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NefariousRaven

Mods plz delete this thread

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Despite all the people saying the nerfs to Rocket Planes are fine and they now require "skill", most people serious about winning have seen the writing on the wall and have decided to stop bringing Haks and FDRs to Clan Battles because at this point they are simply a liability now that they can do almost nothing to DDs, less than nothing.  This is no longer theoretical.

I myself am not going to be using Hak anymore, one of my previously favourite ships in the game before it just got smacked with nerfs over and over and over again, because not being able to interact with DDs, one of the most influential ship types, makes it a losing proposition.  First you nerf torps and bomb damage, then you reduce citadel damage, remove slingshotting, then you handicap rockets by change dispersion and the reticle, and of course adding overlapping AA fire and such.  Now you just decide that Rocket Planes on half the carriers should be functionally useless against DDs... a bridge too far.

Congratulations Wargaming, you nerfed a class so hard that not only is the best premium version of it now considered sub-optimal, but multiple CVs are just considered persona non grata at this point.

But this rocket change is totally fine of course.... say all the DD players talking about CV "crutches" that need an extra 4 seconds to angle to CV ordnance in the most agile ship class in the game, because the first 4 weren't enough ;P

 

Boneheaded decision, the CV playrate is about to plummet.  Just put CVs out of their misery already and remove them from the game rather than this death by 100 cuts [edited] if this is the direction Wargaming wants to take them.

Edited by NefariousRaven
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Actually, from the sounds of it, I wonder if the Hak is being nerfed harder because without rockets to attack DDs, they're a little screwed because their dive bombs are AP (which aren't all that useful vs DDs) rather than HE.  Generally though, the point is that if a class of carrier doesn't have an alternative to rockets for attacking DDs, they're a bit screwed and perhaps their best option is to spot those DDs for friendlies to attack.  That said, among the most popular CBs DDs are the Halland and Smaland which have such great AA that even trying to spot them can get an entire squadron wiped out.

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5 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Actually, from the sounds of it, I wonder if the Hak is being nerfed harder because without rockets to attack DDs, they're a little screwed because their dive bombs are AP (which aren't all that useful vs DDs) rather than HE.  Generally though, the point is that if a class of carrier doesn't have an alternative to rockets for attacking DDs, they're a bit screwed and perhaps their best option is to spot those DDs for friendlies to attack.  That said, among the most popular CBs DDs are the Halland and Smaland which have such great AA that even trying to spot them can get an entire squadron wiped out.

100%.  Most of the popular DDs at this point either have amazing concealment such that keeping them spotted in a CV is difficult enough, but many of them have exceptional AA as well.  I've seen AA specialized Osters wipe out aircraft squads nearly as fast as a Halland.

Edited by NefariousRaven

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FDR was never great at hitting DDs in the first place, slow planes with long aim time made that very hard already. It's also getting banned next season so people are starting to switch. But FDR isn't that affected by the nerf, it picks on the large slow targets already.

Hak, yeah, probably suffered the worst. Now she really has no good tool against DDs. You either need a DD dumb enough to drive into your rockets or torps or get lucky with numerous AP DB overpens.

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You do realize that the main reason Hak and FDR were banned was because of their overwhelming efficacy in clan wars compared to other carriers, right?

Rockets are irrelevant when Hak Torps and both FDR torps and bombs with amoung the best armaments in the game to dislodge stationary ships.

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Expect a tweak on the rocket attack planes recent nerf. I imagine it will be dialed back a smidge.

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https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/167

People aren't being Hakuryu or FDR because WG banned them for being too good. Literally nothing to do with the rocket changes.

Also, almost all clans at the typhoon and hurricane level still run cruiser heavy comps. Rarely more than 1 DD.

Please do more research before you make ignorant posts like this.

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Just now, Capt_Ahab1776 said:

Expect a tweak on the rocket attack planes recent nerf. I imagine it will be dialed back a smidge.

Better be a lot more than a smidge.  The additional delay shouldn't be more than a second.

