Co-op good DD training?

[Cruiser_CleveAniki]

If there's two things I learned from co-op, they were the AI dodges torps very well, and they hate DDs with a righteous burning fury. I've found those translated into good training for being a PvP DD captain. Anyone else have similar experiences?

[AVR_Project]

Absolutely!

If you can survive a PvE destroyer battle, you will clobber everyone in PvP.

Besides, Co_Op is more fun, and these are toys.  It's not like the bots get butt-hurt over losing...

[alexf24]

I do. I play more PvP but I play coop a lot and DDs are my main class.

 

They avoid torps like a boss (or they cheat , I'm not sure as sometimes they do it too well).

 

They target you no matter what. You may be further away and not their immediate threat. They  may be in a knife fight for their lives 1v2, yet they see a DD within range and they switch to you. Silly.

 

I use this to our teams advantage sometimes They are so stupid, they will leave capping - and winning - to chase you. All you have to do to get them to stop capping your only base (Standard mode), is to show yourself to them and start running. They will leave capping and run after you.

 

As training? Yes and no. It is no fun to be targeted by several bots at the same time. You sometimes die fast and early. I see it as evasion training. If I die in Coop early, and do very low in WTR, so what? It's Coop!

 

Training to shoot back while running, and get some hits, be it IJN DD, or USN DD, or what have you, is good training and comes in handy . These are not my complaints.

 

My only complaint in Coop is the bots are too stupid in lower tiers. They have improved. They don't beach themselves at every opportunity as they used to. Remember? They shoot and not hit for the first two or three shots, till they get the range. That is ok. They do not talk back or spam the F-Keys constantly. That's a bonus. What they do wrong is they are too predictable. You know once you play certain maps too often, what they will do and where to expect them. This has to be randomized a bit.

[Cruiser_CleveAniki]

I'm personally pretty sure the AI "sees" (technically they see everything all the time) torps long before they should, and some kind of fudging of the rudder shift numbers happens. Either way, it's ended up meaning I'm doing oddly well with my Hatsuharu.

[Moksie]

Never take an IJN DD into co op bro.

[Cruiser_CleveAniki]

Never take an IJN DD into co op bro.

Eh. Let's just say I have kinks a certain way . IJN DD training in co-op felt rewarding for me.

[AVR_Project]

Never take an IJN DD into co op bro.

 

One Co-Op battle, one 'human' brought a Kamakaze-R into Co-op - and went AFK

That thing killed off all our team, and half of it's own.

[1nv4d3rZ1m]

I found the opposite, especially at higher tiers the co-op AI treats DDs very differently from pvp and that means a very different play style is needed to succeed. 

 

The bots always target DDs that are spotted and do dodge torps but they always react exactly the same way so if you figure out the patterns you can abuse it to get torp hits and do things that would get you killed in pvp. 

[Moksie]

Eh. Let's just say I have kinks a certain way . IJN DD training in co-op felt rewarding for me.

 

​And they called me a masochist for taking a Mut through ranked.....

My hats off to you sir.  I am impressed.  I still wake up in the middle of the night with bad dreams of testing a DD in co op.

[Cruiser_CleveAniki]

 

​And they called me a masochist for taking a Mut through ranked.....

My hats off to you sir.  I am impressed.  I still wake up in the middle of the night with bad dreams of testing a DD in co op.

Try being a Sims determined to test your naval mines.

[Special_Kay]

It depends completely upon what kind of destroyer you're playing. If you're there to cut your teeth, you're going to learn sloppy lessons from a long-range torpedo boat (I'm talking 10km+), and you're not going to learn much at all from a gunship. When you're in a destroyer in a random battle, there is almost always someone on the enemy team trying to deduce your next move. When you're a gunship destroyer playing against a torpedo-centric destroyer, you should be that person. You're never going to come out of a losing encounter with a bot destroyer and gain insight from how it found you—it was just sailing to the objectives, choosing from visible targets to attack. Nor will you learn how to track human destroyers who wish to remain unseen by ambushing bots.

 

It's a great place to learn how to dodge while pretending you're a mini-cruiser, though—sit back at range and pepper the bots and they will challenge your dodging skills far better than most humans.

[HazardDrake]

No. The AI cheats in regards to torps. You can test this yourself.

 

Aim at a bot with the lead indicator, note where the indicator is pointed. Now press whatever button you have to change targets and fire where the inicator was. Torps will hit every time. Fire at a bot when they are selected? They'll almost always turn right after or soon after you fire your torps.

 

In co-op you'll start relying on the bots predictability rather than trying to anticipate what might happen with an unpredictable human opponent.

[yUPPatriots]

No. 

