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my13

remove green bot carriers co-op

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whatever ship i am using appears red bots cv's planes come directly to me to spot me so that all other ships can immediately target me. this is particularly obvious when i did a test using dd with aa off and detection range of about 2km and i go to edge of map with no other ships nearby the red cv's planes still come directly to me and spot me, without the red cv already knowing my location this would be virtually impossibe with size of map. if any red ships are being fed my location i consider this a type of cheating. if no human cv in battle should be no cv in co op battle to prevent this.

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i've never understood why MM would put in a green bot CV.

but there is a lot about MM I don't understand. like why it puts 4 ships on the right and middle and a lone ship on the left.

strange things are afoot at the circle k............

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3 minutes ago, my13 said:

whatever ship i am using appears red bots cv's planes come directly to me to spot me so that all other ships can immediately target me.

Read the mini map & don't charge in to far ahead of your teammates. 

This is standard co-op practice in a DD.


BTW, if you are the only DD ALL the reds are charging at you, even when you are not detected.

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for green bots you get at least one of each class

this includes CV

thats like one less ship that can steal Dmg from you

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Good Morning!

I play quite a bit of Coop and I do like to use my DDs there.  I believe the bots have RDF on by default and I have seen any number of the CVs make a beeline for me as a DD.  However, recently they have not so much as scratched my paint with their rockets or bombs.  Torps usually are dropped too close to arm. 

The part about everyone targeting you I see often as well.  I think my record was 8 reds targeting me at one time.  If it is 1 or 2 targeting me I will do the Zig-Zag pattern and 'follow the shell splashes' to work my way forward.  Smoke becomes needed if there are more than that, again to break target lock.

Have a great weekend!

 

Grey

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9 minutes ago, stretch0069 said:

strange things are afoot at the circle k............

 

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Welcome to COOP where if you are in a DD  you are #1 priority  :Smile_bajan2: for the Red Bots and they will chase you till the Ends of the map.   

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Don’t mind bot CVs in co-op much. Great place to just shoot down planes that don’t know how to dodge...

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to skyspartan, i play alot of co ops were there are no cv's at all, so that is not neccessarily true.

and as another point if the red ships are firing at me on other side of map when there is a dd or cruiser next to them ready to torp them then that is another indication of targeting specific players.

 

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to noworriesderpy1, it can happen with cruisers too, i liken it to a pack of rabid dogs chasing me!

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to greypaladin, i dont use cv's much so i double checked in my captains options and it doesnt appear rdf is an option for cv captains, and also in the test i went nearly straight left from spawn position to edge of map so probably wasnt the nearest green shiip to the cv anyway for rdf to pick me up instead of another green ship that was probably closer

 

 

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12 minutes ago, cgbosn4 said:

Don’t mind bot CVs in co-op much. Great place to just shoot down planes that don’t know how to dodge...

Oh my goodness ppl just don't realize those little NATS may bring forth a bounty of stuff   :Smile_Default:

From the Wiki

Update 0.8.3, only the number of shot down planes are calculated into credits and XP. This has been changed to damage done to planes

Credits

Total damage to aircraft is tracked and contributes to earnings.[5] The tier of the aircraft carrier that launched the planes is considered for tier disparity.

Base XP

Total damage to aircraft is tracked and contributes to earnings.[5] The tier of the aircraft carrier that launched the planes is considered for tier disparity.

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Bot CVs are largely just a nuisance, not a threat.  The positive side is that plane kills can net a lot of XP for very little threat.  The biggest issue is spotting, so you need to be able to use terrain for cover, or smoke for concealment.  The only other issue is trying to kill it before the game ends.

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i dont absolutely mind red cv's in battles if not being given unfair advantage, and also no need for them if no human cv on green side to match.

and i agree they can help run up score if the dd has good aa, i think one of mine just shot down 23 planes in a co op while chasing cv toward end of battle.

and as a side note, i liked it much better in earlier years of game when there were no green bots in co op, now with all the different battle types it has diluted players avail for co op so putting more bots in.

