Hizen good first impression

[HolyWaterCow]

I did all the Hizen steps and was hesitant to pay for the last 5 (or 4 or whatever the minimum # of steps requiring dubloons) due to a lot of negative comments but I really like it, granted I've only played a couple times. Hizen's guns are solid: surprisingly good damage for 408mm guns, very good dispersion, and very good turret angles that allow you to angle away/kiting while still being able to fire all 4 turrets. I've done pretty good damage in the couple of matches I've played with it. It feels like a tier 9 Fuso, or Amagi... high quality guns, good armor that bounces AP very well when angled properly (l I haven't gone broadside in it because.... that's stupid), mediocre AA, and sub-par maneuverability. If you play to its strengths, the quality guns will reward you. If you are too lazy to position yourself in order to be able to engage the enemy while well-angled, you'll probably be disappointed.

I think a lot of people are expecting, since it's a high tier (semi-)premium ship, that it'll have some very unique/exceptional play-style or trait - like absurdly good long-range guns (Thunderer, Shikishima), ridiculous strong bow armor (Jean Bart, Stalingrad [yes, I know it's a cruiser]), excellent secondaries (Pommern), outstanding maneuverability (Georgia) - but since it plays like a more balanced ship without any truly unique features that immediately standout, people jump to the conclusion that it's bad ship. If you are willing to play smart (positioning/angling) then the gun angles, tight dispersion (the tight salvos are great to watch), and surprisingly powerful AP will reward you. However, if you're feeling lazy/tired/whatever and still feel like playing, I'd definitely leave the Hizen in port since it feels like it requires a deliberate play-style unlike more "individualistic" ships that you can be less focused in and still do well (something like Georgia, Somers, Shima, etc.).

First battle:

Next battle:

 

EDIT: also, remember that paying for the last couple steps gives also gets you 10k coal, 2 santa containers (I got a tier 6 premium cruiser in both: Duca Dosta and Makarov both with 10pt captains), and steel... not that that's why you should spend for the Hizen but just thought it was worth reminding that the last couple steps have decent rewards as well.

[rafael_azuaje]

18 hours ago, HolyWaterCow said:

I did all the Hizen steps and was hesitant to pay for the last 5 (or 4 or whatever the minimum # of steps requiring dubloons) due to a lot of negative comments but I really like it, granted I've only played a couple times. Hizen's guns are solid: surprisingly good damage for 408mm guns, very good dispersion, and very good turret angles that allow you to angle away/kiting while still being able to fire all 4 turrets. I've done pretty good damage in the couple of matches I've played with it. It feels like a tier 9 Fuso, or Amagi... high quality guns, good armor that bounces AP very well when angled properly (l I haven't gone broadside in it because.... that's stupid), mediocre AA, and sub-par maneuverability. If you play to its strengths, the quality guns will reward you. If you are too lazy to position yourself in order to be able to engage the enemy while well-angled, you'll probably be disappointed.

I think a lot of people are expecting, since it's a high tier (semi-)premium ship, that it'll have some very unique/exceptional play-style or trait - like absurdly good long-range guns (Thunderer, Shikishima), ridiculous strong bow armor (Jean Bart, Stalingrad [yes, I know it's a cruiser]), excellent secondaries (Pommern), outstanding maneuverability (Georgia) - but since it plays like a more balanced ship without any truly unique features that immediately standout, people jump to the conclusion that it's bad ship. If you are willing to play smart (positioning/angling) then the gun angles, tight dispersion (the tight salvos are great to watch), and surprisingly powerful AP will reward you. However, if you're feeling lazy/tired/whatever and still feel like playing, I'd definitely leave the Hizen in port since it feels like it requires a deliberate play-style unlike more "individualistic" ships that you can be less focused in and still do well (something like Georgia, Somers, Shima, etc.).

First battle:

Next battle:

 

EDIT: also, remember that paying for the last couple steps gives also gets you 10k coal, 2 santa containers (I got a tier 6 premium cruiser in both: Duca Dosta and Makarov both with 10pt captains), and steel... not that that's why you should spend for the Hizen but just thought it was worth reminding that the last couple steps have decent rewards as well.

I do NOT want to ruin your post, but the Hizen is a bad battleship in its entirety.

[Helstrem]

1 hour ago, rafael_azuaje said:

I do NOT want to ruin your post, but the Hizen is a bad battleship in its entirety.

You have been extremely biased and negative in your own thread about Hizen, taking positions that were repeatedly shown to be false and instead of reacting to updated information by reassessing your view of the ship you simply pivoted to a new reason why you were right.

Potato Quality finds the ship to be balanced:

 

[rafael_azuaje]

BALANCED??? HAHAHAHA ,what a joke! 

https://na.wows-numbers.com/ship/3750704848,Hizen/     

Balanced great! 38 reload mainguns , bad sigma, bad accuracy, bad AA, he Get 5 nerf and you called Justice ! 

Many players have criticized the hizen, because something good was expected, like the missouri, georgia, jean bart or musashi which are much loved premium boats.

Anyway you will see that in a short time wows will classify it as MEH or GARBAGED.

[Helstrem]

2 hours ago, rafael_azuaje said:

BALANCED??? HAHAHAHA ,what a joke! 

https://na.wows-numbers.com/ship/3750704848,Hizen/     

Balanced great! 38 reload mainguns , bad sigma, bad accuracy, bad AA, he Get 5 nerf and you called Justice ! 

