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BornInChicago

I Wonder What the Official Submarine Survey results are

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WG will be tabulating the results from their main page popup official submarine survey.

Yes, there is lots of anger on the forums about subs. But I wonder what the "quiet majority" will say on the survey. And what WG will do.

And if subs are removed, will people get back XP and captains they invested in subs on the live server, I wonder.

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I wonder how many have a more or less of a apathetic view of subs. They won't be pounding on the premium shop door to buy whatever sub is available nor will they be threatening to quit or claiming they will no longer buy anything from WG.

These players will continue to play the game without saying much.

Like CVs, subs are here to stay. WG is trying to avoid a repeat of 8.0. In the end subs will be like CVs, mediocre at best in the view of players.

Considering its been over 3 years and the forum is full of threads calling for CVs to buffed or nerfed, I believe "mediocre" is an honest opinion on the state of CVs in this game.

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1 hour ago, kgh52 said:

I wonder how many have a more or less of a apathetic view of subs. They won't be pounding on the premium shop door to buy whatever sub is available nor will they be threatening to quit or claiming they will no longer buy anything from WG.

These players will continue to play the game without saying much.

Like CVs, subs are here to stay. WG is trying to avoid a repeat of 8.0. In the end subs will be like CVs, mediocre at best in the view of players.

Considering its been over 3 years and the forum is full of threads calling for CVs to buffed or nerfed, I believe "mediocre" is an honest opinion on the state of CVs in this game.

An oversimplification and strawman, since the argument has never been one of simply "OP" vs "not OP". But I digress.

A more interesting question is how many players have a more or less apathetic view of the entire game. In other words, what could WG conceivably add to the game, then point to interest/engagement among the "silent majority" as evidence of a sound decision. NTC and the first Dockyard event obviously moved the needle; but what else would register on a similar level?

Clearly not carriers, subs, or superships, so there is apparently plenty of room to expand the scope. Guided missiles seem like a logical next step, but beyond that my imagination fails me.

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I have been apathetic for a very long time in this game situation.

If WeeGee does not give a damn and continues to pound away at the square peg that wont go into the round hole of their own creation then we are all [edited]. They have proven not to give a damn with the blessed surveys and feedback and therefore I dont give a damn.

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4 hours ago, BornInChicago said:

WG will be tabulating the results from their main page popup official submarine survey.

Yes, there is lots of anger on the forums about subs. But I wonder what the "quiet majority" will say on the survey. And what WG will do.

And if subs are removed, will people get back XP and captains they invested in subs on the live server, I wonder.

the xp would likely go Free and the Captains to the reserve. 

 

If they decide to keep subs, I hope they fix MM so subs and CVs are not in the same game. Those games are absolutely brutal. 

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The subs are test ships.  It’s a free “get out of giving you XP” card. 
 

You keep your modules tho I think. 

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no matter what the results, subs wont be removed cause it will be more income for them.

 

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We are stuck with Pig Boats, WG has spent way too much time, effort, and money on them for them to not eventually end up in the game.

The best we can hope for is WG figures out how to make them fun to play against.

The response WG has had to feedback from the player base, does not cause much hope beyond they will at some point be released into the game.

To paraphrase something someone else posted in another thread "WG is so caught up in designing Subs they have forgotten the point of game they have designed."

 

Assuming positive intent, here's to Pig Boats being brought to the game in a manner that is palatable for all.

Cirran

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WeeGee sometimes has it's failures in glaring display of a inconvient truth when players do not pick up subs that have been made very simple to play. Because they dont do anything.

Then they made the subs strong enough to take a few hits and are able to do something with their time and effort in battle. People find out that the subs cannot be found, and if they are found they cannot be sunk or hurt very much. Its really grosteque and enraging if I am a Z52 for example with the awesome hydro and racks of depth charges that are really good with the famous german taste for gotterdummering kaboom having to chat to a nearby BB who has airstrikes that do work against this sub I found but cannot kill.

Its insulting to me. Having to beg a fat BB to kill this annoying sub directly under my tin can [edited].

And weegee wonders why I dont engage in behaviors they would love to see. Such as spending resources to play subs that they have spent years lovingly building in house.