 

Gratz on your 3 games in pve

 

 

 

[Nachoo31]

I clicked in this weekend on PVE  in my fujin.. went to a cap.  There was 4 AI dds..  Just say I didn't dodge the torps.

[Estimated_Prophet]

Thing I've noticed in co-op CV play is that the carriers are better opponents than some of my human opponents in PvP. You can still learn bad habits, but it seems amazing that the enemy fighter(s) always 'just happen' to show up as soon as mine fly off to do something else.

 

I'm almost 100% certain the AI CVs cheat as well with squadron respawns after destruction...

 

Shot a fighter squadron down within sight of a bot CV as my torpys were going in for the attack; before the torpys could even get any closer to launch their attack, here comes the 4-plane enemy fighter squad off it's carrier, respawned in less time than should be possible. Of course I thought the torpys were 'safe' and was sending my fighters back to rearm... Some serious WTH is this baloney???

[Sloth_Like_Reflexes]

Play them in lower tier randoms to learn them.  I know the play style is different at lower tiers, but co-op won't teach you destroyer tactics at all.

[Fletcher7_1944]

I do. I play more PvP but I play coop a lot and DDs are my main class.

 

They avoid torps like a boss (or they cheat , I'm not sure as sometimes they do it too well).

 

They target you no matter what. You may be further away and not their immediate threat. They  may be in a knife fight for their lives 1v2, yet they see a DD within range and they switch to you. Silly.

 

I use this to our teams advantage sometimes They are so stupid, they will leave capping - and winning - to chase you. All you have to do to get them to stop capping your only base (Standard mode), is to show yourself to them and start running. They will leave capping and run after you.

 

As training? Yes and no. It is no fun to be targeted by several bots at the same time. You sometimes die fast and early. I see it as evasion training. If I die in Coop early, and do very low in WTR, so what? It's Coop!

 

Training to shoot back while running, and get some hits, be it IJN DD, or USN DD, or what have you, is good training and comes in handy . These are not my complaints.

 

My only complaint in Coop is the bots are too stupid in lower tiers. They have improved. They don't beach themselves at every opportunity as they used to. Remember? They shoot and not hit for the first two or three shots, till they get the range. That is ok. They do not talk back or spam the F-Keys constantly. That's a bonus. What they do wrong is they are too predictable. You know once you play certain maps too often, what they will do and where to expect them. This has to be randomized a bit.

 

To be honest, you can do that trick in ANY ship.   Simply turn away and "run"- they're like dogs, they cannot resist chasing something that runs from them.   If they're busy, shoot at them, THEN run.  Works every time!   I've had them chase me all over the map- while still shooting at my teammates, and NOT at me!   Even though I was delivering serious punishment via my stern guns or torpedoes...

 

  I, too, have seen that torpedo spotting cheat.  I also routinely see them instantly reload their DC party and put out a fire- seconds after they put out another or stopped a flood.  Or reload torpedo tubes long before they should ( I'm driving the same exact ship, and fired on them at the same time- my tubes are still 60+ seconds from reloading, and they just sent more at me.)   They can also rotate their turrets faster.

 

  According to the Devs, co-op bots have ZERO captain skills, and the modules and upgrades are random.  Don't ask me what thread I saw that in, but I KNOW I read that recently.  ( darn crs, lol)  I believe it was in someone's comment who had a link to the dev answer.

 

  It's been a good while since I played DD, and have been holding off because of threads like these, and from my own observation of how the bots act.   I don't recall being singled out any more than anyone else- but that could just be because I suck so bad at DD even the bots don't consider me a threat, lol.

 

  It does seem weirdly random, though.  How they respond.  Sometimes they come AT me in mass- no matter where I go to on the map- that's where the ships I LEAST wanted to meet went.  I'ts like they knew just where MY ship went, and are under orders to intercept and sink it.   I simply cannot get unengaged in those matches- they attack aggressively from everywhere.   Other matches, no matter what I do, the bots ignore me- it's someone else's turn in the barrel.   Then I can get cits and torpedo hits up the wazoo.

[SPACEDUDE71]

lower tier pve are easy for dds to TRUMP.

higher tiers and the ai gets more skilled.

 

if u are grinding to another ship. u are wasting effort in pve. u get alot less xp in pve.

[Edgecase]

I managed to accidentally torp 2 destroyers I didn't even know about while aiming at a battleship in Assault Mode on the PTS. The BB also got hit. Apparently having 16 ships on a team means it gets pretty crowded in there.

 

Does random modules mean you get to fight DDs that take the premium torp cooldown consumable?

[HazardDrake]

 

Gratz on your 3 games in pve on the live server

 

 

 

 

Fixed that for ya.