52,856 [MAUS] LittleWhiteMouse Members 13,835 posts Report post #1 Posted December 5, 2020 I hate loot boxes. I hate "surprise mechanics". Since Christmas crates became a thing back in 2016, I've cautioned players against gambling for coveted ships. Short lists are nothing new. We saw them as far back as 2016 (Emden) and 2017 (Krasny Krym). Yes, the practice is scummy but let's not kid ourselves: this isn't new. The outrage people are expressing is belated. Do not buy loot boxes for ships. If you're fishing for a Missouri or Gremyashchy, your odds are long unless you already have every other premium out there. Even then, don't be surprised if you're blowing hundreds of dollars in loot boxes and not getting what you want. Unless winning any one of these is worth it for you: Do not spend money hoping for one of these: If winning 50 Zulu signals seems like a bad deal for your money, don't buy a loot box. If 180 days premium sounds like a waste, don't buy a loot box. If you neglect to use temporary camo, don't buy loot boxes. To be clear, the monetary value should be close to what you spend to get one of these boxes -- you're not being "ripped off" in value for dollars. The catch is if you're not buying these digital scratch-tickets for camo/signals/coal/free xp/doubloons but are instead hoping for not only a ship jackpot, but a specific ship jackpot, you're going to lose. Simple math for you, even if there wasn't a "short list". Let's say you wanted a Missouri and had a sizable collection of premiums -- so much so you could scratch 60 of these ships off the list. If ships are dropping from 1:5 boxes, you'd need to buy 118 loot boxes to have a 50/50 chance of unlocking Missouri. If the odds of dropping a ship are 1:8, then your odds of finding a Missouri would necessitate you buying 188 boxes for a 50/50 chance. And let me be clear, your odds are worse than this because the loot system is most likely weighted to flooding you with lower tiered and less valued premiums before you're going to get something highly-coveted. You are NOT getting the ship you want without a Hell of a lot of luck or hundreds of dollars spent. So what do I think about short-lists? I don't care. They're nothing new. Loot boxes have always been a horrid gamble weighted against delivering the ships you want. Loot boxes are awful and I hate them. Be safe this holiday season. 109 45 3 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
39,506 [HINON] Lert Alpha Tester 27,874 posts 28,013 battles Report post #2 Posted December 5, 2020 5 1 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,627 [5D3] Frostbow Members 2,037 posts Report post #3 Posted December 5, 2020 Do not gamble your hard earned money on loot boxes. Santa Crates, including that now exposed 'short list', is at its core gambling. Period. No amount of sugar coating it (calling it 'lucky dip') can change that fact. 8 2 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
701 [TNG] Subs_Huff_Copium Members 594 posts 18,929 battles Report post #4 Posted December 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Hukom said: Do not gamble your hard earned money on loot boxes. Santa Crates, including that now exposed 'short list', is at its core gambling. Period. No amount of sugar coating it (calling it 'lucky dip') can change that fact. This. If you're comfortable with all the possible rewards, by all means, spend some discretionary income. If you're not, then don't. It's really that simple. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
54 [SOUS] WRB8619 Members 83 posts 23,884 battles Report post #5 Posted December 5, 2020 Well said. I have bought crates in the past and have NEVER received what I wanted the most BUT I have always been happy with what I do get because I understand the implications of this and have known about it for years since I have been playing the game since the open beta. Keep up the good work. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
182 SoothingWhaleSongEU Members 410 posts 26 battles Report post #6 Posted December 5, 2020 Although I specifically have issues that the shortlist was not explained (when it had been in 2016/2017)... Well said. The system is weighted against you getting that Missouri or Musashi regardless of the exact mechanics. Now we can get onto far more important matters. Vertical dispersion. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
113 [ICEY] Azur_Bismarck Alpha Tester 234 posts 5,326 battles Report post #7 Posted December 5, 2020 I wonder if WG has any plans on addressing this soon? 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
114 CatinHat Beta Testers 205 posts 4,281 battles Report post #8 Posted December 5, 2020 I just wish there was sale on current ships. Maybe there will be one on Monday. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,665 [CLUMP] LastRemnant Members 2,875 posts 3,045 battles Report post #9 Posted December 5, 2020 (edited) I don't buy loot boxes or anything connect to rng in that fashion direct purchase or no dice The only thing I would want from these boxes would be the Enterprise so getting anything else would be a loss for me regardless of what it is Edited December 5, 2020 by LastRemnant 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
182 [ONE] 6thGuards Members 378 posts Report post #10 Posted December 5, 2020 17 minutes ago, LastRemnant said: I don't buy loot boxes or anything connect to rng in that fashion direct purchase or no dice The only thing I would want from these boxes would be the Enterprise so getting anything else would be a loss for me regardless of what it is Received the Enterprise yesterday in a Christmas crate and felt it was WG's way of getting back at me for refusing to play carriers. 1 4 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
182 SoothingWhaleSongEU Members 410 posts 26 battles Report post #11 Posted December 5, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, CatinHat said: I just wish there was sale on current ships. Maybe there will be one on Monday. I don't believe so. To my knowledge WG never does a direct sale. There's some various in game extra bonus on free xp (1db=35) and credits somewhen over Christmas but that's not a sale as such. I think the closest we get is Black Friday specifically with the B ships which has just gone. The big Christmas thingy is Santa gift loot boxes, and there is normally a 50% discount on a years premium time around new years. Which I think is the real must buy, assuming you intend to play the game for a year. Edited December 5, 2020 by SoothingWhaleSongEU Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
54 [LF] n5bar Members 351 posts Report post #12 Posted December 5, 2020 35 minutes ago, LittleWhiteMouse said: Loot boxes are awful and I hate them. Good point. And I get everything you said in your post. It seems the outrage this year is that the short list is basically guaranteed to happen. If you buy 20 crates, you will get a ship off the short list or no ships at all unless you have none of them. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1,130 [SAINT] Jolly_Rodgered Members 1,881 posts 25,392 battles Report post #13 Posted December 5, 2020 8 minutes ago, 6thGuards said: Received the Enterprise yesterday in a Christmas crate and felt it was WG's way of getting back at me for refusing to play carriers. Bingo!. I got the Led Zeppelin B (I like that name better) last year for the same reason. 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
10,366 [WORX] Navalpride33 Members 17,696 posts 23,425 battles Report post #14 Posted December 5, 2020 (edited) Manufactured anger, its 2020, que sera, sera... Let them complain. Edited December 6, 2020 by Navalpride33 2 3 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,556 [GWG] AVR_Project Members 8,019 posts 16,368 battles Report post #15 Posted December 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, SoothingWhaleSongEU said: I don't believe so. To my knowledge WG never does a direct sale. There's some various in game extra bonus on free xp (1db=35) and credits somewhen over Christmas but that's not a sale as such. I think the closest we get is Black Friday specifically with the B ships which has just gone. The big Christmas thingy is Santa gift loot boxes, and there is normally a 50% discount on a years premium time around new years. Which I think is the real must buy, assuming