Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 20 battles to post in this section.
Wepps

If co-op is supposed to be so difficult....

28 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

373
[AOH]
Members
984 posts
7,157 battles

...why weren't the rewards for playing it boosted?

 

Otherwise what's the point really.

 

 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,661
Alpha Tester, Members, In AlfaTesters, Beta Testers
12,413 posts

It's a lot easier than random so no boost to income needed.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,153
[ARGSY]
Members
10,326 posts
16,228 battles

last time I played coop was with mogami after the nerf with captain reset.     it didn't seem very challenging.    it is place to retrain your captain, learn new ships and such.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
4,886 posts

It's a lot easier than random so no boost to income needed.

 

coop badly needs its repair cost to be lowered like its income is lowered, right now it's a hand twisting machine to make you spend doubloons more for captain retraining and free xp conversion

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,622
[-KIA-]
Senior Volunteer Moderator, Beta Testers, Supertester, Privateers, Senior Volunteer Moderator
6,550 posts
8,491 battles

last time I played coop was with mogami after the nerf with captain reset.     it didn't seem very challenging.    it is place to retrain your captain, learn new ships and such.

 

..O-M-G I forgot about this! I ALWAYS went random with untrained captain.

 

Kill me now.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,661
Alpha Tester, Members, In AlfaTesters, Beta Testers
12,413 posts

 

coop badly needs its repair cost to be lowered like its income is lowered, right now it's a hand twisting machine to make you spend doubloons more for captain retraining and free xp conversion

 

If you are going into the realm of spending money because you are playing co-op, you should probably be playing random battles where rewards are better. Co-op isn't there for you to profit or advance as quickly as random battles so there's no reason to change anything about it.

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39,291
[HINON]
Alpha Tester
27,735 posts
26,570 battles

Even bad players can maintain a 90% W/R in co-op, so no, it's not difficult at all. Not in the least. That's why the rewards are so low, since there's so very little risk.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
4,886 posts

 

If you are going into the realm of spending money because you are playing co-op, you should probably be playing random battles where rewards are better. Co-op isn't there for you to profit or advance as quickly as random battles so there's no reason to change anything about it.

 

it works differently, if you don't want to play stock ships with untrained captains (and for dd an untrained captain without sit. awareness and last stand is nearly unplayable) you either play some coop or spend $$... and wg made it so playing high tier coop is pretty expensive
Edited by bad_arcade_kitty

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,661
Alpha Tester, Members, In AlfaTesters, Beta Testers
12,413 posts

 

it works differently, if you don't want to play stock ships with untrained captains (and for dd an untrained captain without sit. awareness and last stand is nearly unplayable) you either play some coop or spend $$... and wg made it so playing high tier coop is pretty expensive

Co-op in general is expensive as it should be.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,466
[KTKM]
Beta Testers
4,633 posts
4,076 battles

They are considering to work on the co-op mode and make it a bit more interesting.

Personally I hope they just clone AW's PvE mode.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
714
[FLEE]
Members
2,194 posts
4,953 battles

PvE has become MUCH more challenging since the update to 0.5.5.0.

Tiers VI and upwards have become very difficult to win when there are Clevelands, Kutuzovs, Atlantas and Atagos in the fleet.

I've also noticed that they now form groups of three or more, do not appear top follow set paths, hunt you down and don't operate singly.

 

Whereas I could take my Warspite, New Mexico, Kutuzov, Atlanta out for a bit of fun.....no more.
Now I have to work damned hard to survive.

Edited by JervisBay
  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
729
Alpha Tester
2,162 posts
6,770 battles

PvE is sometimes considered hard because the bots have bot gunners so if you don't turn enough they can nail you something serious. And they push, which can scare people.

 

The issue is that its very easy to get lots of damage and win nearly every single time in Co-op so the rewards are reduced significantly because you should outperform yourself and not die which incurs repair costs.

If you are making any money at all in Co-op its probably more than the average tier 8+ pub player. (pre 20% boost*)

I can usually finish a PvE in about 8 minutes or less so if I make 50% or more xp/creds it will be more profitable to spam PvE than PvP, and that is a problem.

 

Point being, Co-op is designed for new players in low tiers, this is a PvP game at its heart. Co-op should never be a money making opportunity as good or more than PvP especially because of the short game times.

 

*thank you much WG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
862
[KNTAI]
[KNTAI]
Alpha Tester, Beta Testers
3,176 posts
7,789 battles

They are considering to work on the co-op mode and make it a bit more interesting.

Personally I hope they just clone AW's PvE mode.

 

If they make PVE scenarios based on historical battles (as in battles that happened IRL), I'd love it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3,640
[WOLF1]
Members
9,915 posts
18,231 battles

 

coop badly needs its repair cost to be lowered like its income is lowered, right now it's a hand twisting machine to make you spend doubloons more for captain retraining and free xp conversion

 

THEN don't PLAY IT .... simple..... or play better at it so you dont lose $$$

I spend $$ for my ships and time. but NEVER for the purpose of playing COOP for more than fun once or twice......SMH

Edited by pmgaudio

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
11,670 posts

 

 

Coop is not supposed to be the bread and butter of this game, PVP is.  Its supposed to be there to test new tactics, ships and just hang out and relax.  The coop rewards maybe low but I am not complaining about it.  