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1 hour ago, JSFWRX85 said:

the xp would likely go Free and the Captains to the reserve. 

 

yes, the Captains to reserve, but the XP will more then likely go to the T1 ship.

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57 minutes ago, Lord_Slayer said:

yes, the Captains to reserve, but the XP will more then likely go to the T1 ship.

possible. Has that happened when ships were removed from tech trees before? I cant remember what happened when the odd number carriers were removed. 

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7 hours ago, BornInChicago said:

WG will be tabulating the results from their main page popup official submarine survey.

Yes, there is lots of anger on the forums about subs. But I wonder what the "quiet majority" will say on the survey. And what WG will do.

And if subs are removed, will people get back XP and captains they invested in subs on the live server, I wonder.

What main page popup official survey? In game? Website? I don't see a thing.

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7 hours ago, BornInChicago said:

WG will be tabulating the results from their main page popup official submarine survey.

Yes, there is lots of anger on the forums about subs. But I wonder what the "quiet majority" will say on the survey. And what WG will do.

And if subs are removed, will people get back XP and captains they invested in subs on the live server, I wonder.

Silent majority doesn't care enough to spend time on a survey. 

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7 minutes ago, BornInChicago said:

I do not recall where the official survey pop-up was, but it just popped up on my screen and asked me to take it. 

 

 

Weird, I never saw that one. I saw one last week in game about if I would recommend this game to other people. After I answered it the poll went away. Just the single question.

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2 hours ago, tjaluk said:

no matter what the results, subs wont be removed cause it will be more income for them.

 

Um....no.  When you break it down and look at them from a business case perspective submarines are much more likely to result in less income, not more.

 

The common assumption is that subs give another product for players to spend money whether they are current players or new players attracted to the "Submarine warfare" marketing, so it's just more on top what WG currently gets.

This could possibly be true when you assume all other factors such as current revenue from Premium time, premium ships, flags, doubloons, etc. all stay the exact same.  But any reasonable person knows that this is a fantasy assumption.  This is still a lack of solid customer research when it comes to customer purchase decisions for online games but common sense tells you that there is a probably a positive correlation between customer enjoyment or "fun" and their purchase decisions.  There have been many polls given by players, streamers, and other interested parties about submarines.  Many of these polls have poorly worded questions and other factors that would introduce additional bias, yet despite this they are all been remarkably consistent in showing 70 to 80% of players have a negative reaction to submarines.  Even if you seriously discount these surveys, it is safe to say that a significant portion of players will have a more negative overall experience in the game and this will in turn affect their purchase habits. 

In simple terms, this means that submarines are likely to lead to less revenue from existing products and that will very likely exceed the any amount of additional revenue from submarines.

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4 minutes ago, YouSatInGum said:

Um....no.  When you break it down and look at them from a business case perspective submarines are much more likely to result in less income, not more.

 

The common assumption is that subs give another product for players to spend money whether they are current players or new players attracted to the "Submarine warfare" marketing, so it's just more on top what WG currently gets.

This could possibly be true when you assume all other factors such as current revenue from Premium time, premium ships, flags, doubloons, etc. all stay the exact same.  But any reasonable person knows that this is a fantasy assumption.  This is still a lack of solid customer research when it comes to customer purchase decisions for online games but common sense tells you that there is a probably a positive correlation between customer enjoyment or "fun" and their purchase decisions.  There have been many polls given by players, streamers, and other interested parties about submarines.  Many of these polls have poorly worded questions and other factors that would introduce additional bias, yet despite this they are all been remarkably consistent in showing 70 to 80% of players have a negative reaction to submarines.  Even if you seriously discount these surveys, it is safe to say that a significant portion of players will have a more negative overall experience in the game and this will in turn affect their purchase habits. 

In simple terms, this means that submarines are likely to lead to less revenue from existing products and that will very likely exceed the any amount of additional revenue from submarines.

Yep, this. I've currently been back and forth with myself about purchasing 3 perma camos for some of my t10 ships I like to play. I'm still undecided because I don't like what I'm seeing the future of Wows is. Probably not the only one.

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It was a pretty detailed survey. It asked you for specifics about your experience both playing subs and playing against them, with different ships.

