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cmdr_bigdog

Proposed changes to BB skills

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There are problems with the new bb skills and they have been well stated on the forums. Most forum talk has been complaints without good solutions. 

Here I propose changes, some give, some take. 

Deadeye is too big a buff and encourages more back line play. Needs balanced between buff and not to put everyone on the back line. Its a 4 point skill, take away the condition (no hostile ships etc) and include a 10% longer reload.  (2.5 seconds on Jean Bart, 4 seconds on Vermont) It will always be active and allow back line play without encouraging it. All styles of bb players would have a decision to make. 

Improved Secondary Battery Aiming. The new skill reduces effectiveness of secondary builds. Change to -50% dispersion and keep both sides shooting. Keeping both sides shooting would be a trial run simply for change. Pre-rework some players passed on Manual Secondaries because the guns didn't automatically go off and were only on one side. This would tempt them to take it.  (Those that used it before rework REALLY liked it so a complete change back is also viable.) 

Emergency Repair Specialist a 4 point skill that buffs one use of DCP and of RP but only buffs action time 10% (for US and KM BBs DCP changes 2 seconds for Yamato it is 1 second) This was a 3 point skill without the "action time". Its not worth 4 points as it is.  Make it more worth 4 points. Lengthen action time to 25%. 

If you don't like these then propose your own changes. We know WG will not go back to the way it was. 

 

 

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This is a great suggestion, I would go for 12-15% reload penalty. I am not a BB main and I can tell you trying to play the objectives for fun factor is gone for me. Pushing in a DD or CA is now nearly impossible since the BBs will not even try to follow. 

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I like your suggestions, but I think the player base is using Deadeye incorrectly anyway. To me, the best use of Deadeye is push up so the enemy is just outside of your BBs detection range, where the BBs gunnery characteristics improve, ie. at about 2/3 to 3/4 gun range, then that 10% improvement actually will mean more shells hitting the targets. Also, when your detected HUD goes off, you know you lost the Deadeye improvement and should back off some. Since at max range 10% is only going to give you a hand full of more hits over the whole match, then for some nations like the French, 10% will likely not be noticed at long ranges.

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56 minutes ago, cmdr_bigdog said:

Make it more worth 4 points. Lengthen action time to 25%. 

Do not forget that it also increase the length  of the repair party, making it heal more. A ship like Conqueror can get 14k more health out of its heal than before for instance.

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1 minute ago, Karstodes said:

Do not forget that it also increase the length  of the repair party, making it heal more. A ship like Conqueror can get 14k more health out of its heal than before for instance.

Thats what he said.

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I agree somewhat with the changes you propose but one  goes to far and one not far enough. For Deadeye I think an increase of 10% to ROF would work WITH the qualifier in place but without the qualifier then i think it should have a 20% increase in the ROF. For the Sec. builds I'd increase the accuracy to 40% but make it so that the guns that can bare on the selected target only fire on that target.  

Edited by bosco1111

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7 minutes ago, SirPent13 said:

Thats what he said.

Only he seemed to ignore the potential impact on heal that it have.

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despite all the hate towards dead eye skill the biggest problem with BBs is that there is absolutely no reason for close range combat so i would rather rework skills to encourage close range combat

 

emergency repair specialist: --2% to damage control party cooldown for each enemy spoted within 13km  

AA gunner: bring back the old BFT 10% to secondary reload and 10% to AA continuous damage

long range secondary guns skill: olso increace AA range

basics of survivability: replace module restoration with "destroyed  AA and secondary guns can be restored after  x seconds" 

super heavy AP shell: replace those penaltys to fire/flooding with 10% lower initial shell speed

close quarters combat: add +10% to max speed while within secondary range of an enemy

concealment expert: -15% to detection radius, -12% to main guns range

 

 

Edited by pepe_trueno

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3 minutes ago, Karstodes said:

Only he seemed to ignore the potential impact on heal that it have.

Well your quoted figure of 14k extra HP from a 10% buff is inaccurate. Base heal is 2%/s for 20 seconds. Conq has 82,900 base HP (82,900 / 100 * 2 = 1658 HP per second)
the 20% (20s / .10 *2 = 4s extra) repair flag takes a normal Conq heal from 33,160 hp to 39,792 hp, so a net gain of 6632 hp.

Depending on how the heal bonuses are applied (summative or cumulative) you will get either an extra 2s or 2.4s of heal time from the 10% action time of the new SI:
26 * 1658 = 43,108 hp, so a net gain of 3,316 hp
26.4 * 1658 = 43,771.2 hp, so a net gain of 3979.2 hp

So, Conq doesnt even come close to gaining the 14k hp you described. even with an additional 25%, it would still be ~8230 extra HP.

