Where are the carrier nerfs?

[rocketdrive]

Carriers are still deleting every, yes every, class of ship with little to no effort, meanwhile battleships are still entirely reliant on RNGesus to say whether they get to even play the game. 

 

inb4 blind neg-rep bombing from mad carrier and cruiser mains 

 

EDIT: -12 oh gee how did I guess. oh the humanity, how dare I suggest battleships actually get to play the game without entirely relying on RNGesus to do so as well as suggest carriers have counter play. 

[Red_Raven_168]

Hi Rocket - long time no see

 

how have you been

 

here have some forum encouragement

[rocketdrive]

Hi Rocket - long time no see

 

how have you been

 

here have some forum encouragement

 

When did I become famous on this forum?

[Red_Raven_168]

 

When did I become famous on this forum?

 

its about nurturing our own

[Joiea]

Do you... Really Think... that carriers aren't reliant on RNG?

[rocketdrive]

Do you... Really Think... that carriers aren't reliant on RNG?

 

and what about carriers is RNG reliant?

[Fog_Heavy_Cruiser_Chokai]

I don't know you put considering your status- -95- I would say you are a known troll. However, I have no proof.

 

On topic- only good carriers are the ones that you see. There are tons of bad ones, but they don't kill you so you don't notice. I am horrid at carriers tbh. And I have died in BBs to carriers- it was my fault. As soon as you see a TB heading your way start to turn. If I die by only one torp, because I am weak, then I would have died of that carrier was a cruiser, Bb, or DD.

 

[Killer1941]

Hey it's our residential CV fan.

[rocketdrive]

I don't know you put considering your status- -95- I would say you are a known troll. However, I have no proof.

 

On topic- only good carriers are the ones that you see. There are tons of bad ones, but they don't kill you so you don't notice. I am horrid at carriers tbh. And I have died in BBs to carriers- it was my fault. As soon as you see a TB heading your way start to turn. If I die by only one torp, because I am weak, then I would have died of that carrier was a cruiser, Bb, or DD.

 

 

clearly because the interface is slightly hard to use carriers don't have to account for range, speed of their own ship, speed of target ship, position, angle of attack, or travel time......ohwait....

 

Just cause YOU are bad at carriers doesn't mean carriers are in any way balanced. 

[rocketdrive]

Hey it's our residential CV fan.

 

again, when did I become famous here?

[Red_Raven_168]

and he's our resident CV fan - and he deserves all of our kindness

 

somehow this comes to mind

 

 

[Fog_Heavy_Cruiser_Chokai]

 

clearly because the interface is slightly hard to use carriers don't have to account for range, speed of their own ship, speed of target ship, position, angle of attack, or travel time......ohwait....

 

Just cause YOU are bad at carriers doesn't mean carriers are in any way balanced. 

 

You are missing the point. A great CV player is a great player, a great CA player is a great player, etc etc. CVs are far more visible and honestly, they bring a lot of advantages- sight via planes is one. There is a reason the Pacific was won by CVs and not BBs.

[Pyrofiend]

 

and what about carriers is RNG reliant?

 

Fighters, dive bombers, bomb damage, and interaction with AA. So... pretty much everything except for TB aiming and spread.

 

Oh and don't forget that CVs have to pray to the MM that they get a decent opponent who is not multiple tiers higher.

[VTAdmiral]

The biggest carrier nerf is already implemented into the game

 

It's called paying attention.

[Elysion]

show me a great anything else that has a 90+% winrate over several hundred battles.

 

Its clear there is an issue

[rocketdrive]

 

Fighters, dive bombers, bomb damage, and interaction with AA. So... pretty much everything except for TB aiming and spread.

 

Oh and don't forget that CVs have to pray to the MM that they get a decent opponent who is not multiple tiers higher.

 

Because fighters and bomb damage things that ships actually fear...ohwait...

 

AA RNGesus actually favors the carrier by quite a bit AND every ship already has to worry about RNGesus. Literally the only way to screw over a carrier is to put it against a full team of cleveland's or anything with the AA consumable. Other than that Carriers are EZ mode once you figure out the UI. 

[Carrier_Ikoma]

Carriers are still deleting every, yes every, class of ship with little to no effort, meanwhile battleships are still entirely reliant on RNGesus to say whether they get to even play the game. 

 

inb4 blind neg-rep bombing from mad carrier and cruiser mains 

 

I know I shouldn't feed the troll, but... They've been nerfed nearly every patch in the 3.x series.

 

Except for USN carriers, which were underperforming and got a torpedo buff.

[SwirvinBirds]

 

You are missing the point. A great CV player is a great player, a great CA player is a great player, etc etc. CVs are far more visible and honestly, they bring a lot of advantages- sight via planes is one. There is a reason the Pacific was won by CVs and not BBs.

 

Problem is a great carrier player will outplay a great battleship player.

[rocketdrive]

The biggest carrier nerf is already implemented into the game

 

It's called paying attention.

 

paying attention doesn't outmaneuver planes. 

[rocketdrive]

 

I know I shouldn't feed the troll, but... They've been nerfed nearly every patch in the 3.x series.

 

Except for USN carriers, which were underperforming and got a torpedo buff.

 

And this justified Carriers hard countering everything without AA consumable while battleship only soft counter themselves...how? 

 

Just cause you've been hit with the nerf bat multiple times doesn't mean you've been nerfed hard enough. Even if they get nerfed again, doesn't mean that nerf will actually fix carrier play. 

 

I fail to see the "troll" in that. 

[Fog_Heavy_Cruiser_Chokai]

show me a great anything else that has a 90+% winrate over several hundred battles.

