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PFCWilliams

Blows my mind anyone thinks Cruisers are "fine" up to tier 6 at least

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Speed and maneuverability of a DD, HE DPM higher than any BB (except on lucky 1/100  citadel crits). 

 

The dominate DD, they dominate BB.  They can easily stay at range of BB and dance in between shells, they can run down a DD unless the DD stays in in a straight line away from the cruiser, and then the cruiser will just rain down shells with 7 second reloads on the DD.  

-7% chance of fire on a BB is a complete joke when your getting hit by 50+ HE shells a minute.  If for some reason you get in close to a cruiser it will put torps into you before you can fire a second salve.  And how the [edited]can any cruiser take a full salvo from a BB close range and not take at least half its health in damage???

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Low tier cruisers are my favorite food!  Unless they are really mobile, and dodge very well, they have an expected lifetime of 2-4 salvos from my BB.  Most of the worst range issues were fixed by the aft nerf.  There are still a couple of outliers (Ishizuchi has a too short range, and Murmansk is brutal with the spotter).  Seriously though, cruisers at low tiers are very strong because they are generalists, but they are not dominating.  Skill wins out over ship class. :)

 

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All these issues can be solved by playing smarter and aiming better. When a cruiser has basically run up to you, shooting and then torping you while you're in your BB, what is actually happening is a better player has taken advantage of your unawareness and inability to aim.

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As people start with cruisers and more familiar with cruisers play in low tiers, newer players generally do better with cruisers than other classes. Low tiers BB and DD require some learning curve for new players to adapt. But for a more experienced player, there should not be a problem fighting a cruiser. For myself, I had no issue one shot blow up any cruisers up to tier 5 with my S. Carolina, when I wen seal clubbing. And Umimaze is just so fun.

Edited by Takamachi_Nanoha_sg

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All these issues can be solved by playing smarter and aiming better. When a cruiser has basically run up to you, shooting and then torping you while you're in your BB, what is actually happening is a better player has taken advantage of your unawareness and inability to aim.

 

Nothing but [edited]answers from a-holes.....

 

1.  Cruisers are much faster and maneuverable than a BB, it's not always possible to keep them away from you, if Wargaming thought that was possible they would not put Torps on cruisers.  And even when they are right on you they can survive long enough to put torps into you because putting 3 salvos into a cruisers side at point blank range is not enough unless you get that magic roll. 

2. How am I suppose to "aim better" when my shot is dead on, but dispersion throws them all of the place and I watch a full salvo land to either side of a cruiser missing by inches

3. If your reliable hitting anyone but a brain dead player in a cruiser at full range with BB you are either using aim mods or lying. 

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Nothing but [edited]answers from a-holes.....

 

1.  Cruisers are much faster and maneuverable than a BB, it's not always possible to keep them away from you, if Wargaming thought that was possible they would not put Torps on cruisers.  And even when they are right on you they can survive long enough to put torps into you because putting 3 salvos into a cruisers side at point blank range is not enough unless you get that magic roll. 

2. How am I suppose to "aim better" when my shot is dead on, but dispersion throws them all of the place and I watch a full salvo land to either side of a cruiser missing by inches

3. If your reliable hitting anyone but a brain dead player in a cruiser at full range with BB you are either using aim mods or lying. 

 

Yet BB's still rule the stats....go figure....

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 The only scenario where cruisers become deadly to a BB is when I'm being abandoned by friendly cruisers that either had enough or saw a squirrel and decide to wander somewhere else, 2-3 CAs hammering away on an unescorted BB can indeed melt him down before the BB gets to punish them.

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Nothing but [edited]answers from a-holes.....

 

1.  Cruisers are much faster and maneuverable than a BB, it's not always possible to keep them away from you, if Wargaming thought that was possible they would not put Torps on cruisers.  And even when they are right on you they can survive long enough to put torps into you because putting 3 salvos into a cruisers side at point blank range is not enough unless you get that magic roll. 

2. How am I suppose to "aim better" when my shot is dead on, but dispersion throws them all of the place and I watch a full salvo land to either side of a cruiser missing by inches

3. If your reliable hitting anyone but a brain dead player in a cruiser at full range with BB you are either using aim mods or lying. 