 

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1 hour ago, my13 said:

whatever ship i am using appears red bots cv's planes come directly to me to spot me so that all other ships can immediately target me. this is particularly obvious when i did a test using dd with aa off and detection range of about 2km and i go to edge of map with no other ships nearby the red cv's planes still come directly to me and spot me, without the red cv already knowing my location this would be virtually impossibe with size of map. if any red ships are being fed my location i consider this a type of cheating. if no human cv in battle should be no cv in co op battle to prevent this.

You do realize that ALL of the Red bots in Co-op cheat? They know where you are at all times. They will only actually fire at you when they 'spot' you but they will maneuver to intercept and often lay guns on you well before that. They know exactly when your torps hit the water. They have laser aim assist. Etc., etc. And yes, the bot planes will beeline at you (especially if you are in a DD) when the CV picks you.

The trick, since you know all of the above, is to act accordingly to mitigate what is mostly a mild threat. Mostly. 

Being a co-op main, I WANT CV's in battle on occasion, even if no Green air breather brings one. So, no, leave it like it is

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skullcowboy, i agree with what you are saying, i guess what gets me is that when i started playing the game that did not appear to be the case, the red bots seemed to play more like humans without all the advantages you listed. i had one other player describe red bots knowledge of green bot torp aiming/firing so ability to dodge them as magic torp dodging.

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Bot controlled CV's in Coop are easy to handle, and are non-issue. They're dumb as a brick, predictable as heck, and you can see the planes coming from miles away. Their drops are so poor, it doesn't take much to dodge them completely. And those planes are potential JUICY extra credits & EXP that I always can't help but salivate... lol. :Smile_trollface:

Plus, without them, you probably would have hard time doing any mission that requires you to shoot down some planes and stuff. So, no, they should absolutely stay.

My only gripe about them is (1) if I'm in a good AA ship, the planes usually never come to me, or (2) if they come after me then I'm usually in a poor AA ship so I can't shoot down many planes quickly, only to have somebody else sweep them down and take away my extra rewards. Curses... lel. :Smile-angry:

 

If you can't handle some dumb and predictable red bot planes coming from miles away, in Coop... then I'm loss at words. The bot controlled CV's are nothing like the human controlled CV's in PvP modes, and they pose minimal threat, at best.

Their spotting that makes the other red bots to focus on you? Well, (1) see the planes coming ahead and don't put yourself in a position to get focus fired, (2) keep your distance and wiggle & jiggle, and (3) use ISLANDS to break line of sight.

It's an old news that the red bots generally prioritize lowest health ships (i.e. usually DD's), and know where all ships are at all times, even the unspotted ones. So you need to adjust your tactics accordingly.

Edited by Blorgh2017
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1 hour ago, my13 said:

whatever ship i am using appears red bots cv's planes come directly to me to spot me so that all other ships can immediately target me. this is particularly obvious when i did a test using dd with aa off and detection range of about 2km and i go to edge of map with no other ships nearby the red cv's planes still come directly to me and spot me, without the red cv already knowing my location this would be virtually impossibe with size of map. if any red ships are being fed my location i consider this a type of cheating. if no human cv in battle should be no cv in co op battle to prevent this.

No way, there are mission to "shoot down planes" and this makes it super easy cause bots can't dodge flak.

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the planes themselves arent the greatest threat, its the 2 to 7 sips that then immediately start targeting me with their guns.

and i do all the things mentioned, but as the red bots are using the listed advantages more and more it is making the game less satisfying.

a long while back i used to get a laugh out of targeting red dd's with my guns and jiggling the mouse back and forth and see the red dd slow down or speed up like it was a puppet on the end of a wire.

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1 hour ago, stretch0069 said:

i've never understood why MM would put in a green bot CV.

Conditioning/Grooming players to cope with the presence of CVs in the game.

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1 hour ago, my13 said:

and as another point if the red ships are firing at me on other side of map when there is a dd or cruiser next to them ready to torp them then that is another indication of targeting specific players.

You should go to the PvE section of the forum and read some of the discussion about bot behavior.  If you play co-op regularly then knowing how the bots behave will be helpful to you.  Here's one spoiler, bots don't go after specific players. 

