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Stun_Crazy

Im starting to regret going down the USSR path.

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I don't like the ships I use currently which are the Shchors, Borodino, and Pyotr Bagration. I'm not sure If I just suck or I should switch to American/ British ships that appeal to me like the Atlanta (Which will take a lot of grinding to get). Idk Maybe I just suck. Should I sell my ships to get spots for new ones?

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Since you’re new, US or IJN are the usual easiest starters.

Brit and German after that.

I would avoid selling anything if you can. Why pay for something twice?

(Cost is 200%, refund for selling once is just 50%, and therefore a huge loss.)

Edited by Estimated_Prophet
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Pyotr Bagration's actually a low key good Cruiser.

 

The Tech Tree Russian Light Cruisers excel at long range fighting.  Schors for example I had a great time with as I knew to stay at long range and keep the guns firing.

1.  RU Cruisers are bad concealment Cruisers as a whole.  You're not sneaking up on anyone.

2.  They tend to have very wide turning circle radius, coupled with an average looking rudder shift time.  This means that while they begin to respond to your rudder shift commands decently, they carry out their turns lazily, if that makes sense.  This is bad if you need to suddenly turn because of an emergency.  You'll do these awful, slow turns and get Citadeled.

3.  RU Crusiers are BIG Cruisers.  Big Cruisers are nice, big targets.

4.  RU Cruisers as a whole have very poor Citadel protection.  Either their armor belts suck or their Citadels are very high.  There are some RU Cruisers where the armor belt is so thin that they get Citadeled by 203mm SAP shells.  FYI, that cannot happen even to Tier V Omaha and Emerald, ships notoriously easy to delete, but at least their armor belts are too thick to be SAP Citadeled.  Some RU Cruisers have poor Citadel protection AND their Cits sit high out of the water.

5.  Their turret traverse is quite mediocre.

 

This makes RU Cruisers really bad at playing super close.  They react poorly to surprises.  They're too large for playing up close, too clumsy, too vulnerable.

 

However, they got certain strengths:

1.  Fantastic gun range, especially their Light Cruisers

2.  High velocity shells and low shell arcs.

3.  Decently fast.

 

You take that Schors of yours, stay at long range, where it's harder to hit you, Battleship shells hanging longer in the air giving you more time to use your WASD keys and evade the salvos.

The Russian 152mm guns are the best CL guns at long range.  Use it that way, stay at ranges where you're consistently hitting while enemies have a harder time trying to nail you.

 

Master those tenets and I promise you, those skills you learn on Schors will scale better when you hit the later tiers.  High Tier combat (Tiers VIII-X) are all about long range combat.  And RU CLs are great in long range combat.

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15 minutes ago, Stun_Crazy said:

I don't like the ships I use currently which are the Shchors, Borodino, and Pyotr Bagration. I'm not sure If I just suck or I should switch to American/ British ships that appeal to me like the Atlanta (Which will take a lot of grinding to get). Idk Maybe I just suck. Should I sell my ships to get spots for new ones?

The tier 10 are the prize.

Petro, nvesky and Kremlin extremely over powered when played right.

Watch YouTube videos from Clyde plays, Malteseknight,  and Potato Quality to find out how to play each ship.once you figure them out they are strong.

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Bag'o'rations is a great Op ship and great for certain CA mission types. I'd say it is my fav Tier VIII CA along with Mainz.

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7 minutes ago, Singularity_invader said:

Whatever you do, never sell a premium ship, good or bad.

Wasn't gonna. I was going to sell the other ones though but Ill give it a few more weeks

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3 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

. I'm not sure If I just suck or I should switch to American/ British ships that appeal to me like the Atlanta (Which will take a lot of grinding to get). 

 

You don't grind the Atlanta, you crack open your wallet if you want it.

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4 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

Wasn't gonna. I was going to sell the other ones though but Ill give it a few more weeks

Play them exactly like HazeGrayUnderway described, they are meant to be played at range.

