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ArIskandir

Concealment centered Design proposal for Submarines

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As the saying goes, it is only too late if you never try. So, I'm submitting this idea as the Core mechanic for Submarine gameplay (instead of you know, what-da-ping).

CORE CONCEPT

Submarines are a Concealment based class, as such their distinctive characteristic in WoWS is variable Concealment values which behaves dynamically depending on the Submarine actions. In order for players to keep track of their own concealment in an easy, practical way, we present you the "Conceal-o-Meter":

ZjPJYht.png

Using a visual Gauge players will be able to easily and intuitivelly learn how to manage their concealment. The base Concealment value for Submarines is their standard surface Concealment value. Some actions increase concealment, some actions decrease concealment, modifying the base value. On general Concealment terms, the deeper the Sub is, the better; the faster it moves and more noise it makes, the worse. Travelling underwater at high speeds, pings, use of certain consumables, etc will have a negative impact. This all adds up to a base underwater Concealment value, which is the distance the Submarine can be detected by "natural" means by Surface ships.

This way, Submarine gameplay becomes truly focused on stealth and Concealment management. This, along Dive Time are the prime assets for a Submarine player. 

 

A SPOTTED SUBMARINE IS A DEAD SUBMARINE

Counterplay against Submarines should be focused on breaking their Concealment, once revealed and in plain view, Surface ships should have the tools to deliver effective and consistent damage to Submarines. To this end, the game must provide a set of Detection tools and consumables able to break Submarine concealment in a determined location. Similarly to current Hydroacustic search, new consumables like ASDIC/SONAR could provide detection at extended ranges, but shorter action time. Deployable detection tools like sonobouys and directional SONAR pings could help round up the arsenal of detection tools available for Surface ships.

As tools for delivering damage, I think DC Airstrike is an adequate concept (the particular values for time-to-target and damage can be adjusted as needed for balanced interactions) for medium-long range, for short range some form of directional DC-Hedgehog proyector, with traditional DC "drops" for point-blank attacks. 

 

WiP will be editing OP

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First of all, I love the "Conceal-o-meter"(TM). I honestly didn't realize until halfway through that I was reading your post like an ad haha. 

So, I have a couple points. First, your concept is very similar to the last iteration of subs, where they very much got nuked by everyone who had airstrike planes. While I dislike subs, this is not what I think anyone wants in the game. Imagine being a DD or a cruiser and going from 100% to 0% health in less than 30 seconds every time you get spotted...

On the flip side, subs are waaaaaay too tanky right now. It was hard enough to spot the buggers before, but now even when spotted it's hard to kill them. So, I personally think there is a middle ground between the last and current iteration of subs health and survivability to make them work. 

Not to rain on your parade, but to me it's a little unclear as to how your concealometer is different from the current values that appear on-screen as you dive to certain depths. As a sub player, like any other ship one would expect the captain to learn their concealment values and make their plays accordingly. 

As for detection mechanics, I don't think your suggestions are bad, but I'm just not convinced that that's the answer. Still, any idea is better than one, so +1 for posting this. 

Edited by Grand_Admiral_Murrel

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8 minutes ago, Grand_Admiral_Murrel said:

Not to rain on your parade, but to me it's a little unclear as to how your concealometer is different from the current values that appear on-screen as you dive to certain depths. As a sub player, like any other ship one would expect the captain to learn their concealment values and make their plays accordingly. 

Basically it would be a clear way to visualize your concealment changes when factoring Speed and Depth without needing to learn a 5x5 matrix of values.

8 minutes ago, Grand_Admiral_Murrel said:

So, I personally think there is a middle ground between the last and current iteration of subs health and survivability to make them work. 

That's an inherent problem for the current path, making Subs more visible (so there can be more "interactions") implies making them more tanky, frustration just gets displaced to not being able to blap the Subs quickly. 

Edited by ArIskandir

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3 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

Basically it would be a clear way to visualize your concealment changes when factoring Speed and Depth without needing to learn a 5x5 matrix of values.

12 minutes ago, Grand_Admiral_Murrel said:

I get you. Yes, something to make it easier to interpret would improve the quality of life of subs. 

4 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

That's an inherent problem for the current path, making Subs more visible (so there can be more "interactions") implies making them more tanky, frustration just gets displaced to not being able to blap the Subs quickly. 

Couldn't agree with you more. Honestly, I feel like WG have gone about balancing these things completely wrong. They have better stealth than DDs and therefore are capable of landing some sneaky strikes. That should be counteracted by rate of fire, which currently is absurd imo. longer torpedo reloads would be nice, although I'm not going to pretend that's going to fix much. 

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