Are the VMF ships performing as stated within the mechanics of the game?

[Super_Dreadnought]

What prompted this poll: http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/63476-gameplay-degradation/page__st__40__pid__1564862#entry1564862

 

 

Lumping all the destroyers into one groups like that is ridiculous.  The relative power of them is meaningless when they have such disparate abilities to approach ships undetected and carry out attacks.

 

A Kiev for instances can roll right up on any battleships and fire away undetected from under 3km, while a Mahan can be spotted from 20km on the other side of a mountain and taken out with a single salvo without ever being able to see the attacker.   I've seen Fubukis ground themselves trying to attack my BBs and then disappear off the screen while firing at them 2 kms away.   That these ships are even in the same class and described in the same fashion is beyond stupid.

 

 

Utterly false as to those detection ranges.  A Minekaze can get to 6.1km without being spotted, but as soon as you fire guns, you're lit.  Mahans are worse, but not nearly as bad as you pretend.

 

I'll never understand why people make such stupidly exaggerated claims to attempt to prove anything.

 

 

Because they dont understand what is happening. 

 

 

Yes of course ... all the people in these forums posting about invisible Kievs, one shot kills by Russian ships three and four times beyond their detection range ... we all just don't understand and it can't possibly be that there's a problem with the game.

 

Someone post a poll asking if people are observing Russian ships performing beyond their advertised capabilities and I'll wager you that by a margin of 3 or 4 to 1 they'll say yes they are.

 

 

So yeah... I decided to make a poll since he asked. Are the VMF ships performing as stated within the mechanics of the game? 

 

The poll is NOT about overperformance/underperformance, win rate or whether they are doing better/worse than the other ships at their respective tier. the poll is about whether you believe that the Russian ships are reflecting their paper stats, capabilities, and working within the mechanics of the game, or whether you believe that they are somehow cheating the system like UncleDirtNap seems to be accusing them of doing.

 

Do you think that the Russian DDs are cheating somehow? That they can literally roll right up to a battleship and derp them in the face? That they can one shot kill something 4 times beyond their detection range? Or do you think there's a perfectly acceptable explanation and that the Russian DDs are working within the system?

[10T0nHammer]

You need an "other" option

 

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/63824-lets-talk-about-the-elephant-in-the-room/page__fromsearch__1

 

Theres also this one

[Super_Dreadnought]

You need an "other" option

 

Imho you either think the Russian DDs are performing beyond what the stats say they are capable of or you don't. I am not a big believer of the bacon option.

 

If anyone offers a compelling pitch for 'other', then I'll add it on.

[1nv4d3rZ1m]

See the issue with this poll is that you assume they are advertised as being balanced.

[10T0nHammer]

 

Imho you either think the Russian DDs are performing beyond what the stats say they are capable of or you don't. I am not a big believer of the bacon option.

 

If anyone offers a compelling pitch for 'other', then I'll add it on.

 

Well I said other because, while in the upper tiers, they are performing above and beyond, in mid to low tiers.... they are about average.

[byronicasian]

See the issue with this poll is that you assume they are advertised as being balanced.

 

But in this case, the accusation is that they are not reflecting paper stats. e.g. Detection distance of x km, but only showing up at x - 5 km. 

[Macabe]

UncleDirtNap, on 04 January 2016 - 02:27 PM, said:

 

Lumping all the destroyers into one groups like that is ridiculous.  The relative power of them is meaningless when they have such disparate abilities to approach ships undetected and carry out attacks.

 

A Kiev for instances can roll right up on any battleships and fire away undetected from under 3km, while a Mahan can be spotted from 20km on the other side of a mountain and taken out with a single salvo without ever being able to see the attacker.   I've seen Fubukis ground themselves trying to attack my BBs and then disappear off the screen while firing at them 2 kms away.   That these ships are even in the same class and described in the same fashion is beyond stupid.

 

 I literally don't even at that statement.

 

 

 

 

[1nv4d3rZ1m]

 

But in this case, the accusation is that they are not reflecting paper stats. e.g. Detection distance of x km, but only showing up at x - 5 km. 

