4th Tier USN DD Captain Skill?

[Lieutenant_Horn]

I just bought the Mahan, and have also unlocked enough points for the 4th tier captain skill. I need to know what you all think I should get: Last Stand or AFT? Go!

[TASK_FORCE_16]

i say last stand because nothing pisses me off more than being dead in the water or sent into a collision course with an island

[_Sarcasticat_]

i say last stand because nothing pisses me off more than being dead in the water or sent into a collision course with an island

Always remember the Island loves you back. 

[x2_Weekends]

Last Stand is a must have for all DD captains, USN or IJN alike.  You lose your rudder/engines way too easily to not take this skill.  And if you don't take Last Stand, you are literally handicapping yourself. 

[10T0nHammer]

I don't see last Stand being very useful honestly, DDs drop like Flies as soon as they are spotted and keeping your rudder going might not be the solution,, advance firing training would increase gun range but better yet, increase your AA bubble which can be helpful with defensivdefensive fire

[Ivlerlin]

It depends on how you play. Personally I'd try to take both in the end. 

 

ATF favors a more defensive DDE style. 

Last Stand favors a more aggressive style. 

 

Last Stand is the better general purpose skill. Since it means you only need to worry about fire and floods. 

 

But AFT gives that extra reach which means more shots fired from the safer distance which hopefully translate to more hits/damage. 

 

Since US DD's aren't my primary grind focus so I'd opt for ATF. That way he can hop into my Sims or Atlanta and provide better AA support. 

[SneakyBote]

I prefer demolition expert. +3% means a lot when the base fire chance is only 5%, and if you are like me and prefer to use your guns as a means of harassing enemy ships from a safe distance, extra fires will boost your damage by a lot (5" HE alone doesn't hurt that much in the pitiful volumes your 4 guns can produce).

 

AFT is of questionable use due to the extreme hang time of the 5"/38 gun. There have been many times where I regret not having last stand, so if you don't want the fire chance I recommend last stand over AFT.

[Lieutenant_Horn]

Yeah, it is a hard decision. I'm grooming this captain for use with the Gearing, so I'm looking at more than just the use of skills on the Mahan. I'd be curious what your fire chance actually is with demolition expert on heavy cruisers and battleships.

[SneakyBote]

I'd be curious what your fire chance actually is with demolition expert on heavy cruisers and battleships.

 

Read this post: http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/38735-fire-prevention-and-demolition-expert-the-math/

[EliZacharias]

I just bought the Mahan, and have also unlocked enough points for the 4th tier captain skill. I need to know what you all think I should get: Last Stand or AFT? Go!

 

Last stand all the way. With it you can still maneuver and move.  I've kept 32 knot speed going with dead engine and last stand in my Benson

 

edit ^^good thread to bookmark

[SeaRaptor]

Last Stand is a must.  You don't even have to take damage for your engines and/or rudder to get knocked out; shells close to you can do that.  Last Stand allows you to still have mobility to attempt escape without blowing your repair cooldown (which you might yet need to put out a fire).

[Lieutenant_Horn]

I think I'm going to go with AFT. Invisi-firing seems to be pretty OP ATM. I'm basically training this captain for the eventual Gearing. Thanks for your input.

[sushimaster]

I think I'm going to go with AFT. Invisi-firing seems to be pretty OP ATM. I'm basically training this captain for the eventual Gearing. Thanks for your input.

I tried AFT on my Gearing and it didn't work out that well, can barely hit anythjng at 12+ kms. Also immediately regretted not having last stand, theres this moment where my steering broke and i have no repair left, rammed straight into a Tirpitz while my torp was off cd, with last stand i could have break away and torpes that BB. After a couple of game, i went back to last stand. I like to get in close and personal, AFT just doesn't fit my playstyle at all.

[Falls_USMC]

I tried AFT on my Gearing and it didn't work out that well, can barely hit anythjng at 12+ kms. Also immediately regretted not having last stand, theres this moment where my steering broke and i have no repair left, rammed straight into a Tirpitz while my torp was off cd, with last stand i could have break away and torpes that BB. After a couple of game, i went back to last stand. I like to get in close and personal, AFT just doesn't fit my playstyle at all.

 

I'm experimenting with something new for the Gearing. I sacrificed the level 5 skill in order to get AFT, Demo Expert and the 1 point skill for 10% reload and AA efficiency. So far only played one game with it, but it went well. 202 hits, 7 fires, and sunk two ships with guns and took a North Carolina down to about 2k health and another ship secured (read: stole) that kill. Did about 60k damage with guns and fires. Not having Last Stand is a little nerve wracking, but if I only use it when necessary, and save my smoke for when I'm immobilized, I think I have a decent chance. I'll probably make a post about it once I have a real body of work to see how well it does, but the first game was a lot of fun. 

