity of limited playing hours, you also risk losing out on sales!:sceptic:

 

He said they were trying something new.  I honestly thought it was a good idea.

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pys on our backs and call it rain all you like.

 

FYI, we the people that actually pay your salary are the ones who get to define it. Do you think your back account is filled by magic or would you like to see the paper trail?

 

Posts like this one really rub me the wrong way.  I may not agree with the decisions made by companies and developers, but they deserve better treatment than this.  Your use of 'we' here is a bit arrogant and presumptuous.  'We' don't pay his salary, and you do not speak for me.  Got it?

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Thanks for the explanation Boyarsky. Always nice to see that you guys come out and explain what your thoughts were.


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Cite your sources plz? I have never seen any evidence that EU and NA servers carry Russia or that we pay 80% of the bills. 

 

There was a source recently that cited NA pays 7+ times as RU and EU  pays 5+ times, SEA was 3+ times.

 

I would venture that NA and EU combined cover well in excess of 80%.

 

WG has stated many times over how easily NA and EU can afford what they price their goods for.  WG says we are rich.


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@Boyarsky To be honest I never understood the logic of why you would sell your bundles this way, from a perception point of view it makes your company look like a money grabbing company with only dollar signs in their eyes. Also you risk the loss and future sales of the ship because if the ship has some negative aspects you can be sure it will be announced on the forums and in-game thus scaring away any possible customers for the later bundles. Whom ever thought this up really missed the mark or needs some education in marketing.

 

Good grief... it's called free enterprise.

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Posts like this one really rub me the wrong way.  I may not agree with the decisions made by companies and developers, but they deserve better treatment than this.  Your use of 'we' here is a bit arrogant and presumptuous.  'We' don't pay his salary, and you do not speak for me.  Got it?

 

Oh no? You've never bought prem time, dubloons or a ship? If not then yes, you do not pay his salary. I and everyone who does buy prem time, dubloons and ships do in fact pay his salary.

 Got it?


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Good grief... it's called free enterprise.

I get that but you also get and which was verified by the reaction of everyone, that this type of marketing makes you look bad to the people your trying to sell to which made no sense to me and thus the reason I made the statement.


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Sir_Godz,

 

The word is 'doubloon.'  Perhaps in addition to learning how to spell, you can go back to school and learn how businesses actually work and who actually makes the decisions.  Until you do, perhaps you should step away from the keyboard and let the adults participate in a civil discussion. 

 

Edited by BartMancuso

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Oh no? You've never bought prem time, dubloons or a ship? If not then yes, you do not pay his salary. I and everyone who does buy prem time, dubloons and ships do in fact pay his salary.

 Got it?

 

And you got your value for what you paid for.  Once you have made that exchange, they can do anything they well please with THEIR money.  If you have a problem with what they charge for premiums, then don't buy them.  

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I love the ship,  my only complaint is that from what I understand Prinz is getting a 10% credit increase bonus that's tied to another camo that you have to buy after paying for the ship. Why couldn't it just be part of the original camo or part of the ship itself?  Why should I have to buy ANOTHER camo just to get one of the features of the ship. Unless I misread somewhere and am not understanding.


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Posts like this one really rub me the wrong way.  I may not agree with the decisions made by companies and developers, but they deserve better treatment than this.  Your use of 'we' here is a bit arrogant and presumptuous.  'We' don't pay his salary, and you do not speak for me.  Got it?

 

+1

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I get that but you also get and which was verified by the reaction of everyone, that this type of marketing makes you look bad to the people your trying to sell to which made no sense to me and thus the reason I made the statement.

 

Define everyone. I couldn't disagree more with both you and Sir_Godz, and I know many others who also disagree. It's a cheap and ineffective rhetorical trick to cloak yourself in 'we' and 'everyone' comments when you're speaking only for yourself.

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Perhaps it's because I have been part of wargame design teams and a historical researcher along with it... but WG have their work cut out for them ahead to model the British, French and Italian navies, expanding existing fleets, and putting forth historical premiums (like the Canadian DD Haida *hint hint). This thread is an open admission that they are experimenting with various approaches to ship releases and full marks to them for doing so. Without a business model that works--making sufficient funds to carry through on this--none of the above huge R&D will come to pass. I don't get the acerbic tone of many posts here--no one is demanding you buy ship X.

 

Finally I am sure they are about the same as the teams I worked with--having an abiding passion for the work at hand and a love of playing the game finally when all the playtesting and development can be put aside for a bit.


