Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 20 battles to post in this section.
Slimeball91

CVs in Raptor Rescue.

39 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts

Continuing with the discussions with CVs in operations, this time Raptor Rescue.  This is not one of my favorite ops in surfaces or CVs.  Unlike the other ops, Raptor Rescue has more routes, and enemy spawn locations.  I don't play this enough to ever learn all of the routes/spawns, and that makes it a lot harder to do well.  Half the time I think I know where the enemy ships will spawn next, and it turns out I'm wrong to some extent, sometimes way off.  My final game last night, in the Perth, I just couldn't get anything right.  That left me with one of the worst finishes I've have a very long time, just under 50k damage.  My usual average damage in surface ships (cruisers) is probably 120k, not great, but solid.  The issue with this op for me is that it can be hard to find a rhythm. 

As for CVs specifically, I find them to lose many of their primary strengths in this op.  One of the biggest strengths for CVs in ops is the ability to go anywhere, and target those hard to get to ships.  In this op the enemy CVs are tough with their almost content fighter screen.  The other hard targets that you'd like to work on for your team have decent AA coverage wit h3-4 ships spawning together, making harder to get efficient attacks.  Then there are the longish flight times per strike.  It can be frustrating to make a longer flight and only manage one of two strikes.  Also, this op can descend into a bit of chaos if your team isn't on its game.  The CV doesn't have as much ability to keep things under control as in other ops.  In Killer Whale for example, my normal route that prioritize hard to target ships tends to prevent things from ever unraveling.  Even if there is some spot where trouble breaks out it isn't hard to go deal with that hotspot before it gets out of control.  The windows you have to deal with ships before they attack Raptor in this op are fine when your team is on top of things.  There are just too many ships that can spit out torps that the CVs can only do so much to prevent problems. 

With the other op when I'm in a CV I feel like I can have a fair amount of control over the outcome.  In Raptor Rescue I feel more lie I'm just along for the ride.  Not have some sense of control is a bit frustrating.  Sometimes I feel like a chicken with its head cut off.  That is partly down to not knowing the op well enough, and partly its just the nature of this op.  I'm looking to get better, so, I have some questions for your guys that play CVs.  Do you go after the enemy CVs, if so what is your strategy?  What ships do you like to target in general?  How close to do you stay with the group in your CV, do you stay really close, or stay back some amount?  What CVs do you like to play in this op?

This is the first time I've given CVs a real shot in this op.  I'm still learning (and I don't consider myself a good CV player), what advice do you guys have for the CV newbies in this op?  I'd really like to hear from you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
3,182 posts
2,945 battles

I don't consider CV's to be much help, since you already have a Ranger & a Bogue. If you really ant to play a carrier in this Scenario, take your ship + a cruiser south to deal with the southern Kido Butai force, then rejoin the convoy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
202
[NWO-1]
Volunteer Moderator
434 posts
7,373 battles

Also in Raptor Rescue it is important to keep up with the main convoy, which is hard with a CV. In the other ops it is easier to set autopilot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,154
[PVE]
Members
12,004 posts
21,175 battles
1 hour ago, Slimeball91 said:

This is the first time I've given CVs a real shot in this op.  I'm still learning (and I don't consider myself a good CV player), what advice do you guys have for the CV newbies in this op?  I'd really like to hear from you.

At the start go and spot the DD, do not make the cruiser and BB turn broadsides away from your team with your torps. After that most of the time CV-ers go after the southern CV and spot that way.

 

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts
6 minutes ago, Sovereigndawg said:

At the start go and spot the DD, do not make the cruiser and BB turn broadsides away from your team with your torps. After that most of the time CV-ers go after the southern CV and spot that way.

This is helpful for new CV players.  I'm well past that point.  I'm looking for finer points, stuff you don't get until you have some experience.  That is what I think will be most helpful for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts
1 hour ago, black_hull4 said:

I don't consider CV's to be much help, since you already have a Ranger & a Bogue. If you really ant to play a carrier in this Scenario, take your ship + a cruiser south to deal with the southern Kido Butai force, then rejoin the convoy.

Fair enough.  I sort of agree with you.  Surface ships tend to be more reliable.  However, my goal is to be useful, and try to bring the strengths CVs offer to this op. 

The enemy CVs are challenging targets for CV players, and its not really fair to expect one of your teammates to go be spotters.  Don't get me wrong, I go south to spot the Cv, but its not that simple.  As you probably know the bot DD smokes the CV as soon as its is spotted, so spotting isn't going to happen until the smoke is out of play.  I can't sit there and wait.  If the second wave of cruisers spawns south I'll do two attack runs on them, and the third attack on the CV.  (If I go straight in on the CV wit ha full squadron, the CAP fighters will shred my planes.)  If the second cruiser spawn is north, then I have a problem.  Do I pre drop a couple of times and attack the CV, or do I just recall and take another group of planes to attack up north.

