A detailed look at Montecuccoli (Condottieri type 3)

[dseehafer]

Greetings all,

 

    So i've noticed that so far I have ADLAs on, arguably, the best picks for Italian cruisers tiers 4-8 with the exception of tier 5, so today i'm going to fill that gap. Raimondo Montecuccoli and Muzio Attendolo together made up the 3rd sub-class of the 5 Condottieri sub-classes. They featured vastly improved protection and slightly greater speed over the previous Cordona sub-class, but kept the same main battery. Both ships served extensively around the mediteranean during the war. Notably, Montecuccoli along with Eugenio de Sovia takled an Allied Convoy heading for Malta, their combined firepower crippled the convoy's excorts and in the end, only 2 ships from the convoy made it to Malta. During that attack Monty (thats what i'm going to call her from now on) recorded a direct hit on the HMS Hebe from a staggering 23,775m, a massive feat for a light cruiser when you consider that the longest recorded artillery shot of WWII was recorded by Scharnhorst when she hit Glorious from a distance of 26,439m. Both ships were bombed in port by the USAAF in 1942, Atendolo was a complete loss but Monty was repaired just weeks before the armistice. After the war the Allies returned Monty to the Italians who put her to use as a training ship, a role in which she served until 1964. Monty makes a better choice for the tier 5 slot over the 4th Condottieri class, the Duca d'Aosta class, because Monty's armor and weight better fit the tier 5 category, where Duca d'Aosta would be "A bit too much" for tier 5 IMO.

 

WEIGHT - 8,853t

 

This is just over 1,000t more than the Kberg, who weighs 7,700t in game, and is just over 3,000t lighter than the 11,400t Furutaka. She fits snuggly in the tier 5 slot as far as hitpoints are concerned.

 

ARMOR

Belt: 60+25mm

Decks: 20-30mm

Turrets: 70mm

Citadel "box": 20mm

 

Monty has some decent armor for a tier 5 light cruiser. As is common in many Italian warships, Monty has a "layered" belt, the outter layer being 60mm thick and the inner layer, located 2m behind the outter layer, being 25mm thick. Her deck armor is 30mm over the magazines and 20mm over the midsection, her citadel is protected by an armored "box" with 20mm thick walls. Monty will kick off the trend of future heavily armored Italian cruisers such as Duca Degli Abruzzi and Zara.

 

MAIN BATTERY - 4x2 152mm (6")

 

8x 6" guns to a broadside is definately workable at tier 5. These guns are extremely high velocity (low arcs) and fire 8 rounds per minute.

 

SECONDARY BATTERY - 3x2 100mm

 

mounted one on each side and one on the centerline 4 guns can be fired to a single broadside.

 

AA BATTERY - (17 mounts) 3x2 100mm, 4x2 37mm, 10x1 20mm

 

I have shown Monty's 1943 AA configuration. This should do fine at tier 5.

 

TORPEDO BATTERY - 2x2 533mm

 

These are mounted one on each broadside, giving Monty a torpedo broadside of 2 torpedoes. Certainly nothing spectacular, but at least she has torpedos at all.

 

SPEED - 37kn

 

Like all Italian cruisers, this is very fast! Monty should be able to easily dictate the ranges of her engagements, and be able to quickly run and hide if needed. However, all this speed combined with her toothpick like hull should make for one nasty large turning circle, however Italian cruisers were quick to menouvre, so at least expect a good rudder shift time.

 

CONCLUSION -  Overall Monty looks like a solid tier 5 light cruiser. Her main battery and hitpoints are average, her armor is very good (as far as light cruisers are concerned, she has decent AA and secondary firepower, and although she doesnt have many of them... she has torpedoes. Oya, and she's really fast. She should make for a versatile and fast paced playtyle.

 

PROS

Very fast

Good armor

has torpedoes

Decent AA and secondary firepower

Low shell arcs

 

CONS

Big target (for a light cruiser)

Large turning circle

 

Well, wattaya think? Let me know, and as allways, have a good one!

 

[715]

As always great job on the write up! This ship would be a great DD hunter with the 37 knot speed and flat shell arcs.

