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nastyCJ

Death of the Scharnhorst

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Let me start by saying that I'm an average player, nowhere near great or anything of the sort, but I have been around since Beta.

I don't know how many of you may share my opinion, but after the last recent updates I feel that the Scharnhorst has lost what remained of its edge. I have played over 760 battles in the Scharnhorst since it was added to the game way back when. The game has changed many times and has taken great leaps forwards, as well as backwards, since then and naturally the Scharnhorst has lost its original competitiveness from those early days. That said however, I feel like the ship has reach the point where it has little chance in a battle. Especially with dead eye and the death of brawling, it has become increasingly hard to fight anything at range thanks to its now abysmal dispersion. The constant T IX battles leave you with little options but to tuck tail and run from anything less than a cruiser and even then it is hard to stay afloat past the first five minutes. You could argue that it has become more like its real life counterpart, lacking the ability to deal with any heavy targets, but at one time it had such potential in this game. It was fun to push, take damage and deal it back, but now its just plain frustrating and demoralizing to play. 

If anyone else feels this same way let me know. It may just be myself and my friends, but I am at the point that after 760 some battles I rarely want to take it out. Its not worth being stuck amongst T IX ships, getting torn to shreds by ships outside your range or massacred by CVs. For a ship that was so diverse and fun to play once upon a time...it seems that the Scharnhorst is approaching its death in this game. 

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34 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

Deadeye is being removed just fyi.

Changed.

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38 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

Deadeye is being removed just fyi.

Unfortunately, It will be removed or made useless as Wg is well known for.  I personally find it sad that most are too lazy to learn how to counter new things in the game but would rather whine over it. HE spam is far worse than dead eye could ever be. Its burns through your repairs while deleting most ships. Most don't want a level playing field in a game. They want OP products to abuse and claim skill from it. Its seems fair for a ship to sit in smoke or close it it and spam HE but lord don't allow another ship to have the ability slap them from a safe distance. That's so unfair to them. Its no different when DDs had the ability to remain un-spotted while sending waves of skill and the response was Git Gud from them but when Radar and CV came in to play, they started to complain about how unfair it was. This mentality to me kills the game more than any changes made to the game its self.

 

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17 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

So it changed again?

It will be changed, not removed.

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22 minutes ago, Lert said:

It will be changed, not removed.

Changed, removed, if I'd ever been any good at long range gunnery maybe I would care.

Whatever some 'smart' person thought would happen with Deadeye, to me a skill that encourages staying in the back was a dumb idea to begin with.

On that point; what the hell did that person likely think Deadeye was suppose to do in the first place? Maybe if anyone had ever made that clear to me, I would be less willing to think it was a stupid skill to even add.

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5 minutes ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

On that point; what the hell did that person likely think Deadeye was suppose to do in the first place?

He intended for people to be smarter and realize that if your dispersion is 10% tighter and you sit 25% further away, you're gonna be 15% less accurate anyways. People see 10% tighter dispersion and fail to take into account that being further away from your target makes you less accurate, and that the one doesn't negate the other.

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I have to disagree with the OP don't play her as often as I used to but when I go a Horsting i do pretty well with her...

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1 hour ago, RipNuN2 said:

Deadeye is being removed just fyi.

More like altered rather then removed... Details are not out yet but I hope... They change the stipulation of Deadeye too...

"Activated when capping or within the process of capping".

 

It would make sense and compatible with Epicenter and Domination modes... I would be content if they changed it to  this ^...

Then again its WG... Changes just dont make sense with the available game mode provided.

Edited by Navalpride33

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10 minutes ago, Lert said:

He intended for people to be smarter and realize that if your dispersion is 10% tighter and you sit 25% further away, you're gonna be 15% less accurate anyways. People see 10% tighter dispersion and fail to take into account that being further away from your target makes you less accurate, and that the one doesn't negate the other.

A' lesser' negative benefit?

Maybe I'm just too dumb to understand someone at WG's 'smart' idea, but I don't see any point to that.

