German and USSR Battleships

[Germanwarrior2]

 

 Was wondering if there will be a full line of German and USSR Battleships in the near future, I know the Bismarck was announced as a regular Tier 8 ship, so I'm assuming that the German line is coming.

[Daigensui]

Frankly, both Germany and Russian/Soviet can have two lines each.

[2Floods1Ship]

Frankly, both Germany and Russian/Soviet can have two lines each.

 

Do you mean two lines in each tree or two battleships lines in each tree?

[Fleet_Admiral_Kolchak]

Frankly, both Germany and Russian/Soviet can have two lines each.

 

Whaaaaaat???

 

I figured there were barely enough for Russian/ Soviet BB and German BB were paper ships?

[Daigensui]

Do you mean two lines in each tree or two battleships lines in each tree?

 

Two lines in each tree.

 

 

Whaaaaaat???

 

I figured there were barely enough for Russian/ Soviet BB and German BB were paper ships?

 

WW1 was a crazy era of designing. Add in a touch of "logical" modernization, and you have two Imperial lines ready to set sail.

[Lert]

German cruisers and Russian tin cans are coming on the 19th. No other information is available no these two nations.

[Fleet_Admiral_Kolchak]

I can see modernization of Russian/ Soviet BB, however at best most of them had 12in guns. How could they compete against their contemporaries? 

[Daigensui]

WW1 was a crazy era of designing

 

There is your answer.

[Fleet_Admiral_Kolchak]

Wont the community call bull though is what I am saying?

 

Most of the community is still pissed about the new Russian DDs so if Wargaming takes liberties with making adjustments/ paperships folks will get angry if not more so.

[Panzer20000]

Wont the community call bull though is what I am saying?

 

Most of the community is still pissed about the new Russian DDs so if Wargaming takes liberties with making adjustments/ paperships folks will get angry if not more so.

 

It's been pretty clear for a long time that a large majority of the USSR in the game will be unbuilt designs, same with the Germans to a degree. Heck, it could be argued that most of the nations will have a considerable amount of unbuilt ships in the different lines. If players can't accept that and call bull on ever design they can't find, then I don't know what to say.

[Eisennagel]

I can see modernization of Russian/ Soviet BB, however at best most of them had 12in guns. How could they compete against their contemporaries? 

 

Battleships with 12" guns can compete right up to Tier 4, on the Wyoming level.  

[BrianDavion]

 

Two lines in each tree.

 

 

 

WW1 was a crazy era of designing. Add in a touch of "logical" modernization, and you have two Imperial lines ready to set sail.

 

only for certin powers, the Germans built a large number of ships, but the Russians where very much  little behind the curb, although the battleships they produced where, reasonably impressive ships 

[Lunaris]

WW1 was a crazy era of designing. Add in a touch of "logical" modernization, and you have two Imperial lines ready to set sail.

 

Did they put pagoda mast on their BB? 

[Xero_Snake]

I think two lines means one for battleships and another one for battlecruisers.

[MrDeaf]

 

Battleships with 12" guns can compete right up to Tier 4, on the Wyoming level.  

 

If the RoF was really fast, with good range, maybe not necessarily shell velocity, they would be excellent cruiser killers, right up to T10.

 

Although, the problem at T8+, seems to be the lack of cruisers to shoot at in the first place.

And once you run out of cruisers to kill, it usually ends up being a slug fest of BBs, where those 12" shells will really suffer.

[Panzer20000]

I think two lines means one for battleships and another one for battlecruisers.

 

If they really tried, they could probably squeeze out 2 Battleship and 2 Battlecruiser lines for Germany

 

RU/USSR has enough for at least 2 BB, I think enough for 1 battlecruiser.

[Crucis]

I think two lines means one for battleships and another one for battlecruisers.

 

If they really tried, they could probably squeeze out 2 Battleship and 2 Battlecruiser lines for Germany

 

RU/USSR has enough for at least 2 BB, I think enough for 1 battlecruiser.