Ideally, the second spawn is south, I'll attack the cruisers, then the CV on the first flight down south.  With the next flight it will be the same except I'll drop a fighter to spot the CV on the way in.  There is just no point dropping a fighter on the first flight since the CV will be smoked, and your teammates won't likely be in position to shoot.  The situation can be even worse for the second CV.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,883
[CO-OP]
Members
5,180 posts
41,646 battles

A CV can help to reduce the workload by spotting those spawn locations, so that the fleet isn't spread out trying to find them.  After dealing with the initial ships, the next wave of cruisers can spawn further north behind the islands and close to the 10-line.  If you send some planes to scout this area to see if they spawn there, the rest of the ships can deal with them there.  If the cruisers don't spawn there they will be in the western area.  In this case, you can send some planes there to confirm this, and then proceed to the CV and her escorts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,454
[A-D-F]
Beta Testers
3,660 posts
12,437 battles

A slightly older video where I used Weser in this one, not the CV of choice I would prefer to use to be heard, but it can work with its available armaments

https://youtu.be/a55CkxGHIkA

 

An even older video featuring Ryujo my all time favorite CV to use in ops
 

https://youtu.be/immDxiHzRpU

 

 

This video highlights more on what I liked to do for this op as I see it as a way of securing a successful op because it is a terribly tempting secondary objective that causes half the team if not more to go off from Raptor thus leaving it undefended and more prone to being sunk.

https://youtu.be/a55CkxGHIkA

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,118
[WOLF8]
[WOLF8]
Members
9,179 posts
7,395 battles

I personally find the CV to be the most important asset of the team in Raptor Rescue, at least for the first half of the operation, simply because of the spotting and early warning it can provide. Most of the time, your team will shoot at things that you spot for them, so I say it's crucial for a CV to spot the targets at the right time and right place, so the team can be nudged to dispose them quickly.

At the start, a CV should immediately send a squadron to west, to spot the first DD. You'll want to get rid of it, before it comes too close to launch its torpedo spread, which may cause an irreversible damage. If your team's aim is true, then this should be easy. Deploying a fighter on top of it, so that it stays spotted, is also helpful toward this goal. By the time the DD is taken care of, the other two red ships will be spotted, and can become easy kills for your team.

Once the first wave is dispatched, there're two directions that the second wave of cruisers can come from; northwest or south. The CV should immediately send a squadron to northwest. If your planes get the "Spotted" indicator by the time they reach A3/B3, then you know the cruisers are coming from northwest. You should alert the team, maybe even deploy a fighter, and keep them spotted while launching strikes, so your team can shoot at them before they come too close. If the planes are NOT spotted, then you know they're coming from the south. Immediately recall the squadron, then launch a fresh one to send south quickly. You should run into the cruisers, by the time the Raptor starts moving. Hopefully your team has also made their way to start shooting at the cruisers, by the time you spot them. Once again, you do your best to keep them spotted, so that your team can shoot at them, while launching your own strikes. You can also go and spot the first red carrier, Houshou, coming from southeast, at the same time.

I personally don't recommend the CV player to go after those optional red CV's. The post rework CV's have powerful AA, and even the dinky Houshou can and will eat your squadrons alive, mainly using its cap fighters, if you're not careful. Rather, you should leave it to your teammates to take care of it. Hopefully your team doesn't send no more than two ships after it, preferably fast cruisers and/or DD's. If you want to help, then you could get rid of the cruiser and the DD that accompany the Houshou, so that your team has easier time disposing the carrier.

However, the CV player should NOT dwell too long on the Houshou group. As Raptor starts heading toward the middle waypoint, there's a DD ambush waiting ahead, towards west. You should keep one eye on your mini map at all time, and once Raptor has moved halfway between the point of rescue and the waypoint, you should launch a fresh squadron, preferably an anti-DD one, toward west. You must spot the two DD's before they come too close to launch their torpedo soups. I remember plenty of times when a poorly coordinated team ends up losing the operation right here, because Raptor was killed by the soup, or Raptor getting too severely injured to make the final leg of the journey (the enemy bots have a habit of focusing on injured ships, and Raptor can become a target that way), or too many team members dying themselves to protect Raptor for the final leg.