 

Its clear there is an issue

 

This is true not arguing with stats. I simply think instead of nerfing carriers we should buff the other classes. WG seems to go overboard with the nerfbat sometimes. 

[rocketdrive]

 

This is true not arguing with stats. I simply think instead of nerfing carriers we should buff the other classes. WG seems to go overboard with the nerfbat sometimes. 

 

They already went overboard when everyone baselessly accused BB's of being OP. Especially in this instance they really cant go overboard unless they set the damage to 0 considering flooding both slows the ship afflicted and does more damage per tick than 3 fires for a longer period of time. 

[Elysion]

 

This is true not arguing with stats. I simply think instead of nerfing carriers we should buff the other classes. WG seems to go overboard with the nerfbat sometimes. 

 

Its more complicated than that because the core of the carriers strength comes from its ability to be everywhere and anywhere.

 

A carrier is not just what it can do straight up in terms of how much damage it can put out or how hard or easy its planes are to shoot down. Nerfing any of these things wont address the actual issue of carriers directly, and it would be very hard to tweak them so that it indirectly affects them with out flat out making carriers useless.

 

When a carrier sends some planes out to attack something, it is not only effecting the target it ends up attacking, its changes what every ship its planes get near does on the way there and back.

 

A carrier can displace an enemy team better than anything else, and because of this in the past I have said that if carriers did no damage at all, but we could still make people think they could, they would still be the strongest class of ship.

 

The problem is their ability to disrupt what large parts of the enemy team are doing comes from the fear of their potential damage. So if you nerf carriers so that people just dont even worry about them, then you take away not only their direct damage impact, but also their ability to manipulate the flow of the game.

 

It is manipulating the flow of the game that good carrier players use to win a lot, knowing what to attack, when to attack it, where and how to move the planes to what you are attacking, what to do with the planes after you have attacked is all very important. When you make decisions as a CV you have to think not only about what to kill but about the position of your team and the enemy team, the morale, psychological, and material impact on your team and the enemy team.

 

Every class of ship can do mind games, but everything that is not a CV is stuck in place and only able to influence their general area.

 

The problem is that most players just target fixate and dont really think about what they are doing, have no situational awareness, and just kind of float around. Such a CV, even if they are good at manual dropping, will probably not do amazingly well

 

While you can argue that CVs shouldn't be able to just delete people, that the issue is AA nerf or point blank drops or whatever, none of that would really fix anything. Sure it makes CVs even stronger, and sure CVs could absorb a nerf there and carry right on, but its only a part of why you see good CV players with 80% and even 90% win rates.

 

The key to bringing CVs in line would be, then, one of two thigns.

 

1. Somehow make it so other ships can influence the ENTIRE MAP the same way a CV can

2. Limit a CVs ability to actually influence more than its immediate surroundings.

 

Both are basically a complete redesign, and probably unfeasible.

 

 

[rocketdrive]

 

Its more complicated than that because the core of the carriers strength comes from its ability to be everywhere and anywhere.

 

A carrier is not just what it can do straight up in terms of how much damage it can put out or how hard or easy its planes are to shoot down. Nerfing any of these things wont address the actual issue of carriers directly, and it would be very hard to tweak them so that it indirectly affects them with out flat out making carriers useless.

 

When a carrier sends some planes out to attack something, it is not only effecting the target it ends up attacking, its changes what every ship its planes get near does on the way there and back.

 

A carrier can displace an enemy team better than anything else, and because of this in the past I have said that if carriers did no damage at all, but we could still make people think they could, they would still be the strongest class of ship.

 

The problem is their ability to disrupt what large parts of the enemy team are doing comes from the fear of their potential damage. So if you nerf carriers so that people just dont even worry about them, then you take away not only their direct damage impact, but also their ability to manipulate the flow of the game.

 

It is manipulating the flow of the game that good carrier players use to win a lot, knowing what to attack, when to attack it, where and how to move the planes to what you are attacking, what to do with the planes after you have attacked is all very important. When you make decisions as a CV you have to think not only about what to kill but about the position of your team and the enemy team, the morale, psychological, and material impact on your team and the enemy team.

 

Every class of ship can do mind games, but everything that is not a CV is stuck in place and only able to influence their general area.

 

The problem is that most players just target fixate and dont really think about what they are doing, have no situational awareness, and just kind of float around. Such a CV, even if they are good at manual dropping, will probably not do amazingly well

 

While you can argue that CVs shouldn't be able to just delete people, that the issue is AA nerf or point blank drops or whatever, none of that would really fix anything. Sure it makes CVs even stronger, and sure CVs could absorb a nerf there and carry right on, but its only a part of why you see good CV players with 80% and even 90% win rates.

 

The key to bringing CVs in line would be, then, one of two thigns.

 

1. Somehow make it so other ships can influence the ENTIRE MAP the same way a CV can

2. Limit a CVs ability to actually influence more than its immediate surroundings.

 

Both are basically a complete redesign, and probably unfeasible.

 

 

 

1. can be solved by both giving carriers limited range and lighting them when planes go to land on them.

 

2. can be solved by making battleships accurate AS WELL AS switch the types of planes the battleship can cruiser can launch. 

[Hunter_Steel]

 

1. can be solved by both giving carriers limited range and lighting them when planes go to land on them.

 

2. can be solved by making battleships accurate AS WELL AS switch the types of planes the battleship can cruiser can launch. 

 

Surely you jest. I literally have no problems with carriers. And my negs aren't going to you so that they can feed an obvious neg farmer.

 

~Hunter