3,590 [PVE] IfYouSeeKhaos Members 10,582 posts 28,014 battles Report post #1 Posted February 17, 2021 (edited) ...No...it's not... & it's not just you either... The skills are the same for everybody...so just your ship didn't get nerfed by so & so changes... everybody's did. You don't need to post a thread (or keep posting numerous threads) explaining how your ship doesn't have the same abilities it did before or how the extra 2 points didn't help but actually ended up w/less abilities than it had before...we all know because it happened to us all too... & just to dispell the "Deadeye is so OP" rumor...it sucks when I use it...so it's not the skill... it's only the people w/very good predictive skills that will benefit by it (that's right...perfect aim is irrelevant as any maneuver after you aim & shoot exactly where the ship would have been will still result in all misses... it's about being able to predict where they will maneuver to by the time your shells get there...10-15 seconds after you fire them if you stay in the back w/it). Although if you advance w/it as the closer ships die it's quite more effective at the edge of your detection ranges I did discover...in the 4 or 5 battles I played w/it in my shiny new Thunderer. Edit: Any advice on what works for you is appreciated by those looking to figure out workable builds...but we all know what doesn't work in comparison to what used to. Edited February 17, 2021 by IfYouSeeKhaos 4 2 1 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1,816 [DRFTR] SKurj Beta Testers 6,053 posts Report post #2 Posted February 17, 2021 to be fair alot of the complaints are about the impact it has on the overall game play... by encouraging back row play etc... i bet even if deadeye was 5% and not 10% the effect on the player base would be the same... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
870 [-VT-] Sabene Members 978 posts 41,268 battles Report post #3 Posted February 17, 2021 Agreed. Everybody has the same number of skill points and access to the same skill set. Nobody has an advantage. Me? I like the rework. My captains can be specialized to a finer degree to suit my play style. And, I have seen my win rate push up 0.15% since 10.0 dropped. That may not sound like much but given my total battles it is actually quite nice. As to Dead Eye? The skill does promote BB sniping. Does this work at times? Yes. Does it hurt the team most games? Yes as well. BBs in the back can't hit a DD in a cap and therefore can't support their team's DDs. That leads to a lot of losses, though the BBs in the back may rack up some nice damage totals. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
524 [WOLFA] CorradoG60 Members 862 posts 9,495 battles Report post #4 Posted February 18, 2021 Destroying any chance of players like myself who bought ships because they were marketed as "strong secondary" ships and then ruining any brawling gameplay completely turned me off to this game. They are turning it into a WOT dumpster fire. They ruined the meta with dead eye and drastically dropped fire chance for all ships and they did this all because of reasons. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
517 [NAVAL] syp_twiz [NAVAL] Members 322 posts 17,485 battles Report post #5 Posted February 18, 2021 so your advice is it's all a chit sandwich and we all have to take a bite? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
983 Rouxi Members 2,076 posts 13,410 battles Report post #6 Posted February 18, 2021 18 minutes ago, CorradoG60 said: drastically dropped fire chance for all ships wut? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
313 [QQ7] ToxicSymphony Wiki Editor, Members, In AlfaTesters, Beta Testers 458 posts 10,908 battles Report post #7 Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said: ...No...it's not... & it's not just you either... The skills are the same for everybody...so just your ship didn't get nerfed by so & so changes... everybody's did. You don't need to post a thread (or keep posting numerous threads) explaining how your ship doesn't have the same abilities it did before or how the extra 2 points didn't help but actually ended up w/less abilities than it had before...we all know because it happened to us all too...I really wish this would end, its been an entire patch cycle people. We did the math 3 months ago and are all in the same place now :/. & just to dispell the "Deadeye is so OP" rumor...it sucks when I use it...so it's not the skill... it's only the people w/very good predictive skills that will benefit by it (that's right...perfect aim is irrelevant as any maneuver after you aim & shoot exactly where the ship would have been will still result in all misses... it's about being able to predict where they will maneuver to by the time your shells get there...10-15 seconds after you fire them if you stay in the back w/it). It has made Kansas noticeably more consistent for me, albeit in some very minorly noticeable ways, but nowhere near the level of the outcry and panik everyone's been throwing at it. Edit: Any advice on what works for you is appreciated by those looking to figure out workable builds...but we all know what doesn't work in comparison to what used to. I honestly found myself really enjoying the freedom of respec'ing all the time. Could slap on a non concealment build for a few games and meme around, and I didn't have to pay for it. Opened up a whole new avenue of the game for me, one that I hadn't even realized could be a thing. I still don't know what the best builds are and I'm one of the people who helped write a lot of the suggestions! The meta was always horrendously passive people just didn't pay attention to it and now are reinforcing their beliefs that DEADEYE is causing all of it (its not even close to all of it). Yes, secondaries are worse but they were *never* a primary source of damage anyways. Sure, we're missing out on some stuff, but meh, that's how it is and no amount of complaints will get us anywhere at this point. P.S. nice seein ya yesterday, sorta out of my normal habitat :D 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