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13 minutes ago, SirPent13 said:

Well your quoted figure of 14k extra HP from a 10% buff is inaccurate. Base heal is 2%/s for 20 seconds. Conq has 82,900 base HP (82,900 / 100 * 2 = 1658 HP per second)
the 20% (20s / .10 *2 = 4s extra) repair flag takes a normal Conq heal from 33,160 hp to 39,792 hp, so a net gain of 6632 hp.

Depending on how the heal bonuses are applied (summative or cumulative) you will get either an extra 2s or 2.4s of heal time from the 10% action time of the new SI:
26 * 1658 = 43,108 hp, so a net gain of 3,316 hp
26.4 * 1658 = 43,771.2 hp, so a net gain of 3979.2 hp

So, Conq doesnt even come close to gaining the 14k hp you described. even with an additional 25%, it would still be ~8230 extra HP.

10% is 2 more second of the 20 second base.

you get 1658hp per second.

you have 4 heal. So 8x 1658 = 13 264, before the heal flag.

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Just now, Karstodes said:

10% is 2 more second of the 20 second base.

you get 1658hp per second.

you have 4 heal. So 8x 1658 = 13 264, before the heal flag.

Ah, I thought you were talking about a heal by heal basis. my apologies.

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1 minute ago, SirPent13 said:

Ah, I thought you were talking about a heal by heal basis. my apologies.

No issue.

my point is, in total, it do give you quite a lot of Hp. Conqueror and Lion are odd case for sure, but even on a Yamato you can scrap some 5k of heal in total. It is, in my opinion, a buff that can easily justify the 1 more point. It is even better than FP for the British in my opinion.

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2 hours ago, cmdr_bigdog said:

There are problems with the new bb skills and they have been well stated on the forums. Most forum talk has been complaints without good solutions. 

Here I propose changes, some give, some take. 

Deadeye is too big a buff and encourages more back line play. Needs balanced between buff and not to put everyone on the back line. Its a 4 point skill, take away the condition (no hostile ships etc) and include a 10% longer reload.  (2.5 seconds on Jean Bart, 4 seconds on Vermont) It will always be active and allow back line play without encouraging it. All styles of bb players would have a decision to make. 

Improved Secondary Battery Aiming. The new skill reduces effectiveness of secondary builds. Change to -50% dispersion and keep both sides shooting. Keeping both sides shooting would be a trial run simply for change. Pre-rework some players passed on Manual Secondaries because the guns didn't automatically go off and were only on one side. This would tempt them to take it.  (Those that used it before rework REALLY liked it so a complete change back is also viable.) 

Emergency Repair Specialist a 4 point skill that buffs one use of DCP and of RP but only buffs action time 10% (for US and KM BBs DCP changes 2 seconds for Yamato it is 1 second) This was a 3 point skill without the "action time". Its not worth 4 points as it is.  Make it more worth 4 points. Lengthen action time to 25%. 

If you don't like these then propose your own changes. We know WG will not go back to the way it was. 

 

 

Deadeye should be replaced with an entirely different skill.  10% lower dispersion is actually about a 19% reduction in area in which the shells can fall, and most of that removed 19%, if the aim is good, is water that you don't want to hit anyways.  If WG is set on keeping Deadeye it should be 5% or so.  10% is simply ridiculously powerful.

 

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Secondaries were destroyed with the update. Prior to the update they had some promise and were useful in some ships. Now it's not worth it. Yes Wows gave a little more range and a little more boom. But thats not the problem with secondaries. Its accuracy that has gone out the window. Its enough to make me gamble a bit more to launch torps closer to the big enemy ship that cannot hit me very much.

Deadeye is something that should have been in BB's from day one. For 5 years I never shoot at range more than say 12km or so. Because I cannot hit anything. Now Im all over the thunderer reliving a missed childhood and trashing certain BB's who are now too damaged to survive a push to get to me or game objective. Thats what BB's should have been a long time ago.

It will take teamwork to over come it. IE Smoke from DD's etc. You can escort brawlers in close with two dd's smoking in turns eventually the heavy stuff is in where it needs to be and the sniper BB has no leg to stand on anymore and gets sunk. But such coordination is too much to expect of random public teams who are probably pretty selfish in completing solo missions etc.

Edited by xHeavy

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replace dead eye with a brawling skill...  a bonus to reload when attacking ships within your standard detection range.. stacking with CCC

 

the back row snipers can stay there, no buffs to encourage them, and no negative compared to what they are used to (less whines)

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