[ValkyrWarframe]

When I hear Monty, this is what I think of.

 

 

 

 

XD

 

Anyway, she looks OK for that tier.  However, I'm not sure how long it would take for Italy to be incorporated into this game.

[Lert]

PROS

 

Good armor

 

I would argue that her armor isn't that great actually. The drawback of having spaced armor like this ship has is that in this game, any shot that goes through the outer layer will count as penetration and do 33% damage, thus making 60+25 less effective than a single layer of, say, 70mm - atleast as far as game mechanics go. You'll citadel her less often, but you'll do serious damage more offten.

[dseehafer]

 

I would argue that her armor isn't that great actually. The drawback of having spaced armor like this ship has is that in this game, any shot that goes through the outer layer will count as penetration and do 33% damage, thus making 60+25 less effective than a single layer of, say, 70mm - atleast as far as game mechanics go. You'll citadel her less often, but you'll do serious damage more offten.

 

Iowa's belt is located within the hull, and you dont see her taking 33's (mainly just flat-out citadels ). I think Tirpitz and turtlebacks are the exception because they are located further inside the hull. The 25mm layer on Monty is only 2m in from the main belt, so the shells exploding inbetween those two layers may not affect her hitbox. I'm almost positive thats the case, otherwise poor ol' Nelson is going to suffer ALLOT of 33s with her interior belt.

[mr3awsome]

Iowa's belt is located within the hull, and you dont see her taking 33's (mainly just flat-out citadels ). I think Tirpitz and turtlebacks are the exception because they are located further inside the hull. The 25mm layer on Monty is only 2m in from the main belt, so the shells exploding inbetween those two layers may not affect her hitbox. I'm almost positive thats the case, otherwise poor ol' Nelson is going to suffer ALLOT of 33s with her interior belt.

I think he means the outer layer of armour than the actual hull itself. 

[KingofKings55]

sounds like an all-round decent ship

[dseehafer]

Also, forgot to mention, ITS MAH BIRTHDAY! Woot woot!   Hannah says she's taking me to "The Breakwater" tonight (a local fancy eatery) to celebrate.

 

 notice that the guy on the far right is wearing invisible underwear.. lulz 

[Demon93IT]

Personally I would have this as premium with Duca d'Aosta as standard. They could be rendered different enough

[dseehafer]

Personally I would have this as premium with Duca d'Aosta as standard. They could be rendered different enough

 

Yeah but Aosta weighs over 10,000t and has superior armor to Monty. Which means that she would outperform Nurnberg in survivability. I'd put Aosta as a tier 6 premium personally.

[Demon93IT]

 

Yeah but Aosta weighs over 10,000t and has superior armor to Monty. Which means that she would outperform Nurnberg in survivability. I'd put Aosta as a tier 6 premium personally.

 

Outperforming Nurnberg doesn't take a whole lot. Besides at tier VI there should be Duca degli Abruzzi which has 130 mm belt(80 mm thicker than the German counterpart).

[dseehafer]

 

Outperforming Nurnberg doesn't take a whole lot. Besides at tier VI there should be Duca degli Abruzzi which has 130 mm belt(80 mm thicker than the German counterpart).

 

Yes, exactly. d'Aosta is a sort of combination of Monty and Abruzzi. Having Abruzzi's armor, and Monty's main battery. So if Monty is a tier 5 ship, and Abruzzi is a tier 6 ship, then d'Aosta, would be a tier 5.5 ship (being in the middle statistically between Monty and Abruzzi) 5.5 rounds up to 6, its the perfect premium bait. A ship that is just good enough to peform at tier 6, but not as good as the tier 6 tree ship.

[FuyuzuKii]

Well at least her name's not as long as her younger sister, Luigi di Savoia Duca Degli Abruzzi.

 

[dseehafer]

 

Yes, exactly. d'Aosta is a sort of combination of Monty and Abruzzi. Having Abruzzi's armor, and Monty's main battery. So if Monty is a tier 5 ship, and Abruzzi is a tier 6 ship, then d'Aosta, would be a tier 5.5 ship (being in the middle statistically between Monty and Abruzzi) 5.5 rounds up to 6, its the perfect premium bait. A ship that is just good enough to peform at tier 6, but not as good as the tier 6 tree ship.