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2 hours ago, NefariousRaven said:

Despite all the people saying the nerfs to Rocket Planes are fine and they now require "skill", most people serious about winning have seen the writing on the wall and have decided to stop bringing Haks and FDRs to Clan Battles because at this point they are simply a liability now that they can do almost nothing to DDs, less than nothing.  This is no longer theoretical.

I myself am not going to be using Hak anymore, one of my previously favourite ships in the game before it just got smacked with nerfs over and over and over again, because not being able to interact with DDs, one of the most influential ship types, makes it a losing proposition.  First you nerf torps and bomb damage, then you reduce citadel damage, remove slingshotting, then you handicap rockets by change dispersion and the reticle, and of course adding overlapping AA fire and such.  Now you just decide that Rocket Planes on half the carriers should be functionally useless against DDs... a bridge too far.

Congratulations Wargaming, you nerfed a class so hard that not only is the best premium version of it now considered sub-optimal, but multiple CVs are just considered persona non grata at this point.

But this rocket change is totally fine of course.... say all the DD players talking about CV "crutches" that need an extra 4 seconds to angle to CV ordnance in the most agile ship class in the game, because the first 4 weren't enough ;P

 

Boneheaded decision, the CV playrate is about to plummet.  Just put CVs out of their misery already and remove them from the game rather than this death by 100 cuts [edited] if this is the direction Wargaming wants to take them.

Adding rockets to planes (after the re-work) was a dumb WG idea to begin with.   The only other ship with rockets is the Hood.

Did you really believe WG would 'add' a special ammo type and not change it?  I'm sure SAP will have more changes before it is balanced.  Rockets may need more balance (or not),  skip bombs may need more balance (or not).

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Imagine if you added a "delay" to artillery fire for BB's, CL/CA's, and DD's? Imagine the outrage?

"Just LEAD the target! Aim your reticle 5 seconds ahead of where you think the ship will be, factor in flight time, then fire, then wait for the shells to arrive to see if you guessed correctly! Don't worry! They totally can't angle in that amount of time! We put a giant 'red do not enter' sign on the water to warn them! Because BALANS! "

They'd be spazzing out like SJW's with Kool-Aid dyed hair after you used the wrong pronouns...

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2 hours ago, NefariousRaven said:

Better be a lot more than a smidge.  The additional delay shouldn't be more than a second.

Interesting you replied to this comment:

2 hours ago, Capt_Ahab1776 said:

Expect a tweak on the rocket attack planes recent nerf. I imagine it will be dialed back a smidge.

Which btw is why the nerfs were so hard...just in case they were off by a bit they can still buff the premiums & not be stuck w/overpowered premiums that they will have too many whines about nerfing later...but they may all just stay where they are & some may get strafing abilities added in (remember...they said, "At this time" in relationship to strafing doing no damage...heavily implying IMO that SOON™...it may become a thing***...more on that later)...

But be ^^^^That...as it may OP...you failed to comment on:

3 hours ago, UwUnicum said:

You do realize that the main reason Hak and FDR were banned was because of their overwhelming efficacy in clan wars compared to other carriers, right?

Rockets are irrelevant when Hak Torps and both FDR torps and bombs with amoung the best armaments in the game to dislodge stationary ships.

&...not to mention...

2 hours ago, Your_SAT_Score said:

https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/167

People aren't being Hakuryu or FDR because WG banned them for being too good. Literally nothing to do with the rocket changes.

Also, almost all clans at the typhoon and hurricane level still run cruiser heavy comps. Rarely more than 1 DD.

Please do more research before you make ignorant posts like this.

^^^This (please use the link he provided for reference if you're still confused)...

Just to clarify...as you seemed to miss it the 1st & 2nd time...

3 hours ago, NefariousRaven said:

most people...have decided to stop bringing Haks and FDRs to Clan Battles...

Not just "most" people..but all people..."have decided to stop bringing Haks & FDRs to Clan Battles"...