I hope they publish the results. Regardless of what they do about subs.

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1 hour ago, JSFWRX85 said:

possible. Has that happened when ships were removed from tech trees before? I cant remember what happened when the odd number carriers were removed. 

When the odd carriers were removed, the XP I had was dumped into my T4 carriers even though I had some T6 carriers that could have benefited from the disappearance of my T7s.

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Subs are fine. There's just some balancing and tweeking left to be done. I think it's unreasonable to expect to play a naval warfare game without the "naval warfare" part. Subs and CV's are part of that.

The people who hate CV's and subs are relics of the past. They remember WoWs in 2015 straight out of Beta, and they want to go back. Back in a day where you could drop a Yamato with an Umikaze.

They just want "World of Battleships" on easy mode. 

 

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5 minutes ago, ElectroVeeDub said:

The people who hate CV's and subs are relics of the past. They remember WoWs in 2015 straight out of Beta, and they want to go back. Back in a day where you could drop a Yamato with an Umikaze.

They just want "World of Battleships" on easy mode. 

 

Those people are also the majority of the player base...It's posts like this that make it hard to have constructive and civil conversations on here...You ought to think at least once before you post...Or just stop entirely if this is the kind of thing your going to bring...

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7 minutes ago, ElectroVeeDub said:

Subs are fine. There's just some balancing and tweeking left to be done. I think it's unreasonable to expect to play a naval warfare game without the "naval warfare" part. Subs and CV's are part of that.

The people who hate CV's and subs are relics of the past. They remember WoWs in 2015 straight out of Beta, and they want to go back. Back in a day where you could drop a Yamato with an Umikaze.

They just want "World of Battleships" on easy mode. 

 

No, a game based on some sort of balance.  Reality is already out the window.  People like to have counter play not just run or deal with it.  With random drops EVERY ship needs to have viable options with dealing with each other.  This can't be just one way or needing team mates to do it for them.  That's unrealistic considering the random drops that occur. 

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39 minutes ago, YouSatInGum said:

Um....no.  When you break it down and look at them from a business case perspective submarines are much more likely to result in less income, not more.

 

The common assumption is that subs give another product for players to spend money whether they are current players or new players attracted to the "Submarine warfare" marketing, so it's just more on top what WG currently gets.

This could possibly be true when you assume all other factors such as current revenue from Premium time, premium ships, flags, doubloons, etc. all stay the exact same.  But any reasonable person knows that this is a fantasy assumption.  This is still a lack of solid customer research when it comes to customer purchase decisions for online games but common sense tells you that there is a probably a positive correlation between customer enjoyment or "fun" and their purchase decisions.  There have been many polls given by players, streamers, and other interested parties about submarines.  Many of these polls have poorly worded questions and other factors that would introduce additional bias, yet despite this they are all been remarkably consistent in showing 70 to 80% of players have a negative reaction to submarines.  Even if you seriously discount these surveys, it is safe to say that a significant portion of players will have a more negative overall experience in the game and this will in turn affect their purchase habits. 

In simple terms, this means that submarines are likely to lead to less revenue from existing products and that will very likely exceed the any amount of additional revenue from submarines.

People have been saying this since the CV rework, but WOWS hasn't taken their foot off the gas on these things.  If anything, they've added a second accelerator peddle and placed an anvil over both.

Either:

1.  WG is willfully ignoring that they are losing income. OR

2.  They are still showing profits in the positive direction.

TBH I don't know which (because I kind of agree with you).

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16 minutes ago, ElectroVeeDub said:

Subs are fine. There's just some balancing and tweeking left to be done. I think it's unreasonable to expect to play a naval warfare game without the "naval warfare" part. Subs and CV's are part of that.

The people who hate CV's and subs are relics of the past. They remember WoWs in 2015 straight out of Beta, and they want to go back. Back in a day where you could drop a Yamato with an Umikaze.

They just want "World of Battleships" on easy mode. 

 

Pardon me please?

I think WoWs on 'easy mode' means to drop any ship on the map by your choice without trading in any HP or being invisible all the time, ignore any damage, and send out torpedoes without aiming. 

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