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vikingno2

Uncap the SAP on Italian BBs

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They really either need to uncap the SAP or give them better accuracy on the main guns

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As a cruiser/DD main, I agree. Italian BB SAP needs to be stronger against DDs than it currently is. Maybe not to the "full pen damage" level, but some kind of buff to offset the inability to set fires and break modules would be more than fair, especially considering how bad the accuracy is.

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More accurate, make main armament AP/HE and secondaries SAP.  The cut and paste meta from Italian cruisers was lazy and not well thought out, resulting in the stupid SAP cap decision.

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Agree that the RM BBs need some help.  They are fairly defenceless against hard charging DDs unless RNG favors them.  You can hit DDs with their secondaries currently, but the damage from them is pretty poor.

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3 minutes ago, kyesac said:

Agree that the RM BBs need some help.  They are fairly defenceless against hard charging DDs unless RNG favors them.  You can hit DDs with their secondaries currently, but the damage from them is pretty poor.

Probably because the 90mm guns that make up the bulk of Italian BBs secondaries only have 15mm of pen. Most DDs have 16mm hulls or thicker.

That's right; the bulk of Italian BBs secondaries are so bad they can't even pen DD hulls. The only thing they are good for is fire starting.

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No. Just buff the accuracy so they can actually hit cruisers and battleships. Right now they're the worst tech tree in the game because they cannot deal any damage.

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They need to un-nerf the SAP which they did during the NDA test so that the ship can do something vs BBs and cruisers .. right now the SAP is not doing anything remotely better nor even close to being as functional as another BB firing HE (non-british). The low caliber/pen of its AP makes it be unable to switch to AP to do something against anything but a perfectly flat broadside ship. 

 

Once that is done, they need to make the 90mm's be able to pen BB upper superstructure armor as well as DD ammo... even if its damage is weak it would be helpful vs DDs and other ships. As it stands at the moment, its rather pointless to use secondary build on it and thats sad because this ship line would've been a fantastic brawling line to compete with the german line...nowhere as tanky but certainly having its thematic flare.  

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The RM BB line is supposed to be weak against DD's - that is clearly a design intent.  They are not going to change the 10% cap to DD's because of this.

The ships are overall balanced (except for the tier 10, which seems to be a bit too strong, and will likely be nerfed in a few months).

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2 hours ago, CaptainKaitoGhost said:

As a cruiser/DD main, I agree. Italian BB SAP needs to be stronger against DDs than it currently is. Maybe not to the "full pen damage" level, but some kind of buff to offset the inability to set fires and break modules would be more than fair, especially considering how bad the accuracy is.

Lepanto 6.4 km away front guns at a dd....

TWICE....

BRACKETS HIM....

Dam Benham got off both sides of torps....

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2 minutes ago, dEsTurbed1 said:

Lepanto 6.4 km away front guns at a dd....

TWICE....

BRACKETS HIM....

Dam Benham got off both sides of torps....

I do not fear an Italian BB shooting at me in a DD at all.

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1 hour ago, awildseaking said:

No. Just buff the accuracy so they can actually hit cruisers and battleships. Right now they're the worst tech tree in the game because they cannot deal any damage.

This is the main problem.   If RNG favours me, I can hit something.  If it doesn't, it makes me want to smash my computer screen in frustration.  I played 4 games in a row where I couldn't hit a sitting broadside BB at 10km.  Aim mid ship above halfway up the side of the ship towards the superstructure, and all the shots hit the water well before they hit the ship.  Same shot against the same ship again, and all the shots go over the ship.  It just makes you want to poke your eyes out rather than play the game.

I can deal with DDs even with the 10% max damage limit on a shell hit.  Leave the poor DDs alone.  All I want is more accurate guns.  Then I can actually hit them with a well placed shot.  10% of a big shell still does good damage.  The closer a DD comes to ensure better accuracy with their torps, the better chance they have of getting blapped by big BB guns as long as those guns can actually hit something.  That is the only thing that needs to happen.  Make the guns more accurate.

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6 minutes ago, CaptainKaitoGhost said:

I do not fear an Italian BB shooting at me in a DD at all.

You should, because I have missed my shot on more than one occasion and accidentally killed a DD because the errant shells didn't go where I actually aimed them and accidentally hit the DD that made a good evasive maneuver.

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5 minutes ago, Murcc said:

You should, because I have missed my shot on more than one occasion and accidentally killed a DD because the errant shells didn't go where I actually aimed them and accidentally hit the DD that made a good evasive maneuver.

