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Ace_04

Is It Time to Buff Perma Camos?

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Just looking to see what you guys think here.....but is it perhaps time to buff the bonuses of permanent camos below T10?  With the utter plethora of single-use camos available to most players, and the fact that they typically yield much better return than perma camos at T8 and below, I'm starting to think what is the point?

Honestly, outside of T10 (which there is value) and somewhat T9, I haven't used a permanent camo below T9 in a very, very long time.  The benefits of the single-use camos are much too good to pass up.

Your thoughts?

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Short of WG not making more money off single use camos.  I don't see a reason not too.  I never use them unless I got them for rewards or the occasional really nice looking one. 

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Agreed, the way its setup now its pretty well foolish to put a perma camo on a ship below T8. I admit to doing but only I ships I really like & have completed the line. WeeGee would no doubt squeeze out a few more pesos if they made them actually desirable.  

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43 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

Just looking to see what you guys think here.....but is it perhaps time to buff the bonuses of permanent camos below T10?  With the utter plethora of single-use camos available to most players, and the fact that they typically yield much better return than perma camos at T8 and below, I'm starting to think what is the point?

Honestly, outside of T10 (which there is value) and somewhat T9, I haven't used a permanent camo below T9 in a very, very long time.  The benefits of the single-use camos are much too good to pass up.

Your thoughts?

It's long over due..............................

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On one hand I completely agree; it could even be an interesting scenario where you say buy a permacamo for a specific tech tree ship, then have to do a small quest to upgrade it,  adding FXP or CXP bonuses etc.

On the other hand I don't know how much it would further trivialize grinding which is already pretty easy.

The only permacamo I have bought for a tech tree ship was for Cleveland before the cruiser split.

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Even in Coop, I have to say that there is little need for a T8 perma camo if you have a stock of good single use ones. At T8 you need an economic boost but the perma camo is a bit weak so I usually end up using a good single use camo. I didn't keep a lot of T7s, but I don't remember them being a problem credit income wise.

Buffing the economic boost on T8 perma camo would be very nice, T9 could use a small buff as well. T9 perma camo is just good enough to use but not enough to burn doubloons on.

At T8 and T9 I practically only use the free event and campaign camos.

Edited by MasterDiggs

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46 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

Just looking to see what you guys think here.....but is it perhaps time to buff the bonuses of permanent camos below T10?  With the utter plethora of single-use camos available to most players, and the fact that they typically yield much better return than perma camos at T8 and below, I'm starting to think what is the point?

Honestly, outside of T10 (which there is value) and somewhat T9, I haven't used a permanent camo below T9 in a very, very long time.  The benefits of the single-use camos are much too good to pass up.

Your thoughts?

My primary thought is that WG would buff the price of buffed permacamos.

Beyond that, I understand where your thinking comes from. The permacamo bonuses are uncompetitive with the vast majority of the single-use camos. If I’m grinding any tech tree ship below T10, a permacamo is the way to slow the grind down, really.

I have an assignable T9 permacamo waiting to be assigned, and a T8 to win next week, and I’m having a hard time figuring out where to assign them. The only viable candidates are ships whose grind is done, so as to save on usage of the good single-use camos.

There was a time when the credits bonus was worthwhile, and single-use camos were scarce, but now I have about 1800 high-XP & credits single use camos (plus almost 1900 Type 1,2, and 5 bargain basement camos), and over 300,000,000 credits.

It’s hard to see value in a purchased permacamo right now.

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Forgot to add that since all tech tree ships are subject to nerfing/buffing, there's a very real possibility the permacamo you buy for a ship to end up being stuck on a ship that's now a shadow of it's former self. In some cases you might  not even  be compensated, such as what happened with owners of the Moskva permacamo.

 

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17 minutes ago, warheart1992 said:

On one hand I completely agree; it could even be an interesting scenario where you say buy a permacamo for a specific tech tree ship, then have to do a small quest to upgrade it,  adding FXP or CXP bonuses etc.

On the other hand I don't know how much it would further trivialize grinding which is already pretty easy.

The only permacamo I have bought for a tech tree ship was for Cleveland before the cruiser split.

Adding a CXP bonus to them with the new commander skill rework, would make sense both from a player side and business side with the increased cap on CXP. FXP on the other hand would reduce line grinding as well as make it even easier to grind out RP.

