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pig8

Buffalo + AR?

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A lot of people have said that Buffalo is a meh ship. I don't think so. I actually enjoy it more than the baltimore, basically for one reason: DPM.

Sure, on paper, the DPM seems absolutely terrible, compared to the DM and sometimes even the Baltimore. But AR changes all of that.

I've just picked up the Buffalo for a few games, and at the start of the battle, the reload, is kinda meh, at 10.5 (running the reload mod). But as the game continues, your DPM actually gets much better, in fact it could reach the DPM of the DM that doesn't have reload mod and no AR. The reason is that the Buffalo benefits much more with AR then other US Heavy Cruisers, as AR buffs the reload, giving 0.2% decrease in reload for each 1% HP you lose. So practically the more guns you have, the more you benefit from AR. After doing the math I actually found that AR gives the Buffalo a 60% better benefit than the DM, which is just crazy.

If I'm wrong about that someone pls correct me? I'm not sure if that's how it's supposed to work, but if it does I think that makes the Buffalo a much better ship than what people have said it to be. Of course, the DPM is still incomparable to a DM that does the same. DM is just absurd.

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She has a lot of guns but a big problem is she has to show a lot of sides to use them.  That's how Buffalo gets deleted.

 

Des Moines has 5.5 seconds base reload by default.  She has bad gun angles also, as do practically all USN Cruisers do, but the super fast default reload speed means DM isn't really forced to fire all 3 turrets to have DPM.  Matter of fact, I did a lot of DM games where I almost exclusively only use the forward turrets.  This is especially true if DM gets to play around in confined areas with islands, contesting caps.  You DON'T want to present a broadside like a Buffalo has to for lots of firepower.  The fast reload of DM means she puts immense pressure even against other Cruisers with only her 2 forward turrets.

 

The overwhelming vast majority of Cruisers in the game need to show a bit of sides to have good damage dealing.  DM with her 203mm guns with 5.5 seconds base reload doesn't need to.  This is absolutely crucial when space in the fighting area is at a premium.

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37 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

She has a lot of guns but a big problem is she has to show a lot of sides to use them.  That's how Buffalo gets deleted.

 

Des Moines has 5.5 seconds base reload by default.  She has bad gun angles also, as do practically all USN Cruisers do, but the super fast default reload speed means DM isn't really forced to fire all 3 turrets to have DPM.  Matter of fact, I did a lot of DM games where I almost exclusively only use the forward turrets.  This is especially true if DM gets to play around in confined areas with islands, contesting caps.  You DON'T want to present a broadside like a Buffalo has to for lots of firepower.  The fast reload of DM means she puts immense pressure even against other Cruisers with only her 2 forward turrets.

 

The overwhelming vast majority of Cruisers in the game need to show a bit of sides to have good damage dealing.  DM with her 203mm guns with 5.5 seconds base reload doesn't need to.  This is absolutely crucial when space in the fighting area is at a premium.

Actually, in retrospect, doesn’t Buffalo kind of play like the new US BBs? As opportunistic blappers?

In any case, I like Buffalo more than my DM.

DM tends to generate “A ROACH! KILL IT!” responses, while the ‘bad’ Buffalo gets dismissed, metaphorically at least.

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Personally, I prefer Baltimore over Buffalo, for the same reasons as @HazeGrayUnderway stated.  It can put the bulk of its firepower forward without too much risk.

Buffalo is a decent ship, but I feel is a step down between Baltimore and Des Moines.

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I loathed my Buffalo, my WR was around 40%. Guns were ok, AA was good but unless you spent the majority of the game hiding it was blapped pretty fast. Rare to see one in a game after 10 minutes. Still play my Baltimore often and the Des Moines is a much better boat (but it's always a primary target of the enemy team..). Just felt no love for the Buff, after 40 games I just free xped to the DM.

 

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22 minutes ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Actually, in retrospect, doesn’t Buffalo kind of play like the new US BBs? As opportunistic blappers?

In any case, I like Buffalo more than my DM.

DM tends to generate “A ROACH! KILL IT!” responses, while the ‘bad’ Buffalo gets dismissed, metaphorically at least.

Regular USN Cruisers all get blapped pretty hard but the problem for the Buffalos that I saw in Randoms was that showing a lot of turrets was a good way to get deleted.

 

I was never fond of Buffalo in Tier IX.  I actually preferred the Old Tier IX Post-Buffs Baltimore as she played very close to what you'd eventually get with Des Moines.  That version of Buffalo had with MBM3 a reload of 8.8 seconds.  The style of play was a natural evolution that would prepare you for Des Moines.

 

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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13 minutes ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Actually, in retrospect, doesn’t Buffalo kind of play like the new US BBs? As opportunistic blappers?

If anything - it's more what they should have been in a cruiser form - Partially because it doesn't deal with the same IFHE spam which is a major issue for the new line due to their speed and BB's as a whole. But angled right sure you can't take all your firepower on a target - but I've withstood multiple higher level BB's firing at me in that and Baltimore for 10 minutes without being sunk or heavily damaged by them - more often it being fires or cruisers switching to auto-pen rounds if the BB's don't break and fire HE at me. But it has decent accuracy and can brawl with ships of it's own type, and to a lesser degree even battleships - or at least I can brawl BB's with them. It also has speed that makes up for it's comparative lack of armour to the new BB's. It has enough protection to fight at close range, enough RoF for mid-range, and enough accuracy for long range. New BB's lack all 3 of those things, or at the very least, Kansas has while playing it, and the 9 every time I've observed/fought it. Guns aren't really that accurate, with a slow reload that really becomes an issue when every ship out runs you and some just have to spam a round type that instantly pens your armour - especially Kansas with being nothing but 32 mm or less, and not having enough protection namely from that type of ship that your arguably supposed to be the counter to to simply outlast it as you wait a week for the guns to reload and hopefully hit, or chase it till it's out of room so that the guns will hit and sheer volume from secondary guns tear it apart. 

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3 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

I was never fond of Buffalo in Tier IX.  I actually preferred the Old Tier IX Post-Buffs Baltimore as she played very close to what you'd eventually get with Des Moines.

Much like DM, I was never fond of Baltimore.

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5 hours ago, pig8 said:

But as the game continues, your DPM actually gets much better, in fact it could reach the DPM of the DM that doesn't have reload mod and no AR. The reason is that the Buffalo benefits much more with AR then other US Heavy Cruisers, as AR buffs the reload, giving 0.2% decrease in reload for each 1% HP you lose. So practically the more guns you have, the more you benefit from AR. After doing the math I actually found that AR gives the Buffalo a 60% better benefit than the DM, which is just crazy.

If I'm wrong about that someone pls correct me? I'm not sure if that's how it's supposed to work, but if it does I think that makes the Buffalo a much better ship than what people have said it to be. Of course, the DPM is still incomparable to a DM that does the same. DM is just absurd.

The skill description is correct, but your math is completely off. 

DPM is determined by the number of guns x rate of fire. As AR only affects reload, it does not matter how many guns you have; all ships will benefit the same way. 

Buffalo gets the same benefits from AR as every other ship. So you get a ~20% boost to DPM at most. 

Also. every ship is expected to carry AR except for CVs. 

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5 hours ago, pig8 said:

So practically the more guns you have, the more you benefit from AR. After doing the math I actually found that AR gives the Buffalo a 60% better benefit than the DM, which is just crazy.

I'd like to see what you're comparing to what.  Show the math, please.

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