7,036 Skpstr Members 34,409 posts 10,768 battles Report post #8 Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said: ... just to dispell the "Deadeye is so OP" rumor...it sucks when I use it...so it's not the skill... it's only the people w/very good predictive skills that will benefit by it (that's right...perfect aim is irrelevant as any maneuver after you aim & shoot exactly where the ship would have been will still result in all misses... it's about being able to predict where they will maneuver to by the time your shells get there...10-15 seconds after you fire them if you stay in the back w/it). One way to look at that is, players were asking for years for their aiming skill to pay off more and be less RNG. Looks like they got it..... Edited February 18, 2021 by Skpstr Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
983 Rouxi Members 2,076 posts 13,410 battles Report post #9 Posted February 18, 2021 5 minutes ago, ToxicSymphony said: The meta was always horrendously passive people just didn't pay attention to it and now are reinforcing their beliefs that DEADEYE is causing all of it (its not even close to all of it). It's not that it causing all passive play but that it's causing a specific type of passive play. Bad dead eye players will fall back from any push to keep their buff making it very hard for a team to hold ground. I think many aggressive players are starting to notice this and push hard early leading to total map control in a few minutes and a steamroll. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
313 [QQ7] ToxicSymphony Wiki Editor, Members, In AlfaTesters, Beta Testers 458 posts 10,908 battles Report post #10 Posted February 18, 2021 2 minutes ago, Rouxi said: It's not that it causing all passive play but that it's causing a specific type of passive play. Bad dead eye players will fall back from any push to keep their buff making it very hard for a team to hold ground. I think many aggressive players are starting to notice this and push hard early leading to total map control in a few minutes and a steamroll. The thing is people were doing this LONG before deadeye came out, its just been more noticed and exacerbated since then with people calling Deadeye as the sole reason for it. Yolo pushing early is a great way to just die, that's not exactly a winning strategy either. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3,590 [PVE] IfYouSeeKhaos Members 10,582 posts 28,014 battles Report post #11 Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, SKurj said: to be fair alot of the complaints are about the impact it has on the overall game play... by encouraging back row play etc... i bet even if deadeye was 5% and not 10% the effect on the player base would be the same... (Sorry all...should have broke this into a few different posts instead of 1 long 1...now that it's all typed out it got pretty big) Too true on the 5-10% analogy...but as toxic points out below back row camping has always been a thing (almost like they're going to make you repaint the camo after each battle if it gets scratched...but... 1 hour ago, Sabene said: Agreed. Everybody has the same number of skill points and access to the same skill set. Nobody has an advantage. Me? I like the rework. My captains can be specialized to a finer degree to suit my play style. And, I have seen my win rate push up 0.15% since 10.0 dropped. That may not sound like much but given my total battles it is actually quite nice. As to Dead Eye? The skill does promote BB sniping. Does this work at times? Yes. Does it hurt the team most games? Yes as well. BBs in the back can't hit a DD in a cap and therefore can't support their team's DDs. That leads to a lot of losses, though the BBs in the back may rack up some nice damage totals. It doesn't necessarily lead to any more losses because the other team is doing it also...& it's basically down to how many players on each team don't use it & support their team which is also random & probably about 50/50 overall... But glad to hear about your stat boosts... especially w/your battle count .. that's huge. 47 minutes ago, CorradoG60 said: Destroying any chance of players like myself who bought ships because they were marketed as "strong secondary" ships and then ruining any brawling gameplay completely turned me off to this game. They are turning it into a WOT dumpster fire. They ruined the meta with dead eye and drastically dropped fire chance for all ships and they did this all because of reasons. Again...all ships got the 2ndary nerf...& the DE fire chance nerf...so even though your 2nds efficiency & fire starting chances are reduced...so is all the 12 players on the red team using them against you. 49 minutes ago, syp_twiz said: so your advice is it's all a chit sandwich and we all have to take a bite? Didn't give any advice...& nobody is making anybody bite anything... I just pointed out were all being served the same sandwich (& we all have the choice to not bite it)...