 

hmmmmm.
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Battleships reach their full potential at tier 6. Up until that point they are fodder for good cruiser players (and occasionally a nemesis for the bad ones). In the hands of an average player (and I do mean average in a good sense), cruisers below tier 6 are perhaps the easiest ship type to do consistently well with.

 

All of this changes with Kongo/NY and especially Fuso/NM. These ships are so powerful and such an overwhelming presence that the power creep in cruisers is simply not keeping up at this point. This trend, with some exceptions, remains true up to tier 10.

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Nothing but [edited]answers from a-holes.....

 

1.  Cruisers are much faster and maneuverable than a BB, it's not always possible to keep them away from you, if Wargaming thought that was possible they would not put Torps on cruisers.  And even when they are right on you they can survive long enough to put torps into you because putting 3 salvos into a cruisers side at point blank range is not enough unless you get that magic roll. 

2. How am I suppose to "aim better" when my shot is dead on, but dispersion throws them all of the place and I watch a full salvo land to either side of a cruiser missing by inches

3. If your reliable hitting anyone but a brain dead player in a cruiser at full range with BB you are either using aim mods or lying. 

 

You obviously don't get it. A BB can one shot a cruiser easily. I do it all the time. You have to learn how to play better. There are numerous videos online that can help you. 

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Unless you don't know how to aim or are alone, low tier cruisers fear battleships like it's their job. The cruisers have no armor to speak of, and most don't have guns with high alpha damage.

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Battleships reach their full potential at tier 6. Up until that point they are fodder for good cruiser players (and occasionally a nemesis for the bad ones). In the hands of an average player (and I do mean average in a good sense), cruisers below tier 6 are perhaps the easiest ship type to do consistently well with.

 

All of this changes with Kongo/NY and especially Fuso/NM. These ships are so powerful and such an overwhelming presence that the power creep in cruisers is simply not keeping up at this point. This trend, with some exceptions, remains true up to tier 10.

 

I would somewhat disagree. Yes, cruisers can be played well but I always found cruisers, especially those that think they can take on a BB all by themselves., easy pickings. Many CA captains will give you enough time to delete them because they either try to close the distance for a torp run or they are so busy spamming HE that as soon as the get around 6-8Km, they get a face full of AP and down they go. 

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Nothing but [edited]answers from a-holes.....

 

1.  Cruisers are much faster and maneuverable than a BB, it's not always possible to keep them away from you, if Wargaming thought that was possible they would not put Torps on cruisers.  And even when they are right on you they can survive long enough to put torps into you because putting 3 salvos into a cruisers side at point blank range is not enough unless you get that magic roll. 

2. How am I suppose to "aim better" when my shot is dead on, but dispersion throws them all of the place and I watch a full salvo land to either side of a cruiser missing by inches

3. If your reliable hitting anyone but a brain dead player in a cruiser at full range with BB you are either using aim mods or lying. 

 

Aren't you just a shining beacon of light and polite manners.  

 

Since you want people to be a-holes, here's my contribution.  

 

#GitGudLTPn00BWASDhaxOP.  

 

 

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You obviously don't get it. A BB can one shot a cruiser easily. I do it all the time. You have to learn how to play better. There are numerous videos online that can help you. 

 

I was in a match today, two cruisers very close to me, they did not use torps for whatever reason.  Took minimum three salvos from my NY to kill either of them.  Very close range using AP and HE.  The only time a BB one shots a cruiser in Tier 5 or lower is on a lucky roll, seems to be 1/30 honestly.  

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Nothing but [edited]answers from a-holes.....

 

1.  Cruisers are much faster and maneuverable than a BB, it's not always possible to keep them away from you, if Wargaming thought that was possible they would not put Torps on cruisers.  And even when they are right on you they can survive long enough to put torps into you because putting 3 salvos into a cruisers side at point blank range is not enough unless you get that magic roll. 