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3 hours ago, CaptainKaitoGhost said:

As a cruiser/DD main, I agree. Italian BB SAP needs to be stronger against DDs than it currently is. Maybe not to the "full pen damage" level, but some kind of buff to offset the inability to set fires and break modules would be more than fair, especially considering how bad the accuracy is.

This is a good idea. I fully support this. SAP damage is capped at 10%, right? AP overpen hits are 10% also. Why use SAP when I can just keep AP loaded in case I see that broadside cruiser?

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59 minutes ago, Moggytwo said:

The RM BB line is supposed to be weak against DD's - that is clearly a design intent.  They are not going to change the 10% cap to DD's because of this.

The ships are overall balanced (except for the tier 10, which seems to be a bit too strong, and will likely be nerfed in a few months).

By that logic, DDs are clearly meant to be vulnerable to carriers due to having weak AA and so DD players should stop complaining about carriers.

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In other words muh BB cannot hit crap.

Someone tighten up the blessed guns aleady.

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30 minutes ago, Murcc said:

This is the main problem.   If RNG favours me, I can hit something.  If it doesn't, it makes me want to smash my computer screen in frustration.  I played 4 games in a row where I couldn't hit a sitting broadside BB at 10km.  Aim mid ship above halfway up the side of the ship towards the superstructure, and all the shots hit the water well before they hit the ship.  Same shot against the same ship again, and all the shots go over the ship.  It just makes you want to poke your eyes out rather than play the game.

I can deal with DDs even with the 10% max damage limit on a shell hit.  Leave the poor DDs alone.  All I want is more accurate guns.  Then I can actually hit them with a well placed shot.  10% of a big shell still does good damage.  The closer a DD comes to ensure better accuracy with their torps, the better chance they have of getting blapped by big BB guns as long as those guns can actually hit something.  That is the only thing that needs to happen.  Make the guns more accurate.

This is the issue with RM BB's.  I think they're overall strong from tier 7 and up, but BB SAP is potentially so strong that they had to reign it in somehow, and the way they did it was by making the accuracy very poor, and the reloads very long.  This is probably effective in terms of making the ships statistically balanced, but there's no doubt it's incredibly frustrating to play ships with long reloads and poor accuracy, so it likely won't be a fun line to play for many.

Of course, the Colombo has 16 guns, and quantity makes up for a whole lot of inaccuracy!  It still has the awful reload though.  I've found I just won't play BB's with reloads much over 30 seconds, they just aren't much fun to me.  Unfortunately this has been WG's primary BB balance method over the last six months or so - give BB's an extra strong broadside, and balance it by making the reload really long.  Maybe some people like this design, but I am most definitely not one of those people.

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29 minutes ago, Murcc said:

You should, because I have missed my shot on more than one occasion and accidentally killed a DD because the errant shells didn't go where I actually aimed them and accidentally hit the DD that made a good evasive maneuver.

Sounds like my Caracciolo co-op game last night. Had two shots on flat broadside battleships at about 4-5km each - first salvo on a Lyon chunked him for 15k, next salvo on a Gneisenau landed more shells around an allied DD lining up for a point blank torp run than actually hit the battleship (and both of which were lower belt shatters even though the aim point was the upper belt and superstructure). 

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when i'm lucky enough to even hit a dd with the SAP rnds its usually one shell and its almost always 1250 dmg consistently. 

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1 hour ago, motaz87 said:

when i'm lucky enough to even hit a dd with the SAP rnds its usually one shell and its almost always 1250 dmg consistently. 

That's because Italian BB SAP is capped to 10% of its max damage against DDs because DDs apparently needed more coddling.

Italian BBs are close to defenseless against DDs due to both their SAP and AP being capped to 10% of their max damage and the bulk of their secondary guns literally unable to pen DD hulls.

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Perhaps the Columbo is a different story but Ive killed a few DD's with it. Could just be the sheer number of shells at close range but under 10km this things wipes out bigger, armoured DD's. At any range the Columbo can be a terror to cruisers. I dont run dead eye on it but I wonder how much better it would be and Im already regularly doing over 100k in damage (unless I get wiped out by an FDR, which has happened twice now) something I can only do in Thunderer. 

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5 hours ago, CaptainKaitoGhost said:

I do not fear an Italian BB shooting at me in a DD at all.

Unless it's a Guilio Cesare :Smile_ohmy:

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