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1 hour ago, Blorgh2017 said:

Their drops are so poor, it doesn't take much to dodge them completely

I'd add a caveat of "MOST OF THE TIME". Sometimes you get rocket planes that will nail you no matter what you do. Dive bombers too. Torp bombers will hit you because their drop was so bad that a stray torp (super V spread) happens to go where you dodged

Edited by Sabot_100
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27 minutes ago, Sabot_100 said:

I'd add a caveat of "MOST OF THE TIME". Sometimes you get rocket planes that will nail you no matter what you do. Dive bombers too. Torp bombers will hit you because their drop was so bad that a stray torp (super V spread) happens to go where you dodged

I'll give you the "most of the time" thing.

Even then, however, it's such a rare occurrence that I just attribute it to a bad luck. And if you paid attention to the planes heading towards you from miles away, it should give you plenty of time to position yourself to throw off their aim.

I also get nailed by rockets on a rare occasion, but it's just ONE stray rocket or something, and it barely scratches my paint. Bombs? Same thing. Hardly an issue. Their drop is so bad, I often don't bother dodging and they still miss. Super wide torp spread? Why not just sail in between? The bots usually drop too late, so often times I just let the torps hit me, before they even arm. Again, hardly an issue.

And using an island properly can throw off a lot of the bot's drops.

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1 minute ago, Blorgh2017 said:

And if you paid attention to the planes heading towards you from miles away, it should give you plenty of time to position yourself to throw off their aim.

Usually, in a DD, I'll assume they are heading my way until proven otherwise. I will circle back toward an AA heavy ally to killl the planes fast and limit the time I am spotted if available. I have had matches where I turn into the rockets when the planes start their attack run which normally makes them overshoot by even more. Instead I get hit.

This is the exception, but it happens.

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3 hours ago, my13 said:

i dont absolutely mind red cv's in battles if not being given unfair advantage, and also no need for them if no human cv on green side to match.

and i agree they can help run up score if the dd has good aa, i think one of mine just shot down 23 planes in a co op while chasing cv toward end of battle.

and as a side note, i liked it much better in earlier years of game when there were no green bots in co op, now with all the different battle types it has diluted players avail for co op so putting more bots in.

 

There have always been Bots on the Green side in Co-op. Not sure how long you have been around but I have been here since 2016 and we have always had them. And we actually have MORE humans on the team these days as more people are playing Co-op just to play it and also for tasks and such we never used to be able to do. This is the Golden Era of Co-op human #'s for WOWS.

Players asked WG on these very forums a few years ago to end mirrored MM (ie; stop always matching a Fuso with a Fuso - mix it up now and then with another T6 BB) and to add CV's, BB's, and Cruisers to fill vacant human slots instead of always adding DD's. You could literally be the only human and have 7 Bot DD's for the rest of the team and that sucked. DD's were used to fill the empty slots 90%+ of the time and it was awful. We asked for variety and in uncharacteristic WG fashion they actually listened and did what we asked (thank you WG :cap_like:). It has made a huge improvement to the Co-op experience in a positive manner.

The current Red Bot CV's are not a real threat even though they are getting a little better at hitting you. The old RTS Red Bot CV's were far more of a threat than these new ones. The biggest threat a Red Bot CV posses to humans on the Green side is spotting. Green Bot CV's don't steal damage from you either because they are so bad. Now and then they might finish off a really low HP Red Bot but for the most part they do almost nothing unlike other classes that will take damage from the humans.  Having CV's also means we can do plane down tasks in Co-op which is a big deal for Co-op mains.

Bot CV's in Co-op are a good thing and I for one would be extremely upset if they were removed especially since I fought so long and hard to get MM changed and have other ships besides DD's added to fill human slots. They provide variety, allow for task completion, and they greatly increase rewards if you shoot down planes and/or damage the CV. The only real negative is in some games with Bot CV's you have to chase the Red one down at the end. But a couple minutes to grab more plane kills and CV damage is worth it. 

I say NO to removing the Bot CV's. NO NO NO! That hurts Co-op players it doesn't help them.

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