Cruisers - Heavy AP Skill?

[gebert906]

Anyone run the Heavy AP skill (+5% max AP damage) on cruisers and find it worth three points for any of them?

Specifically, I was thinking it’d be nice to add some punch to Petro’s max AP damage, but not sure if the increase from 6350 to 6668 is worth the points. However with her sigma and velocity, maybe it would add up well?

[Rothgar_57]

Its an ok skill on Petro and Des Moine.   I prefer the AA the skills.  But if you don't put stock in AA skills its good.

[WaywardVariable]

2 minutes ago, gebert906 said:

Anyone run the Heavy AP skill (+5% max AP damage) on cruisers and find it worth three points for any of them?

Specifically, I was thinking it’d be nice to add some punch to Petro’s max AP damage, but not sure if the increase from 6350 to 6668 is worth the points. However with her sigma and velocity, maybe it would add up well?

I use that skill on US Heavy Cruisers Alaska, Buffalo and Baltimore, IMHO it's worth the points for the extra punch especially given the improved AP pen angles for those ships (improved pen angles = more opportunity for AP use).

Can't comment on the Petro since I don't have that ship (yet), however if you wanted to evaluate the effect, just keep track of your AP damage over several matches and add 5% to the average to give you an idea of how much the skill might boost your AP damage output over a match. 

[remington79]

I’ve been using it on my cruisers and I like it. I’ve really noticed it on my Graff Spee and Alaska. 

[gebert906]

8 minutes ago, WaywardVariable said:

I use that skill on US Heavy Cruisers Alaska, Buffalo and Baltimore, IMHO it's worth the points for the extra punch especially given the improved AP pen angles for those ships (improved pen angles = more opportunity for AP use).

Can't comment on the Petro since I don't have that ship (yet), however if you wanted to evaluate the effect, just keep track of your AP damage over several matches and add 5% to the average to give you an idea of how much the skill might boost your AP damage output over a match. 

Was thinking about trying it on Alaska as well

[pallas_2]

It’s good on the Siegfried.

[WaywardVariable]

5 minutes ago, gebert906 said:

Was thinking about trying it on Alaska as well

IHMO Alaska is one of the potentially bigger beneficiaries of that skill, given her already hefty AP shell dmg (8,900) that skill takes it up to (9,345) or looking at it another way, total potential broadside going from 80,100 to 84,105 which will pretty much ruin your day if you're on the receiving end of it. 

Happy Sailing! 

[TheArc]

36 minutes ago, gebert906 said:

Anyone run the Heavy AP skill (+5% max AP damage) on cruisers and find it worth three points for any of them?

I use it on all heavy hitting CAs, if you use AP a lot (and it's the only ammo for Petro IMO,) then I think it is all worth the points. I find the AA skills just aren't worth it if the CV is harassing, use the buddy system for support, another 10 or 25% of AA is nothing against a skilled CV. 

[ArIskandir]

I can't fit that thing in any build with less than 16 points, may be a nice extra for the last 3 points but it isn't a core skill for any build I can think of.

[DrHolmes52]

2 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

I can't fit that thing in any build with less than 16 points, may be a nice extra for the last 3 points but it isn't a core skill for any build I can think of.

I've only added it to one ship, and yeah it's a high point captain adder.

[ArIskandir]

25 minutes ago, TheArc said:

I use it on all heavy hitting CAs, if you use AP a lot (and it's the only ammo for Petro IMO,) then I think it is all worth the points. I find the AA skills just aren't worth it if the CV is harassing, use the buddy system for support, another 10 or 25% of AA is nothing against a skilled CV. 

I kinda disagree there, I'm getting a lot more practical use from 25% more AA than a 5% more AP. 

[KilljoyCutter]

For cruisers with large-caliber main guns, it would be a useful eventual spend of 3 points given its lack of activation condition or poison-pill nerf. 

[DrHolmes52]

1 minute ago, ArIskandir said:

I kinda disagree there, I'm getting a lot more practical use from 25% more AA than a 5% more AP. 

 

1 minute ago, KilljoyCutter said:

For cruisers with large-caliber main guns, it would be a useful eventual spend of 3 points given it's lack of activation condition or poison-pill nerf. 

I really think it is better for coop if only for the fact you don't need AA mods to kill planes.

I have it on the Yoshino (you use AP on it a lot more in coop).

[ArIskandir]

1 minute ago, DrHolmes52 said:

 

I really think it is better for coop if only for the fact you don't need AA mods to kill planes.

I have it on the Yoshino (you use AP on it a lot more in coop).

Aye, AA in Coop is a total waste. Builds for Coop are completely different... AA, Concealment...  are irrelevant. Coop is all about moar dakka!

[TheArc]

24 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

I kinda disagree there, I'm getting a lot more practical use from 25% more AA than a 5% more AP. 

What tiers are you playing at? I find a a boost help a lot in the lower and mid tears, but not when you start seeing to your 10 CD players. At least the good ones, I find that they know how to work their way around it well enough.

