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Zaydin

What exactly is the identity of the new German DDs?

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I got absurdly lucky and got the Schultz as my very first random bundle so I shelled out the 6 dollars to get it and I cannot make it work. It doesn't have the health or armor to slug it out with cruisers nor a heal to help it stay in the fight against cruisers while its RoF, traverse and overall agility means you can't adequately duel other DDs alongside your anemic HE damage. On top of that, your size in the Schultz means you eat a lot of damage from both HE and AP.

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1 hour ago, Zaydin said:

I got absurdly lucky and got the Schultz as my very first random bundle so I shelled out the 6 dollars to get it and I cannot make it work. It doesn't have the health or armor to slug it out with cruisers nor a heal to help it stay in the fight against cruisers while its RoF, traverse and overall agility means you can't adequately duel other DDs alongside your anemic HE damage. On top of that, your size in the Schultz means you eat a lot of damage from both HE and AP.

Using this build I played around with you can get a stealth torpping ship with decent firing range to farm cruisers and BBs

https://wowsft.com/ship?index=PGSD209&modules=12121&upgrades=133321&commander=PCW001&skills=5654560&ar=100&consumables=111&pos=0

Edited by Boomer625

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Not a DD Main, I'll let the specialists handle this for builds and PVP tactics.  But I will toss in this bit of information regarding the AP shell performance.

shot-21-04-13-19-45-56-0643.jpg

 

Theoretically, with Schultz having 12.5km gun range once fully upgraded can citadel a Cleveland's 127mm armor belt at a pretty darn good range.  These AP shells have special bounce angles also.  Again, this is "on paper" and I do not have any of these new DDs to toy with.

 

I would also be very careful if you want to play like some traditional DDs in getting pretty close with Smoke going and everything.  These new DDs with their 150mm guns have worse gun bloom in smoke than their peers with normal DD sized guns.

9 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

*snip*

The new German DDs do have smoke.  One thing to remember is that their gun bloom from smoke isn't as bad as CRUISER CL guns, but they are worse than typical DD size guns.

Smoke Gun Bloom RangesBold ones are the new German DDs.

VII Z-31 150mm, 3.09km

VII Maass 128mm, 2.92km - Has Hydro with 4km ship detection range.

 

VIII GJM 150mm, 3.49km - Substantially worse than even the Tier VII.

VIII Z-23 128mm, 2.99km - Has Hydro with 5km ship detection range.

 

IX FS 150mm, 3.54km - It actually got worse!

IX Z-46 128mm, 2.83km - It actually went lower!  Has Hydro with 5km ship detection range.

 

X Elbing 150mm, 3.62km - Easily the worst gun bloom in smoke out of all these new 150mm armed German DDs.

X Z-52 128mm, 2.92km - It went worse than IX Z-46 but still better than VIII Z-23.  Has awesome Hydro with rocking 6km ship detection range!

 

And several USN DDs found in the same tiers.

VII Mahan, VIII Benson, IX Fletcher 127mm, 2.75km

X Gearing 127mm, 2.83km

*snip*

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I too was lucky to get the Schulz in the first bundle and if my first games in her are anything to go by, the identity of this new line are dedicated Snowflake Mules. There were 4 Schultz in one match including mine and y'know what happened? We all got torped to death trying to do anything remotely DD like! And that game wasn't a fluke.

The one game I didn't die to torps trying to do anything DD like was when I was happily farming a Colorado with AP when a Kitakaze just rushed and gunned me down while I could do jack spit since 3k in AP every 6.5 seconds doesn't beat 2k every 2 seconds...

The ships need a heal, or they need 35k base HP or they need a turning circle better than even one TT cruiser, or they need hydro, or... etc. since as it stands now this line is the last line you'll want to grind.

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2 hours ago, lloyd1701 said:

There were 4 Schultz in one match including mine and y'know what happened? We all got torped to death trying to do anything remotely DD like! And that game wasn't a fluke.

Why are you trying to play it like a normal DD?  The number one weakness of this ship is running into DD's at close range.  You don't want to be anywhere near a cap during normal play, and you want to be around 12-16km from your target in a Schulz.

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7 minutes ago, Moggytwo said:

You don't want to be anywhere near a cap during normal play, and you want to be around 12-16km from your target in a Schulz.