 

 

While this might ... might .... be true for the mid-tiers (i.e. the WW1 era), it wouldn't be true for tiers 8-10, at least.  Frankly, I don't think that ANY nation has enough legitimate battlecruisers to support a BC line all the way to tier 10.  IMO, he best way to handle BC lines would be to split them off at the same time as BB's split off from cruisers (i.e. tier 3) and then have the BC lines merge back into the BB line when that nation runs out of BCs.  For most nations, that would probably mean that their BC lines would merge back into the BB lines at around tier 6 7, or 8 (i.e. their last BC would be at tier 5,6, or 7).

 

 

[Xero_Snake]

More like many nations BC line may likely to reach tier IX at most.

 

I've created a thread dedicated to Soviet/Russian BBs and BCs discussions. Feel free to join the discussion, we'll more about it over there.

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/52137-russiansoviet-vmf-battleships-battlecruisers-line-discussions/#topmost

[Panzer20000]

 

 

While this might ... might .... be true for the mid-tiers (i.e. the WW1 era), it wouldn't be true for tiers 8-10, at least.  Frankly, I don't think that ANY nation has enough legitimate battlecruisers to support a BC line all the way to tier 10.  IMO, he best way to handle BC lines would be to split them off at the same time as BB's split off from cruisers (i.e. tier 3) and then have the BC lines merge back into the BB line when that nation runs out of BCs.  For most nations, that would probably mean that their BC lines would merge back into the BB lines at around tier 6 7, or 8 (i.e. their last BC would be at tier 5,6, or 7).

 

 

 

Germany had so many Battlecruiser designs it isn't even funny, UK also has enough designs to fill up a line easily. The others I wouldn't doubt would use fast battleships to fill up the rest of a line.

 

Here is just some of the designs Germany came up with for Battlecruisers: http://dreadnoughtproject.org/plans/SM_Studienentwurf/

 

To be noted the GK-10 or some variation of it will likely appear at tier X in a mid or late 1940's "What if" modernization.

[Crucis]

More like many nations BC line may likely to reach tier IX at most.

 

I've created a thread dedicated to Soviet/Russian BBs and BCs discussions. Feel free to join the discussion, we'll more about it over there.

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/52137-russiansoviet-vmf-battleships-battlecruisers-line-discussions/#topmost

 

 

Tier 9 seems a bit high for actual BCs, discounting some of the hard to define ships of the WW2 era, like the Alaska. 

 

With the Brits, I kinda think that the final BC would/should be the Hood (aka the Admiral class) at tier 7, as it was the last BC built by the RN, after its experience at Jutland with BCs and their vulnerability.

 

As for the Germans, I'll admit to being a bit less familiar with their ships, but I sorta doubt that they'd have anything higher than tier 6, with the possible exception of the Scharnhorst/Gneisenau class, which for its era seem like it could qualify, but OTOH, may be needed to fill the tier 7 BB slot.

 

I haven't yet gotten to the Amagi, but part of me wonders if the Amagi is a little over tiered because of the general lack of new IJN construction between the Nagato class and the Yamato class, and WG needed to fill the tier 8 slot with something.

 

And of course, the US simply doesn't have the ships to have an actual battle cruiser line, given that the only legit BC class it ever conceived was the Lexingtons, which were scrapped due to the Washington Naval Treaty (and the Lex and Saratoga being converted to CVs).   And one could make a case for the Alaskas being BC's (certainly plenty of people have).  Personally I think that it's more likely that either the 1920's South Dakota class BB or the Lexington class BC's get made into premium ships.  Come to think of it, if WG decides to create a second USN BB line, it might need to use the 1920's South Dakota class to fill the tier 7 slot (oddly enough as the class right before the late 1930's South Dakota class at tier 8).  So I could see the Lexington class BC being the premium ship, and perhaps being called the Saratoga, to avoid any name confusion.

[Panzer20000]

With the Brits, I kinda think that the final BC would/should be the Hood (aka the Admiral class) at tier 7, as it was the last BC built by the RN, after its experience at Jutland with BCs and their vulnerability.

