Ranked Meta with German BB's or: How I learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Scharnhorst

[Kelorn]

Hello everyone, I'm Kelorn, co-host of the Warships Podcast (sorry, shameless plug) and this weekend on Teamspeak, some of my clanmates and I were discussing how a future season of Tier 7 Ranked Battles might be influenced by the new T7 German Battleships Scharnhorst and Gneisenau.

 

Before we talk about how things will change, let's state a few aspects of the T7 Ranked Meta as it was in Season 4:

• Destroyers were the most important class, often being the deciding factor in ranked matches.
• Smoking Battleships was essential to their survival and ability to do damage because:
• Both the Nagato and Colorado can and do penetrate each other through the bow and angled belt armor.
• Sitting in smoke either as a DD or a BB was and is dangerous, as it led to eating unnecessary torps.
• Capping and flexibility in mid to late game were needed, but usually difficult to achieve.
• Viable Cruiser play was difficult and limited to the Myoko, Shchors, and Atlanta, all of which had survivability issues.

 

We could probably quibble about some of the aspects of the Ranked Meta I listed, but allow me to clarify that the aspects above were from the Rank 5-2 league. 

So, let's look at the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau and see how they fit into a potential future season:

 

• Both the Scharn and Gneis can and do bounce 16" shells off their 350mm of belt armor, particularly when it's angled. While they can and do take damage directly through the bow, a captain with decent experience can limit this.
• Both ships fire faster than the Colorado and Nagato, allowing shots to be exchanged before/after the other ship has fired, again limiting armor exposure. 
• Both ships carry 2/3rds of their firepower in their front turrets, allowing for fully bow in tactics that the Colorado and Nagato can't afford.
• Both ships are fast, able exceed 30 kts, with excellent maneuverability to dodge torpedoes, and have torpedoes of their own to use against anything within 6 km. I've personally found that DD's can be surprised by their use against them.
• Both ships have excellent long-ranged secondaries (maximum range of 7.56 km), which can take advantage of the manual secondary option. 
• Both ships, though the Scharnhorst moreso, can fulfill the Cruiser role, with a significant survivability advantage, that was conspicuously absent in last season's meta.

 

My conclusion is that the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau will not only be viable in a T7 Ranked meta, but would likely change the meta completely. Both ships allow for aggressive tactics that were unfeasible last season. The Scharnhorst in particular I find to be an extremely capable destroyer hunter. With the changes to AP mechanics and AP normalization, the Scharnhorst can fire AP with just the 6 guns of its forward battery at a DD and do 1/3 to 1/2 of the DD's health with every salvo, while presenting an extraordinarily difficult torpedo target. It presents a danger to enemy battleships through judicious use of HE shells, decent fire chance, and the ability to re-apply fires after a DC is used. It is not unusual for me to get 15-25k damage from fires burning every match. Combine this with the fire spam from DD's and it gets very dangerous. 

 

The downside to the Scharnhorst is that, while it is the superior DD and, arguably, CA hunter, the Gneisenau is a superior anti-battleship platform. The 15-inch guns on the Gneisenau are perfectly capable of penetrating the Colorado and Nagato from any angle. In my experience it is capable of winning a war of attrition against a Colorado or Nagato, and is able to close the range to torpedo either one, while they are unable to respond. 

 

TL,DR: I expect the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau to be the GO-TO battleships for a speculative future season of T7 Ranked Battles.

[poeticmotion]

I was wondering about this; it seemed to me as if Scharn/Gneis would be very useful in competitive play. I hadn't thought through all of your points; mostly it was their capacity to fill the cruiser role while surviving that made me think that, as you referenced. 

[Kilo69]

The extra speed and the gun layout I had planned to try to use both ships in the next ranked.

 

I used mainly my secondary spec'd nagato... and that thing was boss at brawling with proper DD smoke...  nothing like being able to punish any DD within 7.5km with secondaries.  

 

Both German BB's have equal or better secondary setups and with the addition of torps make them very good at pushing into the enemy.

 

 

[Ericson38]

 

 

Who would worry about playing these two ships ? They already dominate the matches I'm in with them, or against. Everyone else tends to rotate around them. Worry ? Hmm.

 

 

[Kelorn]

The extra speed and the gun layout I had planned to try to use both ships in the next ranked.

 

I used mainly my secondary spec'd nagato... and that thing was boss at brawling with proper DD smoke...  nothing like being able to punish any DD within 7.5km with secondaries.  

 

Both German BB's have equal or better secondary setups and with the addition of torps make them very good at pushing into the enemy.

 

 

 

Completely agree, I hated last season, but playing the Scharnhorst would make me happy =)

[Kelorn]

 

 

Who would worry about playing these two ships ? They already dominate the matches I'm in with them, or against. Everyone else tends to rotate around them. Worry ? Hmm.

 

 

 

LOL It's a Dr Strangelove reference for lulz

[Zampy]

It's hard to wiggle when everyone is standing still

[Fedge_123]

I think the OP is spot-on with his assessment of these two ships in ranked battles.  Assuming next season is again Tier VII, the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau might be the best battleship options.  One other small note that could be significant - Atlanta now has radar.  That small change may negate some of the hide-in-smoke technique that was so prevelant last season.  And let's not forget about the Flint!  It should make for some interesting games ...

[Taichunger]

Hello everyone, I'm Kelorn, co-host of the Warships Podcast (sorry, shameless plug) and this weekend on Teamspeak, some of my clanmates and I were discussing how a future season of Tier 7 Ranked Battles might be influenced by the new T7 German Battleships Scharnhorst and Gneisenau.

 

• Viable Cruiser play was difficult and limited to the Myoko, Shchors, and Atlanta, all of which had survivability issues.

•  

 

Haha no. I had a 69% win rate and 51K average damage in Molotov, and I was often a strong influence on team success. Nor was I the only one...

[Kelorn]

 

Haha no. I had a 69% win rate and 51K average damage in Molotov, and I was often a strong influence on team success. Nor was I the only one...

 

I honestly didn't see many Molotov's in the Rank 5-2 tier, so I can't say how much they'd affect things. Having played one after the Ranked Season ended, I agree it's a good ship, if a little squishy =)

[Taichunger]

Lots of new premium ships coming in at T6-7 -- Dunkerque as well, and the Leningrad is slated for T7, I hear. 

[pwadoc]

The ranked meta is determined by the fact that the current state of BB/CA balance makes it incredible difficult to play well as a CA. This leads to a proliferation of DDs. The fact that the Scharnhorst is even better at killing CAs than the Colorado and Nagato are will only exacerbate this problem.

[Kelorn]

Lots of new premium ships coming in at T6-7 -- Dunkerque as well, and the Leningrad is slated for T7, I hear. 

 

Dunkerque is out today, but that'd be death in a T7 ranked match

[Kelorn]

The ranked meta is determined by the fact that the current state of BB/CA balance makes it incredible difficult to play well as a CA. This leads to a proliferation of DDs. The fact that the Scharnhorst is even better at killing CAs than the Colorado and Nagato are will only exacerbate this problem.

 

Agreed, but the Scharnhorst can play the cruiser role, and it should NOT be underestimated as a DD hunter