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dashtardly

Hoping that this isn't the new norm

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Wont two of three matches this morning where we won by capping.  What's unusual about that is that these were CO-OP matches. Both games had 3 submarines and all 3 were alive at the end.

image.thumb.png.c8e88598c6ccfa3948318f1e2d38462d.png

image.thumb.png.17e7b60b62f6a82d70e4c7f81f337ab1.png

I really hope that this is NOT the new normal

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I had a few games in a BB earlier with some green bot ASW ships, and I noticed that when they lost sight of an enemy sub they immediately popped their hydro.  I presume that's leftover code from playtest, and nobody let them know surface hydro doesn't work to find subs.  But it is interesting that they're programmed to think that it should.  

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14 minutes ago, buglips said:

I had a few games in a BB earlier with some green bot ASW ships, and I noticed that when they lost sight of an enemy sub they immediately popped their hydro.  I presume that's leftover code from playtest, and nobody let them know surface hydro doesn't work to find subs.  But it is interesting that they're programmed to think that it should.  

Maybe bots are showing their displeasure with WG dumb decision to gimp hydro

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1 minute ago, missile742 said:

Maybe bots are showing their displeasure with WG dumb decision to gimp hydro

Lol.  Yeah, some sort of sub-hunting equipment for ships supposed to hunt subs is definitely needed.  It might not fully mitigate the effect of leftover subs at match end, but it would at least be something.  I imagine quite a lot of players went into this test expecting that sort of thing to be baked-in, and having discovered that it is not it seems from my experience that a number of destroyer/cruisers captains have decided it's not really worth the bother and just go on to torp bigger targets.

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This is a live playtest of submarines.  Co-op happens to be the only venue to play them, so everyone that wants to play them is playing in co-op.  Once the rental period ends, things should settle down for a week or two until the next round of playtests.

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Oddly, I am now finding radar is helping to spot subs at the end of the match. Radared one while in the Missouri and fired HE and then quickly used the Air Strike to cause at least some damage....

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The current situation in Co-Op is not the norm.

 

Remember:

- People are getting free submarine drops.

- The only place to try these subs out is Co-Op.  Even guys that would avoid anything PVE related altogether, if they want to play their submarines, they can only try it in Co-Op.

- Technically Ranked & Co-Op are the only modes to play submarines.  However, Ranked is not active right now, so Co-Op is the only mode possible.

- Not even Training Room allows submarines.

 

This is why there are so many submarines in Co-Op.  In every server, the entire submarine population can only exist in Co-Op mode.

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52 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Not even Training Room allows submarines

And that was a stupid thing to not include.

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3 hours ago, dashtardly said:

Wont two of three matches this morning where we won by capping.  What's unusual about that is that these were CO-OP matches. Both games had 3 submarines and all 3 were alive at the end.

image.thumb.png.c8e88598c6ccfa3948318f1e2d38462d.png

image.thumb.png.17e7b60b62f6a82d70e4c7f81f337ab1.png

I really hope that this is NOT the new normal

Seems to me like the DDs on those teams didn't do their job of hunting and killing subs.  Of course, I don't know the details of what happened in these two battles.  I do think that part of "this" is going to be the new normal, i.e. the need for DDs to hunt and kill subs.  CLs can also kill subs, but they don't have the concealment of subs and thus would be more vulnerable to enemy gunfire.

 

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19 hours ago, Crucis said:

Seems to me like the DDs on those teams didn't do their job of hunting and killing subs.  Of course, I don't know the details of what happened in these two battles.  I do think that part of "this" is going to be the new normal, i.e. the need for DDs to hunt and kill subs.  CLs can also kill subs, but they don't have the concealment of subs and thus would be more vulnerable to enemy gunfire.

 

Well I don't recall the tier X game all that much except that the Harugumo was with me helping to cap C and we moved on to B.  I was the only DD in the other match (tier 6 vs tier 8 subs) and I recall capping at the end next to an island where one of the DDs was engaged by another ship not in cap) and I had an active ping and I could either play chase around the island or finish capping to win the game (I chose to finish cap). Throughout that game (until the end) I was not near the subs (initial placement) and I concentrated on the ships near me.  I do know after playing lots of DDs that chasing around the map to "find" a DD or "wait" until a sub shows up is not fun.

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21 hours ago, Efros said:

And that was a stupid thing to not include.

I think it was last year where we had PTS and Live Server "Submarine Battles" mini-event going on, it was the same thing.  I posted and complained about it then.

 

But Training Room has a lot of restrictions.  For example you can't put Premium Ships as opposing AI ships.