Many players have criticized the hizen, because something good was expected, like the missouri, georgia, jean bart or musashi which are much loved premium boats.

Anyway you will see that in a short time wows will classify it as MEH or GARBAGED.

Reload is 33.4 seconds after the upgrade is installed, which is a bit slow, but it does have twelve guns.  It isn't catastrophically slow though, only 3.4 seconds slower than my Missiouri.  Sigma is low, but again, twelve guns, which is to be expected from WG based on how they balance BBs with twelve or more guns below Tier X.  Her accuracy is standard Japanese accuracy, literally identical to every other Japanese BB other than Shikishima.  Bad AA is usual for IJN BBs, only two are not in this category.  Hizen has never been nerfed.  Not once.

Nobody reasonable would expect anything like Musashi.  Musashi is fundamentally broken for Tier IX.  She is a Tier 9.9 BB that gets matched against other Tier IX BBs.  Hizen is at least as good a Missouri, which outside of its credit earnings is little more than a nerfed Iowa.

Your average damage in Hizen is dramatically below average, your win rate is below average, your kills are dramatically below average.  Your Hizen performance is markedly below your average performance suggesting that you are doing something to sabotage yourself.

I am not a great player, but I have not found it hard to perform better than server average in Hizen in most ways (my frags are slightly below average).

I agree that Hizen is not great, but I don't agree that it is terrible.

[rafael_azuaje]

7 hours ago, Helstrem said:

Reload is 33.4 seconds after the upgrade is installed, which is a bit slow, but it does have twelve guns.  It isn't catastrophically slow though, only 3.4 seconds slower than my Missiouri.  Sigma is low, but again, twelve guns, which is to be expected from WG based on how they balance BBs with twelve or more guns below Tier X.  Her accuracy is standard Japanese accuracy, literally identical to every other Japanese BB other than Shikishima.  Bad AA is usual for IJN BBs, only two are not in this category.  Hizen has never been nerfed.  Not once.

Nobody reasonable would expect anything like Musashi.  Musashi is fundamentally broken for Tier IX.  She is a Tier 9.9 BB that gets matched against other Tier IX BBs.  Hizen is at least as good a Missouri, which outside of its credit earnings is little more than a nerfed Iowa.

Your average damage in Hizen is dramatically below average, your win rate is below average, your kills are dramatically below average.  Your Hizen performance is markedly below your average performance suggesting that you are doing something to sabotage yourself.

I am not a great player, but I have not found it hard to perform better than server average in Hizen in most ways (my frags are slightly below average).

I agree that Hizen is not great, but I don't agree that it is terrible.

Bro the izumo is a battleship meh said by WG and has better charateres that Hizen, the Montana has 12 guns 406mm , and is the best Battleship  T10 , has good armored,accurate, sigma, reload 30secs in stock and upgrade down 26, great range fire,  the Hizen has bad armored he get many fires and It if sucks, 32mm deck is less, many BB T9 has 50mm deck, the reload with 33,4 is high time. Bad secundaries ,Hp get nerf -5000 points ,Has AA bad a cv T8 can sunk easy a cv t10 kill fast. But well i think that Hizen need get  buff.

if you have the Hizen you play 10 times , and you said me hey rafa is true no is good bb, 150k damage in a battle yes i do. But it no make great bb.

[Helstrem]

6 hours ago, rafael_azuaje said:

Bro the izumo is a battleship meh said by WG and has better charateres that Hizen, the Montana has 12 guns 406mm , and is the best Battleship  T10 , has good armored,accurate, sigma, reload 30secs in stock and upgrade down 26, great range fire,  the Hizen has bad armored he get many fires and It if sucks, 32mm deck is less, many BB T9 has 50mm deck, the reload with 33,4 is high time. Bad secundaries ,Hp get nerf -5000 points ,Has AA bad a cv T8 can sunk easy a cv t10 kill fast. But well i think that Hizen need get  buff.

if you have the Hizen you play 10 times , and you said me hey rafa is true no is good bb, 150k damage in a battle yes i do. But it no make great bb.

Izumo, after repeated buffs, is a very good Tier IX BB.  Yes, it is probably better than Hizen, but Hizen's broadside weight and turret angles are better.  Montana is Tier X, not something suitable for comparison.  If you want to compare Hizen to an American BB the one to look at would be Minnesota at Tier IX, and in that comparison I think Hizen comes off rather well.  Hizen is covered in 32mm plating, it is true.  It shares that weakness with Lion, Alsace and Jean Bart.

Balance changes prior to release are not nerfs.  They are part of the production process.  Buffs and nerfs only occur to "finished" products.

You had 23 matches in Hizen as of yesterday, I had 28.

[Uncle_Lou]

Hizen is a solid, well balanced BB.  Not amazing, but very capable.  The only times I have real clunker games in it is if the game is a blowout and I simply don't have the time to get decent damage numbers.  Do I wish she was a little better? Sure, but I could say that about pretty much every ship.  The firing angles are amazing, and the guns hit quite hard even if the dispersion is sometimes wonky.  I am happy with the ship; I can't get a win in it, but that's not something I can always control.

Very workable ship; tbh if someone thinks it's bad, my guess is PEBKAC.

[MnemonScarlet]

I played Hizen for the first time today, it's actually pretty good. It's just not, you know, Musashi. This was my first 7 games in it today (ignore the Roma games, I just had to include them because the site showed them there):

Granted sample size/etc, but it's not the dog I thought it would be given what everyone says about it. It's just not overtuned af.