Here's one reason why you wouldn't want to be in a submarine in this game....

[TheM0untaineer]

 

With the 60-80 enemy planes in the air, you'd be spotted the second you reached firing depth.

 

http://www.navy.mil..../subhunting.jpg

[VioletZer0]

So...how does this make the game worse for its inclusion?

[Crag_r]

We are not having another Subs v no subs argument... they are not going to be in game! :Smile_izmena:

 

But since we are sharing happy snaps here is HMAS Rankin

[anonym_auUiRfWCi1jI]

Amazing torpedo impact!

 

http://www.armscontr...images/1792.jpg

 

Regarding NavySniper's and Crag_r's pics...You realize these pics were taken while the the Skipper was probably fully aware the aircraft were overhead, don't you?

 

Moreover, at least in my experience in other sims, there will be no transparency at the water surface, so any vessel below the waterline is effectively hidden.  Additionally, prior submariner experience dictates two protocols, one for contact fast approaching, and distant contact, where diving takes the submarine below visual aerial detection, and periscope depth, respectively.

 

A skilled Officer will dive to the appropriate level related to a threat.  Submariners refer to this as Safe Operating Environment (SOE), which gave WWII submarines sufficient depth to operate well below the surface, and view of aerial aircraft.  Thus, subs during this era normally operated at a depth of 200 feet, though in emergencies they would dive to a depth of 400 feet.

 

ADDENDUM:

 

 

Quote

Many submarine contacts are still detected using visual scanning techniques. These techniques are sometimes augmented by sophisticated binocular and other electro-optical devices. Submarine commanders are still wary of being visually spotted and maintain a safe speed when their periscopes are exposed so that their telltale wake remains indistinct compared to the background sea clutter. The position of the Sun and the Moon as well as the direction of the ocean waves are all factors the submarine commander must consider in order to remain unobserved. In some regions of the world, phosphorescent marine organisms illuminate a submerged submarine allowing it to be visually spotted. Additionally, some aircrews may use night vision goggles to aid in visual detection at night.

 

Reference : http://www.fas.org/p...ar.html#sources

For giggles...

http://www.public.na...torpedo_ttl.gif

[Crag_r]

t42592, on 25 September 2012 - 12:03 AM, said:

Amazing torpedo impact!

http://www.armscontr...images/1792.jpg

You realize these pics were taken while the the Skipper was probably fully aware the aircraft were overhead, don't you?

Moreover, at least in my experience in other sims, there will be no transparency at the water surface, so any vessel below the waterline is effectively hidden.  Additionally, prior submariner experience dictates two protocols, one for contact fast approaching, and distant contact, where diving takes the submarine below visual aerial detection, and periscope depth, respectively.

A skilled Officer will dive to the appropriate level related to a threat.  Submariners refer to this as Safe Operating Environment (SOE), which gave WWII submarines sufficient depth to operate well below the surface, and view of aerial aircraft.  Thus, subs during this era normally operated at a depth of 200 feet, though in emergencies they would dive to a depth of 400 feet.

ADDENDUM:

Interesting enough, in that picture the sub which fired the torpedo is the same type as in my picture. An Australian Collins class sub, but onto topic.

Although in world war 2 though effectively all subs needed to be at periscope depth(as shown in the above pictures) to fire their torpedoes,

[fsjd]

aircraft, ASW mortars, depth charges, other subs... you get spotted, KYAG.

"hedgehog" AWS mortar, detonates on contact. (with ocean floor in right picture)

25% killrate vs. 7% for regular depthcharges.

 

also, dumb torps had a tendancy to miss (people try avoid the things for some reason...).

[VioletZer0]

Yeah, torps are hard to aim in a sub. I noticed this in Battlestations when I couldn't hit an enemy that was any farther from me than 500 meters.

 

Mostly because they're surprisingly simple to dodge if you see it coming. Just move out of the way and turn your hull to avoid it.

[anonym_auUiRfWCi1jI]

Very effective in NF.

 

fsjd, on 25 September 2012 - 02:19 AM, said:

aircraft, ASW mortars, depth charges, other subs... you get spotted, KYAG.

"hedgehog" AWS mortar, detonates on contact. (with ocean floor in right picture)

25% killrate vs. 7% for regular depthcharges.

 

also, dumb torps had a tendancy to miss (people try avoid the things for some reason...).

[xthetenth]

More importantly, the fastest subs are slower than the slowest battleships. They wouldn't be able to catch enemies easily and they only have a specific hard counter and no other counters so it's entirely possible for a team to win conclusively but have no hope against a single sub, and that's not fun or fair in either direction.

[Jracule]

By the end of WW2, the allies were using all kinds of new weapons that really screwed the German U-boats. Hedgehogs on sea, then the Americans had the FIDO homing torpedo in the air. A depth charge had a 9% killrate, the FIDO had 22% and that was an air-dropped weapon no less.

[KrasnayaZvezda]

NavySnipers, on 24 September 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

With the 60-80 enemy planes in the air, you'd be spotted the second you reached firing depth.

Quote

RMS_Gigantic : Bombers and fighters have been stated to be very strict in their soles, only being able to perform the task that they were designed for. Will aerial recon be a similarly strict task, only being able to be done by unarmed planes?
KGB : Probably yes.

In this case, most of those 60-80 enemy planes would be more or less blind to the submarine under torpedo depth.

[thebigblue]

On 9/24/2012 at 6:15 PM, Crag_r said:

We are not having another Subs v no subs argument... they are not going to be in game!

 

But since we are sharing happy snaps here is HMAS Rankin

Thought I’d bring up a recurring question since it hasn’t been asked about yet.... today. Sure has some persistence though! Enjoy.

[OstwindFlakpanzer]

subs would be awesome!  it would give dds something to do other than unrealistically killing battleships.  they could sail around purposefully and drop depth charges.  

[mofton]

Huh, 2012... amazing.

[thebigblue]

Hehehe

[AdmQ_17th_Fleet]

Holy necro

[Insolvent_Pea]

On 9/25/2012 at 9:15 AM, Crag_r said:

We are not having another Subs v no subs argument... they are not going to be in game!

 

But since we are sharing happy snaps here is HMAS Rankin

Rankin ? Smelly toilets or crappy boat ?

[CriMiNaL__]

Maybe Asashio's DW torps can hit the subs, and if the the subs were nuclear and you killed it wouldn't that set it off like a bomb and kill everyone on the map, you would get 12 dev strikes and 2 krakens

[Skarp_AGW]

2012? LOL

I blame this on the people that jump with two feet on posters that start new threads on old subjects, "Couldn't you find  the search box?", "Whatsa matter, too lazy to use search?" etc.

[TugboatCommander]

C'mon guys, it's a thread about submarines. Of course it's going to eventually resurface.

[warpath_33]

7 minutes ago, TugboatCommander said:

C'mon guys, it's a thread about submarines. Of course it's going to eventually resurface.

ba dum tsssssssss