Once you and your team successfully fight off the two DD's, and hopefully Raptor is in one piece and good health, more enemies will start to trickle in. By this point, I say the CV has done most of the important work. Spotting would become less of a priority, and all that's left is to just help your team to sink the enemies as fast as possible, during the final leg of the journey. Depending on where the exit point is, the enemies can come from northwest, southwest, south, or even east. If you're not sure, you can watch where Raptor is sending its own planes, which will give a clue to where the next wave is coming from. As for the second optional red CV... you can go after it if you want, but as I mentioned before, just like the first one, you should just leave it to your team to handle it. It's not worth risking your squadron to its cap fighters. If push comes to shove, then those enemy CV's should be ignored; the first priority of the mission should always be protecting Raptor first. If your team wipes out all other enemies and there's no other target, then maybe you can chase after the CV's... but by that point, you pretty much won the operation anyway.

This is how I mostly play Raptor Rescue in a CV. Unless the team goofs up hard, or there's some terrible luck, it hasn't failed me, even in a totally random team. That's just me though. Hopefully you can figure out a way to make a CV work for you in this operation.

Edited by Blorgh2017
  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts
32 minutes ago, Blorgh2017 said:

This is how I mostly play Raptor Rescue in a CV. Unless the team goofs up hard, or there's some terrible luck, it hasn't failed me, even in a totally random team. That's just me though. Hopefully you can figure out a way to make a CV work for you in this operation.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.  I really like the tip about watching where Raptor's planes go.  Tomorrow when I have more time I'll I'll make some more comments, and ask some more questions.

@Vader_Sama Could you please post the links to the videos, I'm one of the people that can't see the embedded videos.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,454
[A-D-F]
Beta Testers
3,660 posts
12,437 battles
6 minutes ago, Slimeball91 said:

 

@Vader_Sama Could you please post the links to the videos, I'm one of the people that can't see the embedded videos.

done

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16,863
[WOLF5]
[WOLF5]
Members
37,566 posts
30,498 battles
3 hours ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Raptor this week then?

It's already been on.

=====

CV going after the CV is kind of a waste since the CV Rebork because of the constant fighter CAPs by the enemy CVs.  Most of the time it's best left for the 2 CVs to be taken out by the regular surface ship players.  It's not a problem because there's usually guys more than eager to do so.  However, sometimes the guy(s) doing the Hosho down south may need help.

 

Small suggestion at the start of RR.  Fly your first sortie of planes west to spot the DD and get the guys to shoot it up, kill it early.  If you do this this removes the threat of torps landing on the team real early.  You'll prevent needless early losses.

 

Again at the start, please, please do not use Torpedo Bombers to attack the Yubari and BB.  This gets them to maneuver in weird ways, beach themselves, sail north, whatever, and disrupts an Optional to quickly and easily kill 3 ships in sequence for a star.  I see a lot of CV players bungle it up and none of the regular surface ships are in position to make up for the bad play.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
968 posts
221 battles
6 hours ago, Slimeball91 said:

 

This is the first time I've given CVs a real shot in this op.  I'm still learning (and I don't consider myself a good CV player), what advice do you guys have for the CV newbies in this op?  I'd really like to hear from you.

 

Personally, I would avoid playing CV's in any game mode.   My reason for this is it takes a ship out of play, and forces the bots to shoot at 6 ships rather than 7 (or 4 ships instead of 5, etc etc). 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
433
[--K--]
Supertester
1,728 posts
20,903 battles

Lowenhardt is good here too, lots of Japanese cruisers to AP rocket. They work on the Ryujo as well. As you mentioned the spawns are difficult to predict which makes the fast planes valuable if you guess wrong. 

 

Can put together another video tomorrow possibly. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,360
[FOXY]
Members
4,717 posts
8,947 battles
5 hours ago, Laser_Beam said:

 

Personally, I would avoid playing CV's in any game mode.   My reason for this is it takes a ship out of play, and forces the bots to shoot at 6 ships rather than 7 (or 4 ships instead of 5, etc etc). 

Depends on the CV you bring. I usually use Wesser because it does have a decent secondary battery(which i have specced for.). Granted Raptor Rescue is an operation i dont play often so i wouldnt take it in regardless.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts
7 hours ago, Laser_Beam said:

Personally, I would avoid playing CV's in any game mode.   My reason for this is it takes a ship out of play, and forces the bots to shoot at 6 ships rather than 7 (or 4 ships instead of 5, etc etc). 

That is an interesting way to look at it.  This probably doesn't hold true in this op compared to others.  The bots tend to target the support ships, and Raptor a fair amount.  Also, the CV will be targeted if you give the bots a good shot at your carrier.  I'm not dismissing your point, however, I think what CVs can bring generally far outweighs any negatives. 