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5 hours ago, dashtardly said:

I do know after playing lots of DDs that chasing around the map to "find" a DD or "wait" until a sub shows up is not fun.

I know what you're saying.  But at the same time, if one is in a random battle (I realize that you were in coop), sometimes you really do need to go hunt for an enemy DD in your own DD if he represents a major threat to your remaining heavies, or he trying to take your caps in a close game.  And hunting down such a DD and killing it or assisting in the kill can be quite entertaining if you do something important to help your team win.

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37 minutes ago, Crucis said:

I know what you're saying.  But at the same time, if one is in a random battle (I realize that you were in coop), sometimes you really do need to go hunt for an enemy DD in your own DD if he represents a major threat to your remaining heavies, or he trying to take your caps in a close game.  And hunting down such a DD and killing it or assisting in the kill can be quite entertaining if you do something important to help your team win.

Touching on PVP "what ifs" since actual PVP is not possible ATM with subs:  Cruisers have more to worry about from subs than the Battleships.  The BBs are going to be further back unless they were being stupid and pushed up too early.  A bunch of Cruiser Lines are the same way, they have a more stand off playstyle like RU, FR, German, and even IJN to varying degrees.  But some Cruiser Lines play close up:  RNCLs and USN Radar Cruisers.  My old playstyle of using something like DM to be near the caps and support the DDs would be in great danger from enemy submarines.

 

There's also the question in the PVP setting, is if it's even feasible to make a depth charge run on a sub.  If the sub is somewhere out of the ways, yeah, green light and go get 'em!  But if there's other enemy ships in the area that can take potshots with reasonable range and accuracy, that may not be feasible.  It's the same thing as me trying to push up and Radar stealthed up DDs, but there are Battleships looking to blap anything.  I wouldn't last long if those BBs were there.

 

But for PVE purposes, at least here in Co-Op for now, it's money for DD players just waiting to get picked up.

 

For PVP, watch out for Tier X Balao.  She has 14km torpedoes.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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On 8/15/2021 at 11:49 AM, HamptonRoads said:

This is a live playtest of submarines.  Co-op happens to be the only venue to play them, so everyone that wants to play them is playing in co-op.  Once the rental period ends, things should settle down for a week or two until the next round of playtests.

Not really true. It's not like "if you want to play subs, you can". Today I got nothing but coal in the lottery. NO subs. Not that I miss them. Even if I get them, I don't and WON'T play them. All I see being added by submarines in PvE is MORE torpedo spam. People don't even bother aiming any more. Torps have become "the shotgun of the high seas". People just point in the general direction of where they think a bot ship might appear and let loose. NOW we know why WG decided to drop "turning pink" for punishment. Whole teams would be pink at this rate. I wish they would BRING BACK turning pink for damaging friendlies. It made the game at least a LITTLE more skill oriented. Now, you have torpedo spam and people regularly shooting friendlies and not thinking anything of it. I came back to WOWS after thinking WOT had turned to crap. Now I am going back to WOT because WOWS has turned to crap. Well done. WG. Next you can bring in PT boats for even MORE torpedo spam. Might as well. :Smile-angry:

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9 hours ago, Deputy276 said:

Not really true. It's not like "if you want to play subs, you can". Today I got nothing but coal in the lottery. NO subs. Not that I miss them. Even if I get them, I don't and WON'T play them. All I see being added by submarines in PvE is MORE torpedo spam. People don't even bother aiming any more. Torps have become "the shotgun of the high seas". People just point in the general direction of where they think a bot ship might appear and let loose. NOW we know why WG decided to drop "turning pink" for punishment. Whole teams would be pink at this rate. I wish they would BRING BACK turning pink for damaging friendlies. It made the game at least a LITTLE more skill oriented. Now, you have torpedo spam and people regularly shooting friendlies and not thinking anything of it. I came back to WOWS after thinking WOT had turned to crap. Now I am going back to WOT because WOWS has turned to crap. Well done. WG. Next you can bring in PT boats for even MORE torpedo spam. Might as well. :Smile-angry:

Submarines aren't good damage dealers.  I see them as bottom dwellers in match results all the time.

 

I had a Submarine player joke with me and asked if I could use my Napoli to push him forward to get in action sooner :Smile_teethhappy:

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Pig Boats are boring and tedious to fight. Co-Op matches are now going past 10 minutes.

Since WG has stated several times that Co-Op matches are over too quickly so they have to get crappy rewards. 

Will they increase the reward for Co-Op?

The submerge time is going to be used to troll the tar out of Randoms.

 

Cirran

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