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I'm all for capitalism and what not, but Eugen just seems like a half assed cash grab on the part of WG. I love premiums and I love spending money on this game, but I don't love it enough to spend ~$45 real dollars for a ship I already own with a fancy paint job. The commander XP benefit is of dubious value for me since I already have Roon and I have Tirpitz to train BB captains.

 

This is what really amazes me about WG and their lack of marketing ability. KM cruisers have been around for over a year and only now they come out with a prem ship for the line. I likely would have bought a eugen at a fair/appropriate price for what it offers the player back when but at this point in the game the value of such a ship is even less than it would have been. Certainly far less than they are asking. They could have just offered a super camo for the hipper but then they couldn't justify cough cough.. what they are deeming "worthwhile" for the eugen.

 

The next line do to come out if rumors are true is the KM DD line. When will a complimentary prem come for that?


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I was really disappointed with Prinz Eugen as she was put in game.  I really expected more of a ship that fought The Mighty Hood alongside the Bismarck.  Even more so considering the ship survived two nuclear detonations.  *shrugs*  I was expecting her to be the jewel at Tier VIII.


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This is what really amazes me about WG and their lack of marketing ability. KM cruisers have been around for over a year and only now they come out with a prem ship for the line. I likely would have bought a eugen at a fair/appropriate price for what it offers the player back when but at this point in the game the value of such a ship is even less than it would have been. Certainly far less than they are asking. They could have just offered a super camo for the hipper but then they couldn't justify cough cough.. what they are deeming "worthwhile" for the eugen.

 

The next line do to come out if rumors are true is the KM DD line. When will a complimentary prem come for that?

 

The Tirpitz came out before any other german ships and you are not limited to class just nation. So there is that. Also, I have spent a lot of money on this game and I thought there new marketing was fine. I understand some people were upset because people in our culture have no patience. Some times a delayed release generates more profits, other times it doesn't. So they tested it, and based off feedback/data they will adjust accordingly. Now, I am not saying the marketing team does everything perfect, but we also don't know what there internal schedules look like.


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Sir_Godz,

 

The word is 'doubloon.'  Perhaps in addition to learning how to spell, you can go back to school and learn how businesses actually work and who actually makes the decisions.  Until you do, perhaps you should step away from the keyboard and let the adults participate in a civil discussion. 

 

 

hahaha. you go for the cheap shot spelling mistake to try and discredit the argument? go back to school and learn how to debate effectievely. Until you do, perhaps you should step away from the keyboard and let the adults participate.

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Atago is $47 by itself, what makes you think the Prinz would be so much cheaper?

 

Its not a pixel by pixel quantifiable equation - its called moving the product.  If you want stuff to sell it need not be equal to another.  Prices are meant to move product.  

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1st of all: I LOVE LOVE LOVE my german history and this being put in the game made me so happy.

2nd: I cant see what People complain about if they dont it dont complain.

The ultimate decision lies with you WG.

Yes we may as a gamer have a small % in the decision but as i said you have ultimate decision what get put in the game


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View PostBartMancuso, on 14 September 2016 - 03:27 AM, said:

Sir_Godz,

 

The word is 'doubloon.'  Perhaps in addition to learning how to spell, you can go back to school and learn how businesses actually work and who actually makes the decisions.  Until you do, perhaps you should step away from the keyboard and let the adults participate in a civil discussion. 

hahaha. you go for the cheap shot spelling mistake to try and discredit the argument? go back to school and learn how to debate effectievely. Until you do, perhaps you should step away from the keyboard and let the adults participate.

You focused on only the first line of his post and ignored the meat of it. Maybe you should reply to his whole post or step away from the keyboard and let the adults participate. 


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I love the ship, and  I liked this deluxe package. Basically Eugen, Warspite next sale, 30 days premiums time, a flag I don't care about and credits. One thing I DO like about the staggered release is it wasn't Eugen mania, I have not seen more than 1 on each side in a battle so far.

 

 

I also think that this ship was my best purchase after the Tirpitz. I enjoy german cruiser play, I need experienced captains, and this delivers the commander xp with decent credit earning. I do think it should come with both camos, that would greatly boost sales of this pricey hipper clone for players that don't need the captain exp bonus. As it is people are looking at more than 60 bucks for the basic package with both camo patterns.

Edited by Captain_Minke

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Just a little something for flavor, gameplay-wise. Would that have been such a stretch? "Only German ship with radar!" (Who says it has to be particularly *good* radar, eh?) Or... "Hey, you get some Slot 3 upgrades available, pick your own topping!" (OP? Arkansas Beta has all of them at Tier 4!)