11 hours ago, Vader_Sama said:

A slightly older video where I used Weser in this one, not the CV of choice I would prefer to use to be heard, but it can work with its available armaments

I kinda like the Weser's AP rockets in this op.  Anyhow, I was watching the Weser video and saw you were able to get off trop attacks on the Kuma that spawns with the Hosho down south (around the 4 minute mark in the video).  I don't know if something has changed or if I'm doing something wrong, but I can't seem to attack the Kuma without agro'ing the CAP fighters.  It looks like you make your drop then quickly turn away to avoid the fighters' agro.  I've not had luck with that, but I'm going to have try this again to see if I can make it work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,199
[CVA16]
Members
8,539 posts
26,040 battles

Just like for DDs, anyone bringing a CV to Raptor (or any other OP really) had better know the OP well AND be good in a CV. A well played CV can be a huge asset. An average CV player will contribute much less than they could have in a BB or cruiser.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts
37 minutes ago, Sabot_100 said:

Just like for DDs, anyone bringing a CV to Raptor (or any other OP really) had better know the OP well AND be good in a CV. A well played CV can be a huge asset. An average CV player will contribute much less than they could have in a BB or cruiser.

I'm not sure I completely agree.  While it's true I can do better in another ship type, that doesn't mean you have to be above average to carry you own weight in a CV.  I consider myself an average CV player at best, particularly in this op.  With only being average, I tend to finish okay relative the rest of the team.  I'd say I probably finish 3rd in XP most games (with it being more common to finish in 2nd place rather than 4th).  That puts me ahead of more than half of the team.  Although, that could say just as much, or more, about the overall (lower) quality of players in operations these days.

12 hours ago, GandalfTehGray said:

Can put together another video tomorrow possibly. 

I'd appreciate that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,199
[CVA16]
Members
8,539 posts
26,040 battles
22 minutes ago, Slimeball91 said:

I'm not sure I completely agree.  While it's true I can do better in another ship type, that doesn't mean you have to be above average to carry you own weight in a CV. 

You have to know where and when to use your planes. Where to scout/spot. Need to spot the DDs. 

Recently had a CV fly down to attack the Hosho which already had a couple of ships engaging it,

All this is a combination of knowing what your are doing in a CV and what you are doing in that OP in particular.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts
1 hour ago, Sabot_100 said:

Recently had a CV fly down to attack the Hosho which already had a couple of ships engaging it,

There are always players that don't know what they are doing.  OTOH, sometimes surface ship players don't know why the CV is doing something.  In your example the CV player may well have made the right decision.  The Hosho has something like ~8k concealment and your teammates might not have been close enough to detect it.  Your CV spotting the Hosho allows your teammates to get longer range shots so they don't have to overcommit, and not get back to support Raptor in a timely manner.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,199
[CVA16]
Members
8,539 posts
26,040 battles
36 minutes ago, Slimeball91 said:

Your CV spotting the Hosho allows your teammates to get longer range shots so they don't have to overcommit, and not get back to support Raptor in a timely manner.

Killing the Hosho is mostly just killing the DD/CL escorts in a timely fashion without taking too much damage in return. Much more critical to early spot the DDs that will be in torp range of Raptor very quickly. Less AA and flight time too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,118
[WOLF8]
[WOLF8]
Members
9,179 posts
7,395 battles

Personally for myself, if I see only one friendly ship engaging the Hosho and its escorts, then I try to help out, by attacking the DD and the cruiser escort... until Raptor reaches the middle waypoint, or the escorts are sunk and the Hosho is all alone.

However, if I see two or more ships going southeast, then I don't bother. Technically speaking, I think no more than two ships should chase after the Hosho, but some team members can be... "whatever," so to speak, hence I don't interject. Two or more surface ships are more than enough to handle the Tier IV carrier and its two little escorts, so I shift my focus back to Raptor.

Now, if those allies fail and actually get sunk by the Hosho and its escorts... well, it's not like I can prevent any poor play of somebody else, as a CV, lol. :Smile_trollface:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,454
[A-D-F]
Beta Testers
3,660 posts
12,437 battles

Hosho is such a big problem for me because of how many numb nuts go after a tier 4 carrier, that I perfected a strat to delete Hosho using one torpedo bomber squad with Ryujo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5,102
[PVE]
Members
8,727 posts
13 minutes ago, Vader_Sama said:

Hosho is such a big problem for me because of how many numb nuts go after a tier 4 carrier, that I perfected a strat to delete Hosho using one torpedo bomber squad with Ryujo.

Now that you mention that, isn't there a video of that??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×