 

As for the Germans, I'll admit to being a bit less familiar with their ships, but I sorta doubt that they'd have anything higher than tier 6, with the possible exception of the Scharnhorst/Gneisenau class, which for its era seem like it could qualify, but OTOH, may be needed to fill the tier 7 BB slot.

 

if we were limited to built then yes Hood should be last, but there are several other ship designs created after her that could fill 8-10.

 

A battleship known as L-2 is taking the tier 7 spot last the devs said (Which was a while ago), so Scharnhorst can take a spot on a BC line.

[mr3awsome]

Tier 9 seems a bit high for actual BCs,

The British and Germans have designs that will work. 

 

With the Brits, I kinda think that the final BC would/should be the Hood (aka the Admiral class) at tier 7, as it was the last BC built by the RN, after its experience at Jutland with BCs and their vulnerability.

Well despite the cancellation of Rodney, Anson and Howe battlecruisers were studied up until about 1923. As a result there are enough ships for a line from top to bottom. 

 

As for the Germans, I'll admit to being a bit less familiar with their ships, but I sorta doubt that they'd have anything higher than tier 6, with the possible exception of the Scharnhorst/Gneisenau class, which for its era seem like it could qualify, but OTOH, may be needed to fill the tier 7 BB slot.

Ersatz Yorck works at tier 7, and then there are paper designs for above that. 

 

I haven't yet gotten to the Amagi, but part of me wonders if the Amagi is a little over tiered because of the general lack of new IJN construction between the Nagato class and the Yamato class, and WG needed to fill the tier 8 slot with something.

Not really. Its better than Nagato in every regard other than protection. Tosa is what Amagi will likely be joined by, which matches Nagato's speed whilst being slightly better protected and with greater firepower. 

 

And of course, the US simply doesn't have the ships to have an actual battle cruiser line, given that the only legit BC class it ever conceived was the Lexingtons, which were scrapped due to the Washington Naval Treaty (and the Lex and Saratoga being converted to CVs).   And one could make a case for the Alaskas being BC's (certainly plenty of people have).  Personally I think that it's more likely that either the 1920's South Dakota class BB or the Lexington class BC's get made into premium ships.  Come to think of it, if WG decides to create a second USN BB line, it might need to use the 1920's South Dakota class to fill the tier 7 slot (oddly enough as the class right before the late 1930's South Dakota class at tier 8).  So I could see the Lexington class BC being the premium ship, and perhaps being called the Saratoga, to avoid any name confusion.

The USN does have enough designs for at least a partial line. They have a large number of Courageous analogues as well. 

The 1920 South Dakota class at tier 7 seems a bit excessive. Its Colorado, but with 50% more guns. It should be a tier higher at least. 

The Lexingtons on the other hand are tier 7 material. 

 

 

 

 

[Philrulz]

 

Whaaaaaat???

 

I figured there were barely enough for Russian/ Soviet BB and German BB were paper ships?

the germans BBs like other ships in game were only found on blueprints but they made em in game. germany had some pretty big ships to make tier 9 and 10 on paper compared to bismarck and tirpitz

 

[Philrulz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RogRFLHFAs0 at 13 mins they speak about the paper BBs of germany

 

If the RoF was really fast, with good range, maybe not necessarily shell velocity, they would be excellent cruiser killers, right up to T10.

 

Although, the problem at T8+, seems to be the lack of cruisers to shoot at in the first place.

And once you run out of cruisers to kill, it usually ends up being a slug fest of BBs, where those 12" shells will really suffer.

 

at 13 mins they speak about the paper BBs of germany the h 44 looks really huge cant wait to see what the tier 9 and 10 would be

 

 

[Rayvaul]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RogRFLHFAs0 at 13 mins they speak about the paper BBs of germany

 

at 13 mins they speak about the paper BBs of germany the h 44 looks really huge cant wait to see what the tier 9 and 10 would be

 

 

 

H-39 will be tier 9 and H-41 will be tier 10. I'm hoping the Deutschland will be tier 6, but she would have to be a brawler beacause of only two turrets and torpedoes.