 

I just can't shake the notion that a little creativity in this area was curbed or nipped in the bud because of a perception of the inherent desirability of Prinz ("Feuer! Feuer!"). And so *now* was high time for an "experiment" in "totally-not-P2W premiums".

Edited by Wash0ut

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I'm going to be pretty blunt on this one. As is - I already think that your ships are overpriced in most cases. Most tier 6 premiums are under 20 dollars but here it's over or lose to 30. And premiums are relatively consistently more expensive here. I mean you look at the tier 8 medium tanks in WoT, a pretty good analog to this game's cruisers - only one matches or exceeds the price of 45 dollars. The majority are just over 30. So, I'm left to wonder what went into Prinz that makes it so super special that it cost's that much money. I'm all for speedy crew training - I'd rather see it in the form of accelerated training like the other two games but crew trainers are good too. But if it's essentially the tech tree ship, that XP boost isn't really worth the extra 15 dollars we'll call it for the ship. Same applies to Warspite and other ships that are a bit high on price even compared to other's of your companies games. Why is Tirpitz in the same price range as the T8 heavies but cruisers tend to get price hiked it seems? I get limited time offers but they make more sense for things like say Fujin or brief resales on ships considered OP. But on essentially a tech tree clone with a different name and paint that trains crew a bit faster and makes additional xp that's near worthless (sorry Wargaming, but lots of us don't have the money to convert free xp and so that xp on ships might as well be 20-30's deutche marks. I don't have the funds to convert the nearly million free xp I have and it just sits there - which gives both premiums AND tech tree ships less value in my book). 

 

As someone that took a few business classes, and generally did well I might add, a lot of the stuff concerning premium ships seems like tripping over dollars for dimes. Drop the bare bones to 35 and/or put it in the tech tree for dubloons you'll likely see more sales and profit than if you go with what you got because your looking at pricing out buyers. Especially on something that while they won't get the bonuses, they can likely just get a skin for. Fujin at least while being to my knowledge a Minekaze clone was relatively cheap (I simply had no funds at the time) and Tirpitz is different than Bismarck, and the rest are generally unique. I just can't see how it's worth it at that price and I like my historical ships, I was ticked I had no money for Arizona, but it was easier to swallow the idea of 30 than 45.

 

Also, ARP is a bad analogy to this. I'm sorry but again brutal honesty here - anyone that left the game over those ships inclusion is likely someone the community doesn't need. All they really are are free reskins of ships in game, earned from missions, that earn extra credits, and can be turned off so you only see the crazy colours when a player on the other team uses one, if that. Leaving over that is quite frankly, stupid. I didn't see anyone leaving WoT over the tank from "Fury" being in game, after being sold for money in the shop. Pretty much everything about this Prinz Eugene bit - Whole different can of worms, that bite, and is filled with nitroglycerin. The community in large has seemed to feel the ship is overpriced, can't disagree with them. And I get it, sometimes you have to go with innovation that may annoy people and drive some away. But, I'm going to take a wild guess that pretty much every other time you've offered a bundle, the majority went for the bare bones ship because honestly, the modernizations aren't really worth real money and neither are credits. And because most of us probably can't drop that money on a whim because we make little - no money so opt for the cheapest. Now, factor that in, the current climate in the country for the last several years between haves and have nots (occupy movement, water usage in the western US where theres a drought and using excessive water but hey "they paid for it", etc), and the debates on the fine line of "what determines P2W"and the like how would you not see a massive backlash coming from that group? You mention how some tactics look bad in comparison to history and expectations - this is one of them. Now, how it looks from the outside, a little debatable but regardless - that shouldn't even be a thing because sure, a third party might see that from the outside, but what should be considered is what does your customer see, because they are the ones who will either spend money, not spend money, or take the money elsewhere. Theres calculated risk, which ARP ships generally I think can fall under, and then there is just bad decisions and risks - this tends to fall under the that.

 

And I have watched similar things happen in Warplanes, and because they got to a point they've turned even some of their staunchest supporters against them with bad decisions, bad risks, and the like, have watched that game sink under the weight of them. This game has had some issues and missteps that have turned pretty ugly in a hurry, especially when it comes to things people pay for, such as the Humble Bundle issue last year if I recall correctly. Innovation and new things don't always go over well. You can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs - but it's problematic when you set the stove on fire and then the house because the omelette's gone too. When it comes to money, taking a risk on an innovation needs to be weighed really heavily onto how the consumer is going to respond and how worth it it is to lose or anger them, and is usually better to play it safe.

 

Theres a saying that one angry customer can cost you ten more as they tell people of negative experiences. And in this day and age of social media, it couldn't be more true. 


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