 

Not to mention d'Aosta would outperform the tier 6 Nurnberg in every last way except for firepower, not something you want prowling around down at tier 5.

[Demon93IT]

 

Not to mention d'Aosta would outperform the tier 6 Nurnberg in every last way except for firepower, not something you want prowling around down at tier 5.

 

So should Cleveland. Moreover the fact that Kirov is placed at tier V doesn't leave room. I priginally placed both at tier VI but their child is a tier lower so they both should follow(especially if Kiroc gets improved potection from Project 26 bis)

[Eisennagel]

 

 

Abruzzi has 100mm belt armor.  Aosta only has 70mm armor.  That is a whole lot of difference.  The Omaha and the Furutaka both have 76mm belt armor.  The difference between the Aosta having 70mm and the Monty having 60mm means nothing in front of a Koenigsburg AP shells.  I also prefer the Aosta as a Tier 5, and the Monty as a Tier 5 premium due to her combat record.  

 

I can imagine how the gunnery options will be offered.

 

1926 guns default --- An incredible 1000 mps!  Super velocity but you pay for it with a 4 rounds per minute RoF.

1929 gun upgrade --- A more average 850mps, but your RoF is up to 8 rounds per minute.

 

 

[Eisennagel]

 

Not to mention d'Aosta would outperform the tier 6 Nurnberg in every last way except for firepower, not something you want prowling around down at tier 5.

 

 

The Nurnberg's firepower advantage however, is tremendous to the point it is overwhelming.  In RoF, shell velocity, AP damage, number of guns, and not the least, their sheer accuracy.  Triple mounts have a tendency to group shells into tight clusters.

 

[kerensky914]

Italian ships are usually lovely ships, but this one ... what is up with that conning tower?  It looks like a traffic cone.

 

[Iridium81]

Her in war top speed was 34kts, Italy as a whole spent a lot of time buying into the trend of overspeeding their ships during trials for the bonuses offered by navies at the time.  This tended to result in a quick loss of power over time.  If I had to choose one of the Condottieri series, it would be Luigi Di Savoia Duca Degli Abruzzi.  She was designed more sensibly with a 22% displacement armor scheme vs the previous type's 18% of displacement being devoted to armor.

[dseehafer]

 

 

Abruzzi has 100mm belt armor.  Aosta only has 70mm armor.  That is a whole lot of difference. 

 

 

Aosta has 70+35mm belt armor. Thats 105mm. Granted Abruzzi has 100+30mm for 130, but thats still only a 25mm difference compared to 45mm difference to Monty.

[dseehafer]

Italian ships are usually lovely ships, but this one ... what is up with that conning tower?  It looks like a traffic cone.

 

thats 3 out of the 5 Condottieri sub-classes that have that bridge style. You may not like the mid tier Italian cruisers if you dont like that bridge.

[dseehafer]

 

 I also prefer the Aosta as a Tier 5, and the Monty as a Tier 5 premium due to her combat record.  

 

 

yeah but Monty fits so perfectly at tier 5, d'Aosta doesnt. d'Aosta has tier 6 hitpoints and tier 6 armor. Yes, Monty also has very good armor but her hitpoints are strictly that of a tier 5.

[Eisennagel]

 

Aosta has 70+35mm belt armor. Thats 105mm. Granted Abruzzi has 100+30mm for 130, but thats still only a 25mm difference compared to 45mm difference to Monty.

 

The game only recognizes three levels of armor: One belt, hull armor (the outer skin) and the deck armor.  That is why the multilayer armor on German ships don't mean krap in the game. 

[dseehafer]

 

The game only recognizes three levels of armor: One belt, hull armor (the outer skin) and the deck armor.  That is why the multilayer armor on German ships don't mean krap in the game. 

 

you obviously dont have an account at GM3d then.

[_Sarcasticat_]

That boat...Resembles the AMX 40.