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1 minute ago, warheart1992 said:

...what happened with owners of the Moskva permacamo.

 

And I can’t believe I forgot about that one: the insta-devaluing to zero of a purchase of a permacamo, by turning it into an “included for free” item.

Reminds me that I have resolved since then, to not purchase permacamos.

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1 hour ago, YouSatInGum said:

COOP players might disagree about using single use ones....

As someone who's very fond of holding on to favourite ships and playing a lot in co-op, I'm going to agree with this. Part of the reason I have the stock of single-use camos that I do is that I have quite a lot of permacamos on various ships, many of which I liked the ships enough to buy them for, especially back when WG had half-price sales for everything up to Tier 8.

I think the T9 camo could benefit from a small tweak to make the tier less credit-abusey in co-op without premium time, but otherwise, standard-for-tier permacamo is IMHO in a pretty good place right now.

 

The one thing that WG could improve on if it wants to sell permacamos for premium ships is to give them some sort of differentiating bonus, like the National ones that you can get for Warspite, Shinonome and Graf Spee (more XP, more credits; in Randoms, often enough extra credits to completely wipe out service costs).

Another good example would be the pair of camos I got with the ship when I bought the HSF Harekaze last year. I got the as-seen-on-TV version which offers the standard Tier 8 bonuses plus a free XP boost, and a Kitty-themed camo which offers standard T8 bonuses plus a Commander XP boost. (There was also a standard Kagero-type camo for those who want to sail the Harekaze without any anime frippery; I think that one has the FXP boost, but I never mounted it because I always take the kitty one for the CXP benefits.)

16 minutes ago, MannyD_of_The_Sea said:

And I can’t believe I forgot about that one: the insta-devaluing to zero of a purchase of a permacamo, by turning it into an “included for free” item.

Reminds me that I have resolved since then, to not purchase permacamos.

You're still bitter about that? By all means let it gnaw on your soul and see where that gets you in the long run, but I guarantee you it's not a good place. 

I could bi*** and whine and moan about the Black being pulled to become (eventually??) a coal ship mere weeks after I'd spent all my steel for it, the Yubari becoming a coal ship after I bought mine for money and ditto eventually the Anshan; the Tachibana Lima being offered to win in-game shortly after I paid money for the original, ditto the Graf Spee (after a longer period); winnable permacamos being offered for ships that I'd already paid dubs to equip (e.g. Leander, Icarus) and so forth... but I chose instead to focus on how lucky some people were to be able to get that stuff in-game for free rather than having to cough up.

When the RU cruiser split came, yes, it was my turn to benefit. That didn't stop my sympathies lying with those who hadn't been given either dup doubloons for Moskva's permacamo or a T10 camo for the Nevsky.

Edited by Ensign_Cthulhu
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The only real draw for me in perma camos vs the single use is that generally speaking the permacamos are nicer looking and at least semi-historical in appearance.  I have a strong aversion to the gaudy colored theme camos.  Frosty Fir Tree is probably the worst offender, IMO and despite having decent bonuses I sell them for credits rather than put them on a ship.

Given that the perma camos cost actual money/dubs I would not be opposed to improving or adding to the benefits they provide.  I have no doubt they could be improved without being game-breaking while still providing a compelling reason to use the single-use paint jobs. 

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I think that with WG overhauling captain skills again and adjusting equipment like they did this past year, camo may be a thing they look at fairly soon. It's an untapped resource that could be made far more interesting. 

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Below T9: yes. The only perma camos I have on ships here were won from events/combat missions, and they provide little XP bonuses and you’ll seldom lose credits at these tiers

T9: here is where having a permaflauge makes a difference. The XP bonus is notably better, and the extra service cost reductions make bad games barely break even. Although maybe a 10% credit bonus or buff the service reduction to 25% would be nice

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1 hour ago, Uncle_Lou said:

The only real draw for me in perma camos vs the single use is that generally speaking the permacamos are nicer looking and at least semi-historical in appearance.  I have a strong aversion to the gaudy colored theme camos.  Frosty Fir Tree is probably the worst offender, IMO and despite having decent bonuses I sell them for credits rather than put them on a ship.

Given that the perma camos cost actual money/dubs I would not be opposed to improving or adding to the benefits they provide.  I have no doubt they could be improved without being game-breaking while still providing a compelling reason to use the single-use paint jobs. 