 

Well that would be easy to test right? Does anyone have a kiev and training room mod to test this theory? 

[byronicasian]

 

Well that would be easy to test right? Does anyone have a kiev and training room mod to test this theory? 

 

Sounds like its easy to test, though I doubt the original accuser would believe us...

 

Is the training room working again?

[Super_Dreadnought]

 

Well I said other because, while in the upper tiers, they are performing above and beyond, in mid to low tiers.... they are about average.

 

It's not about performance and whether they are doing better or worse than the other DDs at their respective tier. the poll is about whether you believe that the Russian ships are reflecting their paper stats and capabilities, or whether you believe that they are somehow cheating the system like UncleDirtNap accuses.

[1nv4d3rZ1m]

 

Sounds like its easy to test, though I doubt the original accuser would believe us...

 

Is the training room working again?

 

no idea, I run vanilla. 

 

I have ground up to the tier 6 soviet DD so far and the spotting range is exactly on the money. I have gotten close enough to torp before but that involves closing within a 5-6km behind land and then closing the rest of the distance need with smoke and 3/4 throttle. 

[gillhunter]

I've wondered what the Russians did to the Milwaukee to make her so much better than the Omaha.

[1nv4d3rZ1m]

I've wondered what the Russians did to the Milwaukee to make her so much better than the Omaha.

 

vodka and patriotism comrade

[Zampy]

My Kiev sure as hell gets spotted at 9km

[1nv4d3rZ1m]

I am almost 100% sure that the reason why someone think kievs can get so close is because smoke is sometimes not rendered in the sight. 

[Super_Dreadnought]

Alright, I've added 'other' (I refuse to add bacon). No idea personally why anyone would use it. I imagine one either thinks the Russian ships are working within the mechanics and advertised statistics, or WG are making them cheat.

[byronicasian]

I've wondered what the Russians did to the Milwaukee to make her so much better than the Omaha.

 

You see comrade, when you use Vodka for hydraulics, rudder moves faster because it no care about safety tolerances anymore. 

[Rion12]

Maybe Kiev. And maybe Murmansk, what with all the hubbub about it being a "better Omaha" (although, I just got the thing, and I kinda suck with it, so...).

 

I don't have much reason to think the other Russian ships are overperforming.

[steelreserv27]

In a russian DD, I dont ever recall detecting enemy DDs before I am already detected by them.

 

i dont even think the kiev even has the stock ability to stealth fire, (perhaps with a max'd out crew) but certainly not from 3km.) its its a ridiculous over-exaggeration.

 

maybe from smoke. Smoke sometimes doesnt render inless you zoom in on it.  

[1nv4d3rZ1m]

Maybe Kiev. And maybe Murmansk, what with all the hubbub about it being a "better Omaha" (although, I just got the thing, and I kinda suck with it, so...).

 

I don't have much reason to think the other Russian ships are overperforming.

 

http://warships.today/vehicle/4293866960/na/Imperator%20Nikolai%20I

[Downpour_]

I spend 4/5th of the time every game spotted in my Russian DDs. If you are not spotted then you are not firing, if you are not firing you are not playing the VMF correctly. The poster who prompted this poll is an idiot, why is this even an issue? Move on ppl.

[byronicasian]

Maybe Kiev. And maybe Murmansk, what with all the hubbub about it being a "better Omaha" (although, I just got the thing, and I kinda suck with it, so...).

 

I don't have much reason to think the other Russian ships are overperforming.

 

Question isn't overperformance, but actually not following paper stats (examples mentioned earlier as detection range being x km, but actually spotted in game at x-5 km, fire chance of x %, but actually x +2%, firing range of x km , but actually x+3 km). 

[Kaystonian8283]

Nah their ships are fine they burn an sink as quickly as others, other than that its based on player skills

[madmikey77]

I've played up to the Udaloi and can say with certainty that Russian DDs are not getting some weird camo bonus. They consistently get out-detected by any other DDs, unless there are islands or smoke involved. This is very noticeable on the Kiev, Tash and Udaloi.

 

 

[centarina]

only ones that seems OP is gremy and imperator.  rest are not too bad.