The Petro is a bow tanker and nearly impossible to kill unless you catch it on its broadside and Nevsky makes for an excellent long-range kiting type ship.

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5 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

I don't like the ships I use currently which are the Shchors, Borodino, and Pyotr Bagration. I'm not sure If I just suck or I should switch to American/ British ships that appeal to me like the Atlanta (Which will take a lot of grinding to get). Idk Maybe I just suck. Should I sell my ships to get spots for new ones?

Don't sell anything.....  That's worse than owning a ship that doesn't like you.....   Trust everyone so far that has said that....it's sage advice if you are staying in this game.

It's simple:  everyone of us that have been here more than two years or so has had "a ship line" or "individual ships" that simply hate you......  I'm an IJN main and the Amagi (tier 8 BB) almost drove me out of this game.....  I could not for the life of me get her to be anything other than a target.....  But, a lot of videos later and some long Random battles, I managed to grind through her and my incompatibility.

And, "sucking" really isn't an issue because we don't have "skill gates" anywhere in this game......  HAVE FUN.......first and foremost and work with your clan in "divisions" to learn what everyone else in your clan knows....

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7 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

I don't like the ships I use currently which are the Shchors, Borodino, and Pyotr Bagration. I'm not sure If I just suck or I should switch to American/ British ships that appeal to me like the Atlanta (Which will take a lot of grinding to get). Idk Maybe I just suck. Should I sell my ships to get spots for new ones?

 

I think the question you need to ask is what made you pick the Russian line in the first place.  What quality of theirs attracted you to them?  Most lines in the game can be made to work, and if you like a line for one reason or another, it's usually better to run than a line you think is better but you don't like as much.  Remember that playing this game is about enjoying it, so think about what you like in the ships you want to run.

 

Alot of people in the Community can give you very good advice (we might disagree quite a bit on some issues, but we do want to help our fellow players to play the game and enjoy it), so giving us information on what you like/want in a ship or what specific troubles you are having can go a long way in getting help in the game.

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This may have already been said, but the Soviet cruiser lines are probably the absolute roughest ship line for new players. They can't hide, they turn like bricks, and like all cruisers they pop like balloons if caught broadside or focused.

Don't get me wrong, they're damn good. But I'd stay away until learning the ropes on the US or IJN lines.

Also, I've got the Bagration and I am fiercely ambivalent about it. No, that phrase does not make sense. But it's true. Fast, decent-ish conceal, tanky for a T8 cruiser, wonderful ballistics and AP...paired with bottom-tier DPM, awful turning circle, and minimal utility. Really makes it hard to have a decisive impact on a match or rack up big numbers. But when a red cruiser flashes broadside at 16km, thinking it's safe, it can be pretty delicious.

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10 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

 Should I sell my ships to get spots for new ones?

No.  
Just purchase other ships and explore other lines for evaluation and comparison.  (Like @Estimated_Prophet said, no need to pay for them twice.)
Each ship in every line brings something to the table.  It's merely a question of figuring out what that "something" is and how to make it work for you.

50 minutes ago, JamesTomb said:

This may have already been said, but the Soviet cruiser lines are probably the absolute roughest ship line for new players. They can't hide, they turn like bricks, and like all cruisers they pop like balloons if caught broadside or focused.

Don't get me wrong, they're damn good.

LOL  :Smile_veryhappy:
Okay, that was both amusing and a fairly good summary of Russian Cruisers.
There are things that they do well, but, admittedly, turning isn't the forte' of the Chapayev or the Tallinn.  If one prefers cruiser hulls with lively handling, I suggest exploring the Italian line.  :-)

I encourage players to look carefully at the specifications and performances each ship brings to the table.
The numbers can be referenced via the wiki pages on the ships.  https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/World_of_Warships
Things like rudder-shift, turning radius, armor thickness and location/distribution, ordnance performance parameters and other details can be referenced via the wiki and the Port or Equipment menus in-game.
Compare ships you're considering with ships that you already like.  