Maybe also for me things have always been; 'If you can't hit the target, get closer until you can.'

 

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1 minute ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Maybe I'm just too dumb to understand someone at WG's 'smart' idea, but I don't see any point to that.

You're overthinking it. I think WG didn't put too much thought in it either and completely overlooked human nature. People are thinking "I'm more accurate now if I sit further away" and don't have any logical thought beyond that, and that causes a snowball effect that WG didn't see coming.

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2 hours ago, nastyCJ said:

 

Let me start by saying that I'm an average player, nowhere near great or anything of the sort, but I have been around since Beta.

I don't know how many of you may share my opinion, but after the last recent updates I feel that the Scharnhorst has lost what remained of its edge. I have played over 760 battles in the Scharnhorst since it was added to the game way back when. The game has changed many times and has taken great leaps forwards, as well as backwards, since then and naturally the Scharnhorst has lost its original competitiveness from those early days. That said however, I feel like the ship has reach the point where it has little chance in a battle. Especially with dead eye and the death of brawling, it has become increasingly hard to fight anything at range thanks to its now abysmal dispersion. The constant T IX battles leave you with little options but to tuck tail and run from anything less than a cruiser and even then it is hard to stay afloat past the first five minutes. You could argue that it has become more like its real life counterpart, lacking the ability to deal with any heavy targets, but at one time it had such potential in this game. It was fun to push, take damage and deal it back, but now its just plain frustrating and demoralizing to play. 

If anyone else feels this same way let me know. It may just be myself and my friends, but I am at the point that after 760 some battles I rarely want to take it out. Its not worth being stuck amongst T IX ships, getting torn to shreds by ships outside your range or massacred by CVs. For a ship that was so diverse and fun to play once upon a time...it seems that the Scharnhorst is approaching its death in this game. 

Scharnhorst is still quite competitive in my opinion. Yes the gun are inaccurate  and have less pen/damage, but they are fast reloading and easily punish cruisers and are less likely to overpen DDs. Besides, Scharnhorst is a brawler at close range, and does not need good accuracy.

 

her torps make her deadly under 6 km and the 9.1 km secondaries can set fires that force other ships to use their damage control or heals up, allowing you to set them on permanent floods once you close into 6 km.

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43 minutes ago, Lert said:

You're overthinking it. I think WG didn't put too much thought in it either and completely overlooked human nature. People are thinking "I'm more accurate now if I sit further away" and don't have any logical thought beyond that, and that causes a snowball effect that WG didn't see coming.

 

agreed.gif

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5 hours ago, nastyCJ said:

 

Let me start by saying that I'm an average player, nowhere near great or anything of the sort, but I have been around since Beta.

I don't know how many of you may share my opinion, but after the last recent updates I feel that the Scharnhorst has lost what remained of its edge. I have played over 760 battles in the Scharnhorst since it was added to the game way back when. The game has changed many times and has taken great leaps forwards, as well as backwards, since then and naturally the Scharnhorst has lost its original competitiveness from those early days. That said however, I feel like the ship has reach the point where it has little chance in a battle. Especially with dead eye and the death of brawling, it has become increasingly hard to fight anything at range thanks to its now abysmal dispersion. The constant T IX battles leave you with little options but to tuck tail and run from anything less than a cruiser and even then it is hard to stay afloat past the first five minutes. You could argue that it has become more like its real life counterpart, lacking the ability to deal with any heavy targets, but at one time it had such potential in this game. It was fun to push, take damage and deal it back, but now its just plain frustrating and demoralizing to play. 

If anyone else feels this same way let me know. It may just be myself and my friends, but I am at the point that after 760 some battles I rarely want to take it out. Its not worth being stuck amongst T IX ships, getting torn to shreds by ships outside your range or massacred by CVs. For a ship that was so diverse and fun to play once upon a time...it seems that the Scharnhorst is approaching its death in this game. 

What's your play style?  Equipment/modules/upgrades?  Skill build?

