Where have all the CV gone?

[Herr_Reitz]

Tier V and below I see plenty 'o carriers (cv)... 

 

Tier VI and VII I rarely see them any more.... 

 

Have all the Tier VI and up players moved into a different class?

Or have they dropped down in tier and playing at or below V? 

 

thx

[Hunter_Steel]

CV's right now at the higher tiers are as rare as unicorns. And I rarely see them in my Kongou as well.

 

~Hunter

[StingRayOne]

I have a Lexington, which is a US carrier

allow to explain;

an overall lack of killing potential and very little ability to do damage

repeated nerfs have emasculated the American CV as much as the American male

A general lack of AA cover screen from cruisers because they are to busy dying alone or starting fires for an animated wet dreamship.

 

I am now concentrating on my other lines and my IJN  CV line which is T6 right now.

Although they suffer from less planes per squadron, you have more squadrons giving you better damage power.

 

IF WOW really gave a rats butt about CVs, which they do not.

they would fix;

the way a squadron replenishes in battle

the load out choice to allow us what are decks hold so were are not stuck with 1 db or 1 torp plane.

they would give us points for target/spotting DDS in a fight by assigning a plane to track them.

they would up the bomb damage a touch where the hit ratio goes up with the amount of planes and skills.

and give American CVs a chance to carry 2 torp planes at T8 for goodness sake.

There is a rumor they will be fixing the DB damage but big woop , I would rather have my own loadout.

 

[iman360]

game going downhill slowly but surely

[Nachoo31]

game going downhill slowly but surely

Game is not going down hill. 

[10T0nHammer]

Starting working on IJN CVs, then another patch of nerfs for CVs, thats like what 6 patches in a row now? and I figured why bother, they will just get nerfed again.

[Carrier_Ikoma]

Starting working on IJN CVs, then another patch of nerfs for CVs, thats like what 6 patches in a row now? and I figured why bother, they will just get nerfed again.

 

Oh this chain has been running since CBT.

[Fleet_Admiral_Kolchak]

I mean is there any other carrier besides Shokaku, she's a solid girl

 

[SG_ONeill]

I have a Lexington, which is a US carrier

allow to explain;

an overall lack of killing potential and very little ability to do damage

repeated nerfs have emasculated the American CV as much as the American male

A general lack of AA cover screen from cruisers because they are to busy dying alone or starting fires for an animated wet dreamship.

 

 

I am now concentrating on my other lines and my IJN  CV line which is T6 right now.

Although they suffer from less planes per squadron, you have more squadrons giving you better damage power.

 

 

IF WOW really gave a rats butt about CVs, which they do not.

they would fix;

the way a squadron replenishes in battle

the load out choice to allow us what are decks hold so were are not stuck with 1 db or 1 torp plane.

they would give us points for target/spotting DDS in a fight by assigning a plane to track them.

they would up the bomb damage a touch where the hit ratio goes up with the amount of planes and skills.

and give American CVs a chance to carry 2 torp planes at T8 for goodness sake.

There is a rumor they will be fixing the DB damage but big woop , I would rather have my own loadout.

 

Back in the days of late Alpha/early Beta, USN CVs had 2 TB squadrons on Independence and upwards (and on Bogue if I remember correctly). After IJN CVs were introduced, WG decided to apply "national flavor" and swapped out the 2 TBs for 2 DBs. Then because of inexperienced whiners who have no situational awareness and failure to use WASD, manual TB drops got nerfed by increasing arming distance, their torpedo speeds got nerfed, and the introduction of "float fighters" in which a single fighter piloted by Chuck Norris can lock down and wipe out a full squadron. Add in the lack of proper rewards for AA defense that leads to most players not bothering with AA (not that they would be interested in AA, properly rewarded or not) and you get the state of CV's that you see today.

[Carrier_Ikoma]

I mean is there any other carrier besides Shokaku, she's a solid girl

 

Hiryuu is pretty nice IMO. Even after all the nerfs... still decent, though I miss having 3 TBs on her.

 

Ryuujou looks nice on paper, and he is nice for fighting USN CVs, but that's it. Her planes are paper and melt if someone with an AA gun even looks at them funny. And they don't have speed to make up for it either.

 

Hiryuu and up are a bit tougher, and do have speed.

[Carrier_Ikoma]

 

Back in the days of late Alpha/early Beta, USN CVs had 2 TB squadrons on Independence and upwards (and on Bogue if I remember correctly). After IJN CVs were introduced, WG decided to apply "national flavor" and swapped out the 2 TBs for 2 DBs. Then because of inexperienced whiners who have no situational awareness and failure to use WASD, manual TB drops got nerfed by increasing arming distance, their torpedo speeds got nerfed, and the introduction of "float fighters" in which a single fighter piloted by Chuck Norris can lock down and wipe out a full squadron. Thus the state of CV's that you see today.

 

Don't forget the torp damage nerfs, flood chance nerfs, spread nerfs, cruiser barrage buffs, and so on...