Also learn about various play-styles.  There's more than one "right way" to play and some play styles are more compatible with certain ships and battle conditions.

Hope that helps.  Good luck & have fun.  

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6 hours ago, _GreyBeard_ said:
10 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

. I'm not sure If I just suck or I should switch to American/ British ships that appeal to me like the Atlanta (Which will take a lot of grinding to get). 

 

You don't grind the Atlanta, you crack open your wallet if you want it.

I think the Pan-Asian cruiser, the Chumphon, is a nice tech-tree alternative to the Atlanta, though.  :-)

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Cruisers in general tend to be more difficult to play because even small mistakes can often mean death. They require a lot of situational awareness to stay alive. This is even more true at tier 8+ because the offensive capabilities of ships increase more than defense at higher tiers.

When I started playing WOWS I mostly played cruisers too and usually had a rough time. When I branched out to DDs and BBs I was able to survive longer and better learn how to play the game and eventually improved. You might want to give that a try.

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8 hours ago, _GreyBeard_ said:

 

You don't grind the Atlanta, you crack open your wallet if you want it.

You can get a super container with 1000 doubloons

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5 hours ago, Jakob_Knight said:

 

I think the question you need to ask is what made you pick the Russian line in the first place.  What quality of theirs attracted you to them?  Most lines in the game can be made to work, and if you like a line for one reason or another, it's usually better to run than a line you think is better but you don't like as much.  Remember that playing this game is about enjoying it, so think about what you like in the ships you want to run.

 

Alot of people in the Community can give you very good advice (we might disagree quite a bit on some issues, but we do want to help our fellow players to play the game and enjoy it), so giving us information on what you like/want in a ship or what specific troubles you are having can go a long way in getting help in the game.

I was told the russian cruisers are in the median of everything so I thought I should pick them.

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I am a fan of Russian Cruisers.  Nevsky is a killer kiting/fire starter ship.  For somebody with not the best aim in the world, it really works for me.  I also really enjoyed playing Budyonny.  If your getting in close with these ships, you are going to be in trouble.  The biggest problem I had to overcome was to say dark until I was in kiting position.  Stay away, kite, start fires.  If this style of game appeals to you, I think you might change your mind.

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13 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

I don't like the ships I use currently which are the Shchors, Borodino, and Pyotr Bagration. I'm not sure If I just suck or I should switch to American/ British ships that appeal to me like the Atlanta (Which will take a lot of grinding to get). Idk Maybe I just suck. Should I sell my ships to get spots for new ones?

I understand you, i finished both the Russian heavy cruiser and battleship lines and i didn't enjoy the grinds, the last time i used Kremlin was the Convoy event and i've had Petro for almost two months and i've yet to play a single game with her, when i do other lines i usually just breeze right through them, no problem but for some reason the Russian line feels like slogging through mud, it feels very slow and tiresome, i don't think i'm going to do Russians DD's.

Edited by Acme1970

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53 minutes ago, Stun_Crazy said:

I was told the russian cruisers are in the median of everything so I thought I should pick them.

 

Ah, okay.  So you don't have any personal reason to use them.  That makes a decision a little easier.  What I might recommend is look at the other lines in the game and try to figure out if the qualities they have appeal to you.  The USN tends to be gun-focused, the IJN emphasize torpedoes, and other nations have their focus.  Then, look over some posts in the sections specific to ship types and/or YouTube videos to see what you can learn there before settling on a line.

 

If you do know what you want in your gameplay, post up here or elsewhere and the Community will give you plenty of advice to take or leave.  Just remember that we all speak from our own experiences.

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, JamesTomb said:

This may have already been said, but the Soviet cruiser lines are probably the absolute roughest ship line for new players. They can't hide, they turn like bricks, and like all cruisers they pop like balloons if caught broadside or focused.