& it's not as runny as most think it is... Mines got some corn & peanuts...or maybe that's just corn nuts... I'll try to update after I take another bite later. 39 minutes ago, Rouxi said: wut? Pyrotechnics is only 1% instead of the 2% (or even 3% back in the day) that Demolition Expert was. 34 minutes ago, ToxicSymphony said: I honestly found myself really enjoying the freedom of respec'ing all the time. Could slap on a non concealment build for a few games and meme around, and I didn't have to pay for it. Opened up a whole new avenue of the game for me, one that I hadn't even realized could be a thing. I still don't know what the best builds are and I'm one of the people who helped write a lot of the suggestions! The meta was always horrendously passive people just didn't pay attention to it and now are reinforcing their beliefs that DEADEYE is causing all of it (its not even close to all of it). Yes, secondaries are worse but they were *never* a primary source of damage anyways. Sure, we're missing out on some stuff, but meh, that's how it is and no amount of complaints will get us anywhere at this point. P.S. nice seein ya yesterday, sorta out of my normal habitat :D Fortunately I heard early on that the rest all skills button was a 1 shot deal so I waited until the last moment (Sunday night) to use it so I could play w/builds & run my flakes & not be scrambling at the last minute to figure out what stupid builds I left on what ships...especially some of the odd builds I was using for dockyard missions... Did you get your missions done in time...forget what it was again you were working on...just remembered you had finished the dockyard already. I got the 6th dockyard complete...after getting Yahagi getting the extra draconics in the 6th set was all I was hoping for as I knew I didn't have time to grind 55k BXP for the 7th stage...the free T9 camo would have been nice but wasn't expecting it after my late start. 41 minutes ago, Skpstr said: One way to look at that is, players were asking for years for their aiming skill to pay off more and be less RNG. Looks like they got it..... 40 minutes ago, Rouxi said: It's not that it causing all passive play but that it's causing a specific type of passive play. Bad dead eye players will fall back from any push to keep their buff making it very hard for a team to hold ground. I think many aggressive players are starting to notice this and push hard early leading to total map control in a few minutes and a steamroll. The thing to realize is the red teams deadeye players are doing the same thing...unless there's a CV to help spot that out early most don't seem to realize that & only notice it from their team's perspective. That aggressive play isn't a bad strategy as long as you use islands cover to keep their deadeye players neutralized & make them expose themselves to your deadeye players to try to flush you out...but I guess the map layout/your spawn would be determining factors on how well that works. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
8,056 [SALVO] ArIskandir Members 12,936 posts 8,598 battles Report post #12 Posted February 18, 2021 2 hours ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said: UPVOTE 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
405 [VOP] Airjellyfish Members 1,112 posts Report post #13 Posted February 18, 2021 2 hours ago, CorradoG60 said: Destroying any chance of players like myself who bought ships because they were marketed as "strong secondary" ships and then ruining any brawling gameplay completely turned me off to this game. They are turning it into a WOT dumpster fire. They ruined the meta with dead eye and drastically dropped fire chance for all ships and they did this all because of reasons. I don't know...all of my ships catch fire just fine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
22,279 [ARGSY] Ensign_Cthulhu Members 28,882 posts 24,913 battles Report post #14 Posted February 18, 2021 12 hours ago, CorradoG60 said: and then ruining any brawling gameplay So what you're saying is that you expect your secondaries to be unlimited death and destruction and that now they're less effective it's the end of the world? Your main armament doesn't matter? Your torpedoes, if you have them (e.g. Tirpitz, Odin, Pommern), don't matter? I've brawled in the Minnesota - currently the equal slowest-reloading ship in the game. I took on two BBs at once (with a third firing on me from over a hill) and blew them both apart at a range of under 5km at the time of the kill shot. Don't you whine to me that brawling is now impossible, because I'm simply not going to believe you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
7,036 Skpstr Members 34,409 posts 10,768 battles Report post #15 Posted February 18, 2021 11 hours ago, Airjellyfish said: I don't know...all of my ships catch fire just fine. Possibly he's thinking of the need to DE. While that does "drastically" reduce fire chances for ships with small guns, (mostly DDs) it's minor for the rest of the ships. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,763 [CMFRT] KilljoyCutter [CMFRT] Banned 16,985 posts Report post #16 Posted February 18, 2021 Summary of opening post: "If everyone gets stabbed in the eye, then there's nothing wrong with getting stabbed in the eye." 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1,434 [TOOF] WarStore Banned 1,424 posts 11,497 battles Report post #17 Posted February 18, 2021 [PVE] Move along, people. Nothing to see here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