2. How am I suppose to "aim better" when my shot is dead on, but dispersion throws them all of the place and I watch a full salvo land to either side of a cruiser missing by inches

3. If your reliable hitting anyone but a brain dead player in a cruiser at full range with BB you are either using aim mods or lying. 

 

1.  You have to learn who are the most important to shoot first and sometimes, you don't waste a whole volley on one ship, but discourage a couple of them from coming at you.

2.  Dispersion at low tiers can be annoying, but sadly, it's part of the learning curve.

3.  Their are many players who have accused me of cheating (the ones that don't pay attention and drive in straight lines), but after way too many hours of playing the game, I can usually do a pretty good amount of damage in my BB's, even if dispersion/rng isn't always in my favor.

 

If you're in the stock hull of any BB, you will have issues, and tier 3 and 4's, well, they are tier 3 and 4's.

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You obviously don't get it. A BB can one shot a cruiser easily. I do it all the time. You have to learn how to play better. There are numerous videos online that can help you. 

 

Yeah, you can one shot a cruiser easily if the RNG God lets you.

I have shot at bad drivers,(going on straight lines no even changing speed) and seen perfectly aimed shots land all around them and the next salvo hitting like crazy and causing little or no damage. The cruisers have the advantage that with faster reloads they can put more shells in the air and negate that effect.

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I was in a match today, two cruisers very close to me, they did not use torps for whatever reason.  Took minimum three salvos from my NY to kill either of them.  Very close range using AP and HE.  The only time a BB one shots a cruiser in Tier 5 or lower is on a lucky roll, seems to be 1/30 honestly.  

 

So you are hitting them at the waterline, with the shells penetrating right underneath the stacks?  Most cruisers can bounce/deflect shells if they hold a good angle, until higher tiers, but you can get cits on the waterline if they are directly straight on to, or you can break their guns that are facing you.

 

Your other options are to get a friend who plays a CA, and another who plays a DD, and you all cover each other in a division.

Edited by wuvgun

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Aren't you just a shining beacon of light and polite manners.  

 

Since you want people to be a-holes, here's my contribution.  

 

#GitGudLTPn00BWASDhaxOP.  

 

 

 

His reply was garbage and was rude in of itself and deserved my reply back.   And what have you contributed to this thread that actually has to do with the thread?   IF you have no helpful advice that has to do with the actual subject matter, don't reply.  

 

Edited by PFCWilliams

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Nothing but [edited]answers from a-holes.....

 

1.  Cruisers are much faster and maneuverable than a BB, it's not always possible to keep them away from you, if Wargaming thought that was possible they would not put Torps on cruisers.  And even when they are right on you they can survive long enough to put torps into you because putting 3 salvos into a cruisers side at point blank range is not enough unless you get that magic roll. 

2. How am I suppose to "aim better" when my shot is dead on, but dispersion throws them all of the place and I watch a full salvo land to either side of a cruiser missing by inches

3. If your reliable hitting anyone but a brain dead player in a cruiser at full range with BB you are either using aim mods or lying. 

 

If you really think you're aiming perfectly but dispersion is making you miss at ranges where a cruiser could be threatening you with torpedoes, I have some bad news for you:  You're actually not aiming correctly. 

 

It does not take a "magic roll" to deal devastating damage to a cruiser, or even sink it outright, with a single salvo from a BB at medium to short range.  This is especially true when you consider that you don't need very many of the shells to hit.  A single BB round in the citadel knocks off more than 1/3 of most cruisers' hitpoints.  2 citadel hits plus a couple of overpenetrations will destroy a cruiser in a single salvo.  If you can't pretty consistently deliver devastating salvos to cruisers that expose their broadsides to you at 12 km or less, you need to improve your aim.

 

Long-range gunnery in BB's is different.  The maximum range of BB's is several km farther than they can get reasonably tight dispersion, so if you're attempting to hit someone at long range you're going to get inconsistent results regardless of how good your aim is.  Still, though, BB shells have high enough velocity that even at 16+ km it's not trivial for a cruiser to dodge them, and one shell into the citadel is still a huge percentage of their hitpoints, so any cruiser letting a BB take repeated shots at them is gambling with their life, even from long range, and they'll need a lot of salvos to kill you.