 

If coop is more challenging, then get more coordinated.  Its now training people to get coordinated,  and that supports PvP play as well.  My biggest complaint about PVP is team coordination and support or the lack of it from so many players.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
2,196 posts

...why weren't the rewards for playing it boosted?

 

Otherwise what's the point really.

 

If co-op was supposed to be difficult, people wouldn't have around a 90% win rate in it. If you want full rewards, participate in the full challenge. If you could get normal rewards for less effort, PvP would be much less populated. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3,513
Members
16,315 posts
12,285 battles

Best bet is to buy a cheap premie and retrain in Random. EXP is tons better, credits, signals etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
3,014 posts

I love the new AI in coop now. 

Tough, accurate, aggressive, quick to respond.

Try coop w/the GUI turned off if you really want to spice things up.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
445
[--K--]
Supertester
1,756 posts
21,628 battles

I haven't found it any harder, I did lose money once in the saipan but that was down more to a bad team. 

That being said I prefer to relax in pve mode then bang my head against the wall in pvp. Playing on potato computer that gets major fps problems in pvp doesn't help much either. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
373
[AOH]
Members
984 posts
7,157 battles

I have to say, in the heat of the battle, I often find myself being fooled into thinking there are people driving those ships lol. WHAT AN AI. The programming minds that are behind this are phenomenal!

 

But it is simple logic - increased risk = increased reward. The game was like it was previously for years, now there is a major change to the AI and it is much more difficult. What makes it difficult is that there are a LOT of players not there to play. They rush off and do their own thing. Or are just AFK. Or what happens every other match, the TKer. In the final tally, what seems like an awesome idea may backfire, because you are no longer addressing all the different playstyles, and in the process not adequately rewarding the players for taking part.

 

Now the disclaimer - from day 1 playing this, it was my intention to get in Random. I think I've done it 2 or 3 times and that's it. Why?

 

2200 battles or so, and it always seems I'm working on the commanders' skills, or building the next ship. I never settle into the fight. "Okay on to the next ship." "OMG this ship sucks! On to the next ship." lol My best commander right now is in Hiryu. Level 4. None of them has concealment expert yet.

 

Sorry, I'm not bringing a sub-par ship with a sub-par commander into fights versus PvP experts that own me before I even spot anybody. There is little or no reward in that, and waiting for the ship to get back to port takes forever.

 

So if I'm going to play the game, and the game gets more difficult, then I expect more reward. It's not an unreasonable request.

 

 

EDIT - I want to say this - NO WAY DO I WANT TO SEE THE AI TUNED-DOWN! I think it's absolutely fantastic! I just think that co-op should be rewarded for the increased difficulty.

 

Edited by Wepps

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,373
[INTEL]
Members
3,265 posts
6,614 battles

I've played a little bit of PvE in the last few days just to see what's up and I have to say...

 

Your standard PvE player is horrible at this game. Pure PvE teaches really bad habits because other than the group rush, bots are not challenging.

 

The only real change I noticed is that, as a DD, you have to be super conservative as all the bots focus on you. That means you can't even rely on torpedoes as defense because the bots will gladly sacrifice a ship or two to your torpedoes so they can continue rushing shooting at you. DD should strike and retreat. Never sit in smoke. Pop it and run.

 

It did really help me with my BB game though as I was getting really good at estimating shot placement, something you must learn as a BB driver.

Edited by CapnCappy
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
234
Beta Testers
1,259 posts
6,287 battles

Not sure who told you it was supposed to be difficult but it's not.  Most people use it as test bed to learn new ships because the AI are push overs.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
373
[AOH]
Members
984 posts
7,157 battles

I've played a little bit of PvE in the last few days just to see what's up and I have to say...

 

Your standard PvE player is horrible at this game. Pure PvE teaches really bad habits because other than the group rush, bots are not challenging.

 

The only real change I noticed is that, as a DD, you have to be super conservative as all the bots focus on you. That means you can't even rely on torpedoes as defense because the bots will gladly sacrifice a ship or two to your torpedoes so they can continue rushing shooting at you. DD should strike and retreat. Never sit in smoke. Pop it and run.

 

It did really help me with my BB game though as I was getting really good at estimating shot placement, something you most learn as a BB driver.

 

This.

 

Destroyers now have to reserve themselves for the mid-to-late game. I'm finding that being anywhere forward early-on is bad medicine. (depending upon whether the players are actually working together or not) Cruisers are getting hit a lot harder. AI shots rarely miss. Just last night I spotted a Konigsberg coming out of smoke and I was faced directly at him in a Kirov at 1.5 km. He one-shot me with a broadside, detonating my magazine (while I have the mod to help prevent that). Never got a shot off. Battleships don't hit nearly as much as they used to at range, There is little point to launching spotting aircraft now and carriers - well let me put it this way, my Ranger took out 55 planes on an enemy carrier...and I was killed by a full-blown airstrike.

 

With few exceptions, all these are as they should be. The complaint isn't the difficulty. The complaint is - you aren't rewarded enough for taking part anymore.

Edited by Wepps

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×