Honestly, despite my strong aversion to gaudy camos, I never sell them because I value their benefits more than the credits I could get for selling them, particularly for those camos with strong benefits, like Frosty Fir, which to me is FAR from the worst offender.

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27 minutes ago, tfcas119 said:

Below T9: yes. The only perma camos I have on ships here were won from events/combat missions, and they provide little XP bonuses and you’ll seldom lose credits at these tiers

T9: here is where having a permaflauge makes a difference. The XP bonus is notably better, and the extra service cost reductions make bad games barely break even. Although maybe a 10% credit bonus or buff the service reduction to 25% would be nice

Meh.  A buff to the service cost reduction for tier 7 and below would be a total waste, since at those tiers, you hardly ever lose credits due to the  service cost.  Frankly, ANY service cost reduction at tier 7 and below is a waste.

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4 hours ago, Ace_04 said:

Just looking to see what you guys think here.....but is it perhaps time to buff the bonuses of permanent camos below T10?  With the utter plethora of single-use camos available to most players, and the fact that they typically yield much better return than perma camos at T8 and below, I'm starting to think what is the point?

Honestly, outside of T10 (which there is value) and somewhat T9, I haven't used a permanent camo below T9 in a very, very long time.  The benefits of the single-use camos are much too good to pass up.

Your thoughts?

For one, I thank you for making a thread that is unique and not some threads I see from over n over here on forums. (Example: FIX MM, or BANCV)

Looking forward to some responses.

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I agree,   I have two unlinked universal T8 perma camos that i have had for more than a year that I have seen no need to link to anything..   Once I've ground anything out i rarely play them in randoms again    I usually just play premium ships for fun..before then i'll use single use camos with their higher bonuses.    Maybe I should add them for something I would bring to a ranked game?    But at that tier, with premium acct is there really a need  if you don't need anything for it?     I keep thinking a tech tree ship will jump out me that I would play a lot for fun?       T10 is probably where i need them... but just can't make myself love playin there, and especially with the expense of  the perma-camos at that tier.     

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I definitely think they should buff the bonuses on the special armory canoes.  It makes no sense that the Stalingrad's/Bourgogne's clan token camo offers worse economic bonuses than the clan token camo for the Flint and Black.....as well as the fact that the steel perma camos also offer worse bonuses.

Edited by yashma

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4 hours ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

You're still bitter about that?

If I was bitter, I wouldn’t have forgotten about it. And I wouldn’t be here, either.

4 hours ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

By all means let it gnaw on your soul and see where that gets you in the long run, but I guarantee you it's not a good place. 


Where it “gets [me] in the long run.” So, eternal damnation results from deciding not to spend 5000 doubloons on certain WG offerings. Got it.

It’s easy to see how folks have been mistaking you for a WG shill of late.

It’s so comforting to know that there is someone who watches over my soul and knows its moral state, patrolling this forum, and who knows it so well that he can confidently lecture me on it and “guarantee” me of it.

There is, but you aren’t Him.

 

 

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WG has made getting 1 times use camo hard to get, you can't just purchase them in the armory.

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2 hours ago, iRA6E said:

I agree,   I have two unlinked universal T8 perma camos that i have had for more than a year that I have seen no need to link to anything..   Once I've ground anything out i rarely play them in randoms again    I usually just play premium ships for fun..before then i'll use single use camos with their higher bonuses.    Maybe I should add them for something I would bring to a ranked game?    But at that tier, with premium acct is there really a need  if you don't need anything for it?     I keep thinking a tech tree ship will jump out me that I would play a lot for fun?       T10 is probably where i need them... but just can't make myself love playin there, and especially with the expense of  the perma-camos at that tier.     

To your point, I have at least five of the T8/T9 perma camos in stock dating back to last year that I still haven't placed on any ship because I see no incentive to.  If they were T10's no doubt, but as is, I'll gladly keep using disposable camos in the meantime.

1 hour ago, Markk9 said:

WG has made getting 1 times use camo hard to get, you can't just purchase them in the armory.

Um, what?  Just by playing the game and getting daily crates, you should have more than you know what to do with.

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6 hours ago, warheart1992 said:

you buy for a ship to end up being stuck on a ship that's now a shadow of it's former self. In some cases you might  not even  be compensated, such as what happened with owners of the Moskva permacamo.

 

Moskva is still the same ship it always was.

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