[Morpheous]

First off get a bit more historical. Do away with CA fighters, that is dumb and dumber, and it does hinder CV attacks way more than it should, heck it takes my fighter flight about a minute to shoot one CA fighter down, that is on floats LOL.  Floatplane fighters were only marginally successful and that ONLY with the Japanese Zero on floats (Rufe) .  Easy fix, helps CVs.  Instead of fixing the STUPID manual drops that made everyone SOOO mad, they just layer on more [edited]to compensate.  So do away with manual drops, lesson individual ship AA, keeping the CA AA  mod, but not quite as devastating.  UP DB damage, this is a no brainer.  Increase American squads, let CV players do more tailor their strike force, but enforce a minimum of one fighter squadron per ship to avoid ahistorical situations, where a CV would never take a fighter squadron, umm that would never happen.  Take out fighter Barrage, another ahistorical and stupid add to the game.  CV players have enough going on than to micromanage their fighters.  I would play with more squadrons, more plane reloads.  POINTS for spotting, wow, of course, just like light tanks in WoT, this would ENCOURAGE CV players to spot enemy DDs rather than just fly by them. 

     With all that said, I still play my Hiryu every day, and get matched up with a Ranger 90% of the time, and let him shoot down all my fighters with his fighter load out while I get in my 4-5 torp hits and 4-5 DB hits... if all goes well.   At this point the CV is not the game changer that it once was, were an OP CV player with and OP CV just wrecked the enemy fleet, it is much more a support role, but if that IS the case then give it points for supporting, and just get rid of ahistorical non-sense that seems like a good idea, but really has nerfed CVs too much.

[Herr_Reitz]

Wow... if you guys represent a reasonable sample of CV players at least I have some idea now as to why I don't see as many CV as I used to see. 

 

I can almost feel your pain. 

 

I personally think each class of ship adds a great deal to the game... at least I'm not interested in playing a two-class battle... 

 

I do hope things get a course correction soon... because I do miss seeing the carriers and their impact on the game. 

 

 

[Palladia]

As of right now I have stopped playing for a bit.  .5.3 took the wind out of me.  If they fix it then I will probably come back,  but right now it's just setting a bad precedence in my mind.

[marcmad]

CVs basically keep the same strike power from T7 to T8 while ennemy ship gain better AA and hp. They are planning to nerf T9 and 10 USN CV in the next patch by removing close to half their damage potential.

 

Also not a lot of people like the RTS CV style and if you are not really good at it you can easily get  driven into uselessness by the ennemy CV. It's rough for newbe.

Nevertheless I still love CV, it's my favorite class and i'll keep on playing no matter the nerf it receive.

[dabigD_1055]

I think it sucks because I grinded to get my Lexington and now with the nerf it seems almost useless.  I don't mind shooting down planes, but I do like to have more of an impact in regards to strike capability.  IJN cv's shouldn't get all the fun in that aspect, but I guess we shall have to wait and see how this works out.

[Herr_Reitz]

So is there any real promise of goodness to come, to bring a bit back to CV while not making them OP ? 

[Palladia]

So is there any real promise of goodness to come, to bring a bit back to CV while not making them OP ? 

 

Not yet.  A 30% boost to the damage of dive bombers starting at T8.  It's a thing,  but it won't even come close to boosting those two ships back to parity.  Every other ship is dealing with increased AA and decreased durability.  The only upside is an increase in plane speed.

[Herr_Reitz]

Hmm... well there seemed to be a lot of hoo-hah over DD buffs... in the next patch, if i read the forums correctly... so I wonder then I guess... why all the nerfs? 

 

"Were" CV's too much this, too much that for most folks? 

[Piratesque]

Dont forget the introduced bugs with vanishing fighter squadrons or all fighter squadrons gets destroyed in less than 1 second while the enemy sustains zero losses despite having equal strenghts. At least thats my reason for not playing CVs very much, only the Project R that 'forced me' to do some play with. The sooner I can drop playing CVs the better.

[Iekika]

CV issues started in closed beta when people that didn't or wont watch the sky for planes started ranting and ranting both here and all over youtube about CV's being to powerfull when there Battleships would eat full spreads of torpedos and sink.  then they added Jappinese CV's and changed the US cv's to be Fighter carriers (ok they have DB's but DB's were and still are crap sad realy as it was the dive bomber that won midway)  this resulted in FF CV's that can and often do compleetly shut down the enemy CV which wouldn't be all bad if killing planes provided good XP as it is its just anoying. then Capapult fighters yea dont get me started on those fantasy things even were they to exist one plane would not panic a full squadron and a Fighter squad should kill such a thing in about as much time as it takes to blink.  in short you don't see them because of heavy use of the Nurf bat

 

this guy is a good expamle of the whining that went on

 

 

if you watch closely you see that he did very little to counter that attack yes he turned some but nowere near enough that little movement will still end with you eating a bunch of torps. even with that he turned the wrong way and actualy helped the TB's line up to his broadside. also taking your hands of the keyboard and screaming obcinetys dose not help eather. Yet he made the vid and ranted in fourms abot CV's being OP

 

 

[SG_ONeill]