 

[sushimaster]

 

I'm experimenting with something new for the Gearing. I sacrificed the level 5 skill in order to get AFT, Demo Expert and the 1 point skill for 10% reload and AA efficiency. So far only played one game with it, but it went well. 202 hits, 7 fires, and sunk two ships with guns and took a North Carolina down to about 2k health and another ship secured (read: stole) that kill. Did about 60k damage with guns and fires. Not having Last Stand is a little nerve wracking, but if I only use it when necessary, and save my smoke for when I'm immobilized, I think I have a decent chance. I'll probably make a post about it once I have a real body of work to see how well it does, but the first game was a lot of fun. 

 

I also experiemented with that skill who give 3% bonus fire chance instead of AFT and replaced the -15% torp reload for the +16% range equipment, total 12.9 kms range but I didn't find it make much of a different on starting fire and this style make me commit on staying so far all the time, just not fun because i basically remove the versatile play style of the Gearing. Keep us updated on your finding tho, who know it might just work.

[Lieutenant_Horn]

Update: So far I have partially regretted my decision. I've died 3 times so far due to engine or steering being taken out. Very frustrating. However, the increased range has helped alot on the more open maps. I've been able to turn back 2 BBs and a CA by myself due to my large volume of fire and fires caused.

 

Still a split decision for me, but I won't know the end result until I get the upgraded torpedoes. 4.5km is still way to short in higher tier matches.

[Arzoo]

The upgraded torpedoes are a trap to make you take the hull upgrade. Don't fall for it; the 5th gun on the stock hull is more valuable than the better torpedoes. Wargaming even agrees: next update will change hulls so you don't lose it on the upgrade (among other buffs). Until then, stock Mahan hull is best.

[orci]

I have Advanced Firing Training on my Benson at the moment but don't find myself firing at max range a lot because of the ridiculous travel times and dispersion at long range.

 

When I get enough points for my T5 skill I plan on picking up concealment expert and then retraining into either Last Stand or Demolition Expert.

 

I'm leaning towards Demo Expert, as currently I find myself running premium repair which handles most rudder/engine issues easily. I don't get spotted unless I intend to, so there's not a whole lot of times Last Stand would actually be useful to me.

[Xenomancers]

I think we all want this AFT to work. Unfortunately it just doesn't. Your stock range is about the upper limit of your guns effective range and that's even pushing it.

 

If your goal is to set your captain up for gearing - here is what you want.

 

situational awareness lvl 1

basic fire training

torpedo reload

superintendent

last stand

concealment expert

 

Then if you play another 300 games on her you will have enough to get turret traverse too. They are going to be remaking the captains tree sometime in the future too so I'd say just get what you can out of your captain while you can. I will say though running gearing without last stand is not wise. If you want to fight other gearing while being dead in the water - that just doesn't last long!

[Falls_USMC]

I think we all want this AFT to work. Unfortunately it just doesn't. Your stock range is about the upper limit of your guns effective range and that's even pushing it.

 

If your goal is to set your captain up for gearing - here is what you want.

 

situational awareness lvl 1

basic fire training

torpedo reload

superintendent

last stand

concealment expert

 

Then if you play another 300 games on her you will have enough to get turret traverse too. They are going to be remaking the captains tree sometime in the future too so I'd say just get what you can out of your captain while you can. I will say though running gearing without last stand is not wise. If you want to fight other gearing while being dead in the water - that just doesn't last long!

 

100% agreed. I've spent several hundred gold messing around with different specs on the Gearing and the one listed above is what I'm running now and seems to work the best. I don't play the ship enough to consider myself even remotely consider myself an expert in it, but the same spec works wonders on the Fletcher as well. 

[Kuckoo]

Last Stand will save your backside many, many times.  Last Stand is one of those "compulsory" training skills to get if you drive destroyers.

 

Particularly for American Destroyers, the guns are quite good enough without AFT.

[Crucis]

I'm with those who suggest Last Stand.  The extra range for the Mahan's guns from AFT just isn't worth it, due to the considerable hang time of the shells.  If you're driving a DD and you get hit, you will lose your engines or rudder ... often.  Last Stand basically means that you can mostly ignore those engine and rudder hits, and save your DC parties for other things.

[Morpheus29]

Last Stand IS A MUST!

[bad_arcade_kitty]

i'd seriously consider demolition expert

[centarina]

I have Cleveland captain that has DE,  I may restart american DD line and move him over starting with farragut.  I don't play cleveland anymore, so I can sell it.   I will let you guys know how taht works out.