metalhualer5165

German carriers will they be added

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I was toying with the idea of escort carriers, battlecruisers (cough cough sharnhorst), destroyer escorts, and heavy cruisers/ light cruisers. Realistically escort carriers had a limited number of planes so new balancing would need to be created. Maybe for every regular carrier two escort carriers? Escort carrier gameplay could be focused around supporting one specific area instead of the tradition "everywhere" carrier support. Battlecruisers could be played like pocket battleships that are exelent cruiser hunters. Cruisers could be split into light and heavy cruisers each having their respective role. Destroyer escorts could have detection ranges of around 5 kilometers and have radar jam/ radar intercept abilities. They would play like scouts and get bonuses for spotting. Radar jam would decrease the detection range of all ships that can be detected by the destroyer escort using that ability by 25%. Radar intercept would intercept the radio of any ship within a 10 kilometer radius of the destroyer escort and alow the team to see what those ships see. Therefore any ship that is detectible by that enemy ship. Kind of confusing, sounded better in my head.


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To to balance the low detection range on Destroyer Escorted the guns would be trash and the torps wouldn't threten BBs, only cruisers.


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Finally got to the paper. Here it is. Warning, small wall of text. And yes, I did involve german carriers.

Tier                                    Name                                    Aircraft Held                                    #of squads

 

 

                                    British Carriers

                                    (I think squads of 8)

 

4                                    HMS Eagle                        25-30 (possible upgrade)                        2

 

5                                    Illustrious                        36-57 (possible upgrade)                        2

 

6                                    Courageous                        48                                                            2

 

7                                    Audacious                        60                                                            3

 

8                                    HMS Ark Royal            72 (50-72 possible upgrade)            3

 

9                                    Implacable                        81                                                            4

 

10                                    Malta                                    108 (80-108 possible upgrade)            4

 

 

                                    French carriers

                                    (I think squads of 2)

 

4                                    HMS Biter                        21                                                            6

 

5                                    Bearn                                    35-40             (possible upgrade)                        9

 

6                                    Joffre                                    40                                                            9

 

7                                    Clemenceau                        40-60                                                            12

 

8                                    Charles De Gaulle            40-60 (really good planes)                        12

 

9                                    Verdun Prototype            90-105 (possible upgrade)                        15

 

10                                    Verdun                        120 [or 136(midway amount)]            15

 

 

 

                                    German Carriers

                                    (I think squads of 10)

 

4                                    Jade                                    24                                                            2

 

5                                    Ausonia                        23-30                                                            2

 

6                                    Graf Zeppelin                        42(to 43)                                                2

 

7                                    Europa                        42-65                                                            2

 

8

 

9

 

10

 

This looks promising.


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Well i love the idea of having Deutschland carriers so i contacted customer supoort, they said they will send it into consideration and i really hope they do, even if they are just premium 


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Well i love the idea of having Deutschland carriers so i contacted customer supoort, they said they will send it into consideration and i really hope they do, even if they are just premium 

^ I can agree. I believe one player did ask WG to put Graf Zeppelin as a premium ship. 


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^ I can agree. I believe one player did ask WG to put Graf Zeppelin as a premium ship. 

 

Well, if it's that easy...:trollface:

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Well the Graf will appear as a Premium ship in 2017 according to news reports over the past few days. Who will actually buy one?


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Well the Graf will appear as a Premium ship in 2017 according to news reports over the past few days. Who will actually buy one?

 

Well I will buy 1. I don't know anyone else? 

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Well I will buy 1. I don't know anyone else? 

 

Depends on her schtick.  If its something unique and cool I'll probably pick her up.  If she's bog standard I'll probably pass.

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Well the Graf will appear as a Premium ship in 2017 according to news reports over the past few days. Who will actually buy one?

 

Me! Me! Me! I love my new Debit Card and job. So much freedom.

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There are rumors from WG(or my crazed mind, don't know for sure) about the Tech Tree we can expect. IIRC it was:

 

Tier 4: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 5: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 6: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 7: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 8: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 9: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 10: Graf Zeppelin

 

Tier 8 Premium: Graf Zeppelin


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There are rumors from WG(or my crazed mind, don't know for sure) about the Tech Tree we can expect. IIRC it was:

 

Tier 4: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 5: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 6: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 7: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 8: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 9: Graf Zeppelin

Tier 10: Graf Zeppelin

 

Tier 8 Premium: Graf Zeppelin

Ur going mind going crazed. We all agree on tier 8. And on the Elbe & the seydlitz we still discussion on tier.


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Well thank you for being very positive of my action

 

​Ur Welcome.