...because they don't have that option...because WG banned them...& all your rambling about what you're rambling about has ZERO% to do with why you won't see any of them in CBs.

Not saying you're opinion on the changes is either valid or invalid (& refuse to validate those comments...or any of the related replies in this thread...with a response in a thread titled with so much misdirection)...just that you're attempt to associate it having anything to do with CBs is either intentional National Enquirer levels of misdirection...or you just associate with a bunch of other seriously misinformed people that somehow think they have an option in the matter.

***My guess is there won't be any strafing given to any of the ships that have been nerfed so far (maybe a few buffs to the delay times on premiums & either buffs or nerfs to some tree ships...if at all)...but that the "suggested" potential for planes to strafe will be exclusively saved for ships that only get 1 attack run per squadron (I call dibs on this prediction)...

Hmm...now who could that be?

Actually I think it's a good idea (single attack runs) ...& hopefully is being used as a testbed for all nations ships to eventually get changed to larger squadrons that each get 1 attack run...therefore making AA useful in actually diminishing direct attacks again like it used to in the RTS days & removing the spotting times after attack runs....

Balance coming in the form of better individual strike options each attack due to more planes in each attack...

Seems it would make it easier to balance AA around that system instead of around the immunity actually attacking planes get based on how many other planes are still alive in the squadron as meat shields.

Then strafing damage can be used to balance nations with a lean towards incapacitating (but not being able to destroy) things based on crew kills needing replacements...including AA & 2ndary mounts.

Edited by IfYouSeeKhaos

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42 minutes ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said:

^^^This (please use the link he provided for reference if you're still confused)...

Just to clarify...as you seemed to miss it the 1st & 2nd time...

I did legitimately miss it because that reply was posted literally right as I replied to someone else and left to go shower.  Fair enough, I'd delete the thread, but I do not seem to have that option.

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1 hour ago, NefariousRaven said:

I did legitimately miss it because that reply was posted literally right as I replied to someone else and left to go shower.  Fair enough, I'd delete the thread, but I do not seem to have that option.

You can just backspace it all & just put delete please for the mods... they'll remove it.

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23 hours ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said:

You can just backspace it all & just put delete please for the mods... they'll remove it.

The title?

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4 hours ago, NefariousRaven said:

The title?

Yep.

If you don't want the text you can backspace it too...but the tire itself should do it.

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On 6/19/2021 at 8:01 PM, ElectroVeeDub said:

Imagine if you added a "delay" to artillery fire for BB's, CL/CA's, and DD's? Imagine the outrage?

"Just LEAD the target! Aim your reticle 5 seconds ahead of where you think the ship will be, factor in flight time, then fire, then wait for the shells to arrive to see if you guessed correctly! Don't worry! They totally can't angle in that amount of time! We put a giant 'red do not enter' sign on the water to warn them! Because BALANS! "

They'd be spazzing out like SJW's with Kool-Aid dyed hair after you used the wrong pronouns...

Your totally but that sentence was brilliant!

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On 6/19/2021 at 8:01 PM, ElectroVeeDub said:

Imagine if you added a "delay" to artillery fire for BB's, CL/CA's, and DD's? Imagine the outrage?

"Just LEAD the target! Aim your reticle 5 seconds ahead of where you think the ship will be, factor in flight time, then fire, then wait for the shells to arrive to see if you guessed correctly! Don't worry! They totally can't angle in that amount of time! We put a giant 'red do not enter' sign on the water to warn them! Because BALANS! "

They'd be spazzing out like SJW's with Kool-Aid dyed hair after you used the wrong pronouns...

I wouldn't mind the machine guns if they would be part of the initial aiming time,   and if you could still manoeuver to make adjustments, the ship could see the gun's bullets splash the water surface and act accordingly to mitigate damage. But an extra 5 secs??..  wow..  I've aimed an N.C. last game, targeted ahead of the bow, by the time the rocket launched, it has moved soo far that only 1 - 2 rockets of my Shokaku hit the stern.

Edited by HnKMephisto

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