Random battle?  Co-op?  Scenario Operation?

image_2021-03-14_181619.thumb.png.f3a4d2eafe2f3c5d6acc6c3339c13b9a.png

 

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Shimyhorse is my definite go to ship for Naria! Im tier IX games it is a bit “lacking” and would almost do better without the secondary build in a tier IX match but unfortunately you can’t change you build depending on the matchup pre-match. I don’t play mine near as much but still love it!!

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7 hours ago, Boomer625 said:

Scharnhorst is still quite competitive in my opinion. Yes the gun are inaccurate  and have less pen/damage, but they are fast reloading and easily punish cruisers and are less likely to overpen DDs. Besides, Scharnhorst is a brawler at close range, and does not need good accuracy.

 

her torps make her deadly under 6 km and the 9.1 km secondaries can set fires that force other ships to use their damage control or heals up, allowing you to set them on permanent floods once you close into 6 km.

She is certainly still a brawler, but I find that I'm rarely in a position to get close. During T VII games you can easily assume control of the situation and push/brawl when needed, but the likelihood of that in T VIII and IX (For me at least) has been low. I just remember the ship being much more capable of handling the enemy. The 11" guns have always been tricky, but It seems that the stars really need to align for a decent game now a days. Again, at least in my experience.

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4 hours ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

What's your play style?  Equipment/modules/upgrades?  Skill build?

Random battle?  Co-op?  Scenario Operation?

image_2021-03-14_181619.thumb.png.f3a4d2eafe2f3c5d6acc6c3339c13b9a.png

 

My equipment has changed little since getting the ship. The Captain build is fresh from the new skills update, but that being said I am constantly looking to improve it. 

shot-21.03.14_23.03.04-0840.jpg

shot-21.03.14_23.15.23-0912.jpg

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Looks like you're making a serious effort to improve gun range and dispersion values, with some survival tweaks using left-over points.
Interesting.
I'm gonna sleep on it and give it some thought.

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3 hours ago, nastyCJ said:

My equipment has changed little since getting the ship. The Captain build is fresh from the new skills update, but that being said I am constantly looking to improve it. 

shot-21.03.14_23.03.04-0840.jpg

shot-21.03.14_23.15.23-0912.jpg

Yeah I would not recommend deadeye if you are brawling, since you must be outside your base detection range for it it activate, and use it on the 4 pt repair skill.

But it might still work

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10 hours ago, Boomer625 said:

Yeah I would not recommend deadeye if you are brawling, since you must be outside your base detection range for it it activate, and use it on the 4 pt repair skill.

But it might still work

I had the repair for a while, but recently swapped it for deadeye for a change. I'm constantly looking to improve the commander build though the bulk of it has gone unchanged essentially. 

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13 hours ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Looks like you're making a serious effort to improve gun range and dispersion values, with some survival tweaks using left-over points.
Interesting.
I'm gonna sleep on it and give it some thought.

I should have added in that reply about play style and such. I use the ship in more of a supplementary role right now, but its sees time in all battle modes. My play style is sort of a hybrid brawler...usually maneuvering and messing with speed to dodge early fire while attempting long range shots at first. I then like to lead in a push when the time arises and do well in cq brawls. With the turning I do, the added benefit of faster traverse times and accuracy is always helpful.

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5 hours ago, nastyCJ said:

I should have added in that reply about play style and such. I use the ship in more of a supplementary role right now, but its sees time in all battle modes. My play style is sort of a hybrid brawler...usually maneuvering and messing with speed to dodge early fire while attempting long range shots at first. I then like to lead in a push when the time arises and do well in cq brawls. With the turning I do, the added benefit of faster traverse times and accuracy is always helpful.

Faster turret traverse never hurts.  :-)
I can't see anything wrong with your play-style.

It's probably a lot smarter than my all-ahead and damn the torpedoes style that I'm trying to modify and improve upon.  Yolo is fun in co-op, but doesn't usually work so well when I'm in random battles.  :-)

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