The new German DDs are going to disappoint some teammates, who naively expect their DDs to spot and cap. No one needs 1-2 more ships firing at CLs.

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39 minutes ago, Moggytwo said:

Why are you trying to play it like a normal DD?  The number one weakness of this ship is running into DD's at close range.  You don't want to be anywhere near a cap during normal play, and you want to be around 12-16km from your target in a Schulz.

So they are basically Russian DDs? 

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1 hour ago, contag10n said:

So they are basically Russian DDs? 

Yes except worse in every way but AP pen

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And AP pen irrevelant because enemy DD's do not possess enough of armor for anything.

I don't plan on having a collection of these until it's almost snowflake time. Thats about all they are good for.

You already know you don't take these into contested caps. You get summarily sunk. That does not mean I wont take them into contested caps and try to sink the reds.

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It is kind of weird, even by WG standards, that some of the German BBs get hydro but these "DDs" don't.

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light cruisers without a citadel with dd icon?? i dont understand either.. only from streamers that played them

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Think of them as a .22 sniper, a "light" sniper. It doesn't pack much punch but can shoot you in the eye.

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3 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

Think of them as a .22 sniper, a "light" sniper. It doesn't pack much punch but can shoot you in the eye.

Are they accurate enough to be snipers ? 

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Just now, eviltane said:

Are they accurate enough to be snipers ? 

On paper, best dispersion value in game by far. Tho haven't tested yet and still not sure what can you do with that on the field.

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Just now, ArIskandir said:

On paper, best dispersion value in game by far. Tho haven't tested yet and still not sure what can you do with that on the field.

Huh,  TIL ,thank you for that information!

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Think of it like a designated marksman. It's not a spammer. Stay off to the flanks of your teammates in a slight forward position, around islands. Forget about HE unless you are desperate on a nose in BB at long range. 

Use AP. Just use the AP. Targets of opportunity. Don't try to force fights. Pick your shots. If Slava was a DD. Don't Brawl. If a cruiser gives you side its not hard to get 16k shots into his guts every 6.9 "nice" seconds. The full pens the piss out of slight angled DDs too. The accuracy is impressive. 

Edited by MBRicochet
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I don't have any of them myself but from what I've seen in game and on various streams the best way to play them is like a Smolensk.

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Can confirm that excellent accuracy... but yeah don't try to play them like a traditional DD, won't work.

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51 minutes ago, MBRicochet said:

Use AP. Just use the AP. Targets of opportunity. Don't try to force fights. Pick your shots. If Slava was a DD. Don't Brawl. If a cruiser gives you side its not hard to get 16k shots into his guts every 6.9 "nice" seconds. The full pens the piss out of slight angled DDs too. The accuracy is impressive. 

 

13 minutes ago, attackcamel said:

Can confirm that excellent accuracy... but yeah don't try to play them like a traditional DD, won't work.

How is the fuse timer? Do you get full pens in superstructures?

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4 hours ago, Whiskey_Rebel said:

The new German DDs are going to disappoint some teammates, who naively expect their DDs to spot and cap. No one needs 1-2 more ships firing at CLs.

Yeah, I can't wait to get a game where my team has all those, and the other team has "real" DDs.....

Edited by Skpstr

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4 minutes ago, Skpstr said:

Yeah, I can't wait to get a game where my team has all those, and the other team has "real" DDs.....

Oh you bet that will be happening, a lot. Looks like the perfect time to queue in a "real" DD

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25 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

 

How is the fuse timer? Do you get full pens in superstructures?

BB superstructure eats full pens all day. Broadside DDs do get overpens. You do way more damage AP farming BBs. From what I noticed, for example a Daring, cannot bring its rear turret against you with out you being able to full pen his hull. At which point you are getting about 4k a salvo. Her ricochet angles are very good. Same applies for CLs. It's not very good for fighting DDs. Though you can knock out guns on the enemy boat and rip it to pieces potentially.

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Far as I can tell, the identity is "be the worst DDs ever made so everything else looks better by comparison"

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27 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

Oh you bet that will be happening, a lot. Looks like the perfect time to queue in a "real" DD

Cynical counter-move:

  1. Start a German DD division.
  2. Fire from 12 km all game
  3. Lose repeatedly.
  4. Cue the outrage from teammates.
  5. German DDs reworked.
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