Don't get me wrong, they're damn good. But I'd stay away until learning the ropes on the US or IJN lines.

Looking back at my newer player experiences, if one understood that RU CLs are at their best by hanging back and spamming their guns, they're actually the most simple to use Cruiser Line in the game.

Stay at 16, 17km+ and spam HE.  That's as simple as you can get.  Their strengths are catered to that.  The Line's characteristics actually demand it because to do otherwise gets you easily destroyed.

 

The lines that require you to fight at 15km or even less, that's dicier.  You're easier to hit the closer you get and the better the chances Battleships have on smashing a Cruiser below 15km.  North Carolina's very floaty shells is easy to use against the NC player at 17km.  But if your Cruiser has to hang around at 14km, 15km, that's a heavy dose of risk.

 

I know someone is going to eventually use the case of Zao, who can reach out and easily hit ships.  But Zao's range and shell flight characteristics is so unique that no other ship even in her own tech tree line can do what she does.  IJN Cruisers as a whole are like USN, mid range combatants.  Zao can snipe.

 

Hanging back and spamming HE at 17km+ with a RU Cruiser is a lot simpler than playing an IJN and USN Cruiser that has to creep close, worry more about concealment, what can they get away with.  Worry about some torpedoes out there that can go more than 10km.  If you're playing a Radar Cruiser role, it becomes way more complicated as you need to have a much clearer understanding of mechanics, getting a grasp of how the match is developing, and how your Radar Cruiser can best be employed to try and affect a win.  It becomes way riskier because Radar Cruiser play puts in way more torpedo ranges, easy CV and BB focus fire.  Screw it up and you become the closest, easiest to spot, easiest to delete target that enemy Battleship players will see.  Radar Cruiser play also puts you right in the sights of Submarines.  You are right in their torp and ping ranges.

 

Meanwhile, you can play a RU CL, stay at 17km or so, away from all but the most niche of torpedoes, and be at a distance that Battleship players deem too hard to hit, especially if one is awake and knows how to use their WASD keys.  And keep spamming the shells.  Non-stop.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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USSR CL has flatter shell arc that makes them easier to aim with at range...Shchors and Chapayev are largely the same thing so you might as well just stop it now if you don't like it.

Yeah, just spew HE at range and set fire as USSR CL, it's your strength, after all. Easy to land hits with at range.

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28 minutes ago, pyantoryng said:

USSR CL has flatter shell arc that makes them easier to aim with at range...Shchors and Chapayev are largely the same thing so you might as well just stop it now if you don't like it.

Yeah, just spew HE at range and set fire as USSR CL, it's your strength, after all. Easy to land hits with at range.

I ground the RU CL Line when it was pretty new, the game was <1 year old.  I had gotten to Tier VII Schors and when I first got her, I played her like I did my Atlanta and other US Cruisers I had been playing... Close range fighting.  Let me tell you, I got rekt hard.  I got what I deserved.  Then I recall how easy of a time I had with Tier VI Budyonny.

 

Stay back and shoot.

 

That's it.

 

I applied that again to VII Schors and had a fantastic time with her.  Stay back and be super annoying to people, because you're far back enough that their shells are too floaty and you're harder to hit.  Yet the RU 152mm guns fire their shells flat and fast, you hit targets easily at range than they can do the same to you.  Very few ships in the game can hang with RU CLs if they want to trade shells at long range.  You might win against them, but I promise you you'll pay dearly.

I applied those lessons with Schors and it was on that ship where I got my first Hackusation.

On 9/6/2018 at 1:21 PM, HazeGrayUnderway said:

You'll also lose karma from doing well, as some people think you're cheating!

 

I remember getting Hackused when using Schors, people complain how uncanny it was that this ship could easily and reliably hit targets at long range.  They just don't know how good the RU 152mm guns are at range, and I was in tune with that ship when I grinded with her.  Here is an old screenshot from waayyyy back in the day with such a Hackusation.  The guy was salty despite his team was winning.