[ArIskandir]

15 minutes ago, TheArc said:

What tiers are you playing at? I find a a boost help a lot in the lower and mid tears, but not when you start seeing to your 10 CD players. At least the good ones, I find that they know how to work their way around it well enough.

T7-T8. Against T8 CVs (same tier) I find the effects noticeable, for example my Prinz Eugen is downing a lot more planes per match. It is a 25% aura DPS not the useless Flak damage increase, so it is the only thing effective against any type of player. As a T8, its effect against T10 CVs are nothing significant but vs same tier the hurt is real, stack it up with flags/modules and you will notice the difference in planes downed

[Sabot_100]

One factor that has to be considered is opportunity cost. Even if the 5% damage increase helps, what other skill(s) could you have taken with those points. If nothing else looks good, take the 5%,

[CRZY_TRAIN]

it does not give anything but 5%. no better groups or anything so i never even considered it to be honest, 5% is not that much exrta when ur using AP wth you cant fire AP at the DD's that are close or anything at angles so its 5% or less of maybe half your shots when its the same dispersion same reload ect.. when you need anything avail toward warding off all the planes [edited].  who knows maybe it is worth it just not for me

[Admiral_Thrawn_1]

2 hours ago, remington79 said:

I’ve been using it on my cruisers and I like it. I’ve really noticed it on my Graff Spee and Alaska. 

Yeah when I first saw that skill my mind immediately went to Graf Spee as that ship uses AP shells so much that’s it would get a lot of use of of the increased AP damage skill.

[Crucis]

2 hours ago, WaywardVariable said:

I use that skill on US Heavy Cruisers Alaska, Buffalo and Baltimore, IMHO it's worth the points for the extra punch especially given the improved AP pen angles for those ships (improved pen angles = more opportunity for AP use).

Can't comment on the Petro since I don't have that ship (yet), however if you wanted to evaluate the effect, just keep track of your AP damage over several matches and add 5% to the average to give you an idea of how much the skill might boost your AP damage output over a match. 

The super heavy AP shell skill would be excellent on the Petro, since it's a citadel machine with its outstanding AA.

[TheArc]

1 hour ago, ArIskandir said:

T7-T8. Against T8 CVs (same tier) I find the effects noticeable, for example my Prinz Eugen is downing a lot more planes per match. It is a 25% aura DPS not the useless Flak damage increase, so it is the only thing effective against any type of player. As a T8, its effect against T10 CVs are nothing significant but vs same tier the hurt is real, stack it up with flags/modules and you will notice the difference in planes downed

Hrm, I haven't played my Eugen much, but some ships definitely benefit more than others from an AA boost. A 25% boost on a ship with good AA matters a lot more than any effort to help a ship with bad AA. Either way, I'm glad it works for ya. I just don't really see the 3 point return value on it as much for ships like the Petro. Maybe the Alaska, Puerto or the Des Moines... but I think I'd still rather choose the heavy AP personal, preference I guess. 

[ArIskandir]

9 minutes ago, TheArc said:

Hrm, I haven't played my Eugen much, but some ships definitely benefit more than others from an AA boost. A 25% boost on a ship with good AA matters a lot more than any effort to help a ship with bad AA. Either way, I'm glad it works for ya. I just don't really see the 3 point return value on it as much for ships like the Petro. Maybe the Alaska, Puerto or the Des Moines... but I think I'd still rather choose the heavy AP personal, preference I guess. 

The 25% AA boost is 4-pt (not 3 like heavy AP), so there's also that to consider. It is obviously far more valuable in ships with already high base AA values, I wouldn't take that skill in IJN for example. But for USN and russian ships it is my second 4-pt skill, a lot of it due to other options being even more useless imo.

[KilljoyCutter]

1 hour ago, TheArc said:

Hrm, I haven't played my Eugen much, but some ships definitely benefit more than others from an AA boost. A 25% boost on a ship with good AA matters a lot more than any effort to help a ship with bad AA. Either way, I'm glad it works for ya. I just don't really see the 3 point return value on it as much for ships like the Petro. Maybe the Alaska, Puerto or the Des Moines... but I think I'd still rather choose the heavy AP personal, preference I guess. 

Percentage boosts upward are very prone to giving the most help to the ships that need it least. 

To those players who look at skills etc as a way of emphasizing ship strengths, this isn't a problem.

To those of us who look at skills etc as a way of mitigating a ship's weaknesses, this is a HUGE flaw. 

 

[tcbaker777]

the super cruisers and US CAs are probably the ones that benefit the most from it if i had to guess

[ArIskandir]

24 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Percentage boosts upward are very prone to giving the most help to the ships that need it least. 

To those players who look at skills etc as a way of emphasizing ship strengths, this isn't a problem.

To those of us who look at skills etc as a way of mitigating a ship's weaknesses, this is a HUGE flaw. 

 

The problem is applying the same rule to very differentt mechanics, some skills should be meant as a way to emphasize playstyles (AA or torp related for example), some others should aim to mitigate weaknesses (GtG is the poster child here). Applying the same rule (% increase of base value) to every skill is far from good.