CV issues started in closed beta when people that didn't or wont watch the sky for planes started ranting and ranting both here and all over youtube about CV's being to powerfull when there Battleships would eat full spreads of torpedos and sink.  then they added Jappinese CV's and changed the US cv's to be Fighter carriers (ok they have DB's but DB's were and still are crap sad realy as it was the dive bomber that won midway)  this resulted in FF CV's that can and often do compleetly shut down the enemy CV which wouldn't be all bad if killing planes provided good XP as it is its just anoying. then Capapult fighters yea dont get me started on those fantasy things even were they to exist one plane would not panic a full squadron and a Fighter squad should kill such a thing in about as much time as it takes to blink.  in short you don't see them because of heavy use of the Nurf bat

 

this guy is a good expamle of the whining that went on

 

 

if you watch closely you see that he did very little to counter that attack yes he turned some but nowere near enough that little movement will still end with you eating a bunch of torps. even with that he turned the wrong way and actualy helped the TB's line up to his broadside. also taking your hands of the keyboard and screaming obcinetys dose not help eather. Yet he made the vid and ranted in fourms abot CV's being OP

 

 

 

Oh don't get me started on those "float fighters". I thought it was stupid and historically inaccurate when it was first released and I still think it is today. I don't think raw performance and damage stats of CVs are enough anymore. Devs need to watch, I mean literally watch with their own pair of eyes, how players control their ships when they come under attack by CVs just so the devs could see those players that cry CV's being OP while they do little or nothing to avoid incoming torpedoes from TBs.

[DemonicTreerat]

 

Oh don't get me started on those "float fighters". I thought it was stupid and historically inaccurate when it was first released and I still think it is today. I don't think raw performance and damage stats of CVs are enough anymore. Devs need to watch, I mean literally watch with their own pair of eyes, how players control their ships when they come under attack by CVs just so the devs could see those players that cry CV's being OP while they do little or nothing to avoid incoming torpedoes from TBs.

 

Is it any surprise though? Its been that way for a long time. People have this idea (I call it the Rambo complex) that because they're special (as in personal fable) they should be immune to the odds. That they can, to borrow an example from Dark Age of Camelot, run out of a border keep as a caster alone, in blue & green 89% quality armor with zero extra hp, along a well-traveled path, and expect to not get shot to pieces by the archer who invested literal hours getting a 100% top-grade bow and arrows and spec'ed their character to do one thing well which is to shoot lethal shots from stealth. Naturally reality tends to differ drastically from their fantasy even after the sixth time they try the same thing. After that harsh introduction to the reality of gaming (that you are not the main character protected from the consequences of stupidity by plot armor), they don't learn. Why should they when their mind is set in the belief that - to butcher the saying - they're fine, its everyone else who isn't. Instead these people whine and scream, they twist and cherry pick data and scenarios until it "proves" their point, and engage in what in a properly moderated setting would be called outright harassment and bullying until dissenting voices are silenced. Inevitably these people attract a following, usually those who want to fit in and don't especially care what it takes to fit in, so they become the loudest voice all the developers hear.

 

What its going to take to change this situation is the same thing that shook the cage of the MMORPG industry. Another World of Warcraft. Something big that throws out the "accepted wisdom" which in this case is cater to the loudest voices on the forums, "grind equals skill", "its okay to use double standards", and "only listen to people who share your biases". And it will happen. It might take years but eventually they'll notice the potential demand. When that happens you can expect history to repeat itself with WarGaming filling the role of SOE and the new guys taking Blizzards spot.

[AdmiralDrake]

You guys must not be playing the game because there are tons of CV t6 and t7 and t8. There have been many games with 2 CVs per team. In fact, my last match was with 2 cvs per team. The number of players playing CV right now is higher than say a month or 2 months ago, definitely.

[Herr_Reitz]

CV issues started in closed beta when people that didn't or wont watch the sky for planes started ranting and ranting both here and all over youtube about CV's being to powerfull when there Battleships would eat full spreads of torpedos and sink.  then they added Jappinese CV's and changed the US cv's to be Fighter carriers (ok they have DB's but DB's were and still are crap sad realy as it was the dive bomber that won midway)  this resulted in FF CV's that can and often do compleetly shut down the enemy CV which wouldn't be all bad if killing planes provided good XP as it is its just anoying. then Capapult fighters yea dont get me started on those fantasy things even were they to exist one plane would not panic a full squadron and a Fighter squad should kill such a thing in about as much time as it takes to blink.  in short you don't see them because of heavy use of the Nurf bat

 

this guy is a good expamle of the whining that went on

 

 

if you watch closely you see that he did very little to counter that attack yes he turned some but nowere near enough that little movement will still end with you eating a bunch of torps. even with that he turned the wrong way and actualy helped the TB's line up to his broadside. also taking your hands of the keyboard and screaming obcinetys dose not help eather. Yet he made the vid and ranted in fourms abot CV's being OP

 

 

 

Man... what a whiner... seriously... his language alone... ouch... 

 

I generally turn towards them inbound, knowing they will alter course around me... and figure I have to anticipate when they will drop. Prolly not the best move always but it is something. 

 

You are so correct, he did little to nothing... but whine it seems.

 

Did anyone point out your points about his game play to him?