Qnc8b8P.jpg

rapier_ape was the one that ended my run in that old match :Smile_teethhappy:

 

Below I wasn't being Hackused, but I was kiting multiple BBs and being an annoying **** to them.

On 9/10/2016 at 3:52 PM, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Schors' AP will actually do nicely.  If you got a good angle, use it.

 

Regarding her HE, if you have Demolition Expert, you will be embodiment of a Fire God this side of Tier X Zao.

 

Weaknesses - AWFUL ARMOR.  Mediocre rudder shift, turning.  Mediocre AA stats but at least has Defensive Fire to make CV drops "panic."

 

Strengths - Schors has only one good quality.  The guns are amazing.  They're Budyonny's 152mm guns but you have better range and have more with 12 rifles.  These guns are easy to shoot and hit targets at range.  They have a fast ROF.  You can torment Battleships at range with near impunity.  You can have a better time hitting other Cruisers at range than they do Schors if she plays at range.  She is one of the Cruisers that can and will reliably tap those annoying RU DDs at range.

 

How to use?  Very straight forward:  Schors is a Pure Ranged Fighter.  Do not brawl as her poor armor and mediocre handling are too weak for that.  Stay at range and pelt the enemy from afar.  Just make sure to do regular evasive movements to make you a harder target.  She is a Cruiser that can kite multiple Battleships, pelting them in turn with HE shells, giving them fires, accurately hitting them, while maneuvering at range and making them angry that they can't hit you.  This is similar to what Kutuzov does but she has shorter range and is a Tier VII.  Like Kutuzov, she is an ideal support ship.  Preferably be with other Non-DDs and lend your gunfire and lose yourself in the crowd, but make sure you make use of long range as much as possible.  When hunting DDs, do so at range, your guns are the best for it.  You should not be trying to close range on a DD.  KEEP EVERYTHING AT BAY.

 

This ship has so many awful or lackluster qualities, but her guns are so nice that it makes up for everything.

 

And...

sa63rJO.jpg

 

Back in the day when the game was newer, we even had a nickname for Tier VI Budyonny, provided one understood what RU CLs were about:  "My Buddy."

 

Stay at long range.

The enemy retreating?  Cool, push up but stay at long range.  Keep feeding them molotov cocktails!

Are the reds pushing?  Fantastic!  Kite away, keep the distance long, and feed them lots of molotov cocktails!

Your job is to wear people down.  Why get close and make it easier for the enemy team to harm your squishy RU CL?

 

@Stun_Crazy Something I forgot to mention.  Those high velocity and low arcing shells make RU CLs very good in shooting at Destroyers.  In terms of shooting up Destroyers, IMO, they are one of the best at it.  The only Cruiser Line that matches this lethality and ease of hitting Destroyers are Tier VIII+ Italian Heavy Cruisers.  If you see any Destroyers be sure to shoot them up.  Your comfort in ranges to engage them with will get better as you get the hang of how the RU 152mm guns and shells behave.  If you want to win more, helping the team in shooting Destroyers is a big way to get that.  From a DD's POV, fighting a 1-on-1 against another DD is hard enough.  It gets way harder if the other DD is getting gun support, and it's way worse if that gunfire is regularly connecting against you.  Any gun support you can provide your team's DDs against enemy DDs is greatly appreciated.  The DD game is all about attrition, and any external factor like a 152mm x12 HE salvo landing on or around your DD is a bad time.

Best case in helping shoot up DDs is the DD is killed.  Worst case is if you screw up your salvo, the enemy DD got its warning and it may be a bit more cautious to push up as aggressively as it did just now.  They know your team's DD is actually getting gun support, so now they have to be more careful.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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8 hours ago, Stun_Crazy said:

You can get a super container with 1000 doubloons

 

That's not grinding. That is wishful thinking.

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