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His reply was garbage and was rude in of itself and deserved my reply back.   And what have you contributed to this thread that actually has to do with the thread?   IF you have no helpful advice that has to do with the actual subject matter, don't reply.  

 

 

Hmmmmmm X2....
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My Ark Beta thinks low tier CAs are fine. 

 

Fine Citadels, perfectly aged, with a hint of salt...  :B

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His reply was garbage and was rude in of itself and deserved my reply back.   And what have you contributed to this thread that actually has to do with the thread?   IF you have no helpful advice that has to do with the actual subject matter, don't reply.  

 

 

My reply was spot on.  The guy gave you advice.  It just didn't fit your narrative of how bad you have it, so you were rude to him.  Here's my advice.  Earn to shoot.  Learn to use AP.  Learn to angle your ship.  Learn to change speed and direction.  Master those and you can be a badass.  Or just whine and rant about Omaha's and Furutaka's being OP.

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If you really think you're aiming perfectly but dispersion is making you miss at ranges where a cruiser could be threatening you with torpedoes, I have some bad news for you:  You're actually not aiming correctly. 

 

 

No, not at close range,  I thought that would be understood to be implied.  I hate having to spell out every single detail of a scenario.  If dispersion is a factor it's at LONG range. 

 

It does not take a "magic roll" to deal devastating damage to a cruiser, or even sink it outright, with a single salvo from a BB at medium to short range.  This is especially true when you consider that you don't need very many of the shells to hit.  A single BB round in the citadel knocks off more than 1/3 of most cruisers' hitpoints.  2 citadel hits plus a couple of overpenetrations will destroy a cruiser in a single salvo.  If you can't pretty consistently deliver devastating salvos to cruisers that expose their broadsides to you at 12 km or less, you need to improve your aim.

 

I have shot cruisers close range on many occasions into the citadel and watch them take 5K damage. 

 

Long-range gunnery in BB's is different.  The maximum range of BB's is several km farther than they can get reasonably tight dispersion, so if you're attempting to hit someone at long range you're going to get inconsistent results regardless of how good your aim is.  Still, though, BB shells have high enough velocity that even at 16+ km it's not trivial for a cruiser to dodge them, and one shell into the citadel is still a huge percentage of their hitpoints, so any cruiser letting a BB take repeated shots at them is gambling with their life, even from long range, and they'll need a lot of salvos to kill you.

 

Yes it is trivial for a cruiser to dodge at long range, give me a break, it's like you're syaing the sky is green, I do it all the time myself.  

Again I have hit cruisers at long range many times and watch them take minimal damage, and this morning I shot a cruiser at mediem range and most of my salvo hit and I one shotted him, but that's because I got the magic lucky roll. 

Yes it does take many salvos from a cruiser to kill a BB, but the have the speed and maneuverability over a BB to keep themselves at range and easily dodge the BB's shots.  I literally just came from a match where I was doing that in a Phoenix. 

 

 

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My reply was spot on.  The guy gave you advice.  It just didn't fit your narrative of how bad you have it, so you were rude to him.  Here's my advice.  Earn to shoot.  Learn to use AP.  Learn to angle your ship.  Learn to change speed and direction.  Master those and you can be a badass.  Or just whine and rant about Omaha's and Furutaka's being OP.

 

My murmansk is destroyer of worlds.

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My reply was spot on.  The guy gave you advice.  It just didn't fit your narrative of how bad you have it, so you were rude to him.  Here's my advice.  Earn to shoot.  Learn to use AP.  Learn to angle your ship.  Learn to change speed and direction.  Master those and you can be a badass.  Or just whine and rant about Omaha's and Furutaka's being OP.

 

Your reply had nothing to do with the thread subject, so it was not spot on.  His advice amounted to "Duh... you're stupid if you let cruisers get close to you".  Taking what cane easily happen in game, cruisers getting close to a BB, and twisting it to make it seems like it never happens to anybody and if a cruisers ever does get close to you, then "you bad". 

 

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