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Wargaming are you planning on adding German carriers to WoWs in a line or a premium ship. If anyone else thinks that German carriers may be a good idea to add this ship class to the German tech tree in a premium or a line let's talk about it. I think that adding German CVs will add more diversity to WoWs in gameplay and choices of every player in the game.

 

Why do you all keep asking for this?.. there were less than 10 of them ever " designed "  wouldn't even be enough for a Tree.

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Why do you all keep asking for this?.. there were less than 10 of them ever " designed "  wouldn't even be enough for a Tree.

 

​^ I somewhat agree to what has said.

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That is a very good way of thinking of the tier system something different than tier 4 to 10. Tier 5 to 10 or Tier 6 to 10 CVs for the germans would be something different.

 

​I too, believe  A German CV line would be an addition to the game. As, it was modeled after the blitzkrieg stile of tactics employed by the Germans, Had it been carried out as intended. There may have been a few surprises.

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crappy bi plane of course, at least its realistic and not fiction.

with your line of thinking,American CVs should have P-51 mustangs and P-47s

while the IJN could also get N1k1s and Ki 67s

ohh yeah and while we are at it

if a RN CV comes to play lets put tempests and moquitoes on it just for [edited]n giggles. :facepalm:

 

Google Sea Mosquitos

google Sea Furies


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So? How many of those would fit the tier system? How would you balance them? I've seen that list, but I've also seen how many of these classes were very similar to each other. And what RN carrier can hope to challenge Midway or the IJN Tier 10, other than a paper one (I don't know how to spell its name)?

 

The in-game IJN tier 10 is fantasy anyway

The real Taiho paper upgrade design simply added two more twin heavy AA mounts and about 4m extra length

Malta and CVA01 were paper ships in Midway's league

 


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If you look at the RN CVs, then you get just as many paper ships as the Russian Cruiser line, or about 3 or 4. The reason is that the war in the Atlantic was significantly shorter than the war in the Pacific AND mostly based on anti-submarine warfare, thus, there was less pressure to actually build the designs they made.

 

wow, you have invented a new kind of math

Battle of Atlantic 1939 - 45 shorter than 1942 - 45?

Really?

 

The carrier involvement in the Battle of the Atlantic started with the carrier anti-submarine hunter-killer groups of 1939 including HMS Courageous, and ended in 45 with the escort carrier hunter-killer groups. In between was the anti-raider / anti-blockade runner / convoy escort and Bismark/Tirpitz strike ops. 

No carrier-v-carrier as Germany and Italy never finished building any.


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Well, the Argus at Tier 4, the Glorious at Tier 5, the Ark Royal at Tier 6,  the Illustrious at Tier 7, the Implacable at Tier 8, the Colossus at Tier 9, and the Audacious at Tier 10. Does that work for you? Also, the Royal Navy was in the pacific, but not in large numbers compared to the USN and the IJN.

 

 

 

 

 

Colossus was a light fleet carrier, same league as Independence and Saipan (tho built as a carrir from bottup-up, not a cruiser conversion)

Audacious was a design contemporary to Essex, though as Britain was under uboat and air siege their build rate was slow (light fleets given higher priority to get more hulls into water faster)

Malta was the design contemporary to Midway, but rebuilding London and other cities broke the economy

 


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The problem is that they can't field near the number of aircraft that the IJN and USN have in-reserve. The Ranger has more aircraft than the Audacious. And, at that tier, it's not about how well-armored your carrier is, it's a great deal about how many squads you can control and how many reserves you can field to replace your losses.

 

yeah, the simplistic carrier mechanics cant handle much more than US, IJN carrier doctrine.

There is no way to accommodate RN night / foul weather torpedo strike doctrine, for example.

There is no way to accommodate the force-multiplying effect of the RN invention of radar fighter direction.

Nor does it take into account the need for accurate sighting reports (why the RN wanted navigators on most of its aircraft)

The Illustrious types could be good DD killers, though, with their 16x 4.5s that could shoot over the deck...

Dont expect much from armour decks tho given Taiho, and I am sure the fire-resistance of the enclosed hangars wont suit any 'flavour' WoWS desires to give the RN.

And kamikazes arent modelled either (fortunately for the Essexes)

So yeah, better the RN carriers arent introduced to such limited mechanics

 

As for Graf Zeppelin's air wing, it depends on the carrier's tier obviously

Given her design was based on a tour of the HMS Corageous/Glorious, I dont expect it to be all that high.

Therefore 109Ts, ju87Cs and the fiesler biplanes.

This was contemporary to the F3F/Dauntless/Devastator and Fulmar/Albacore (1940-41)

Italy's Aquilia could justify a higher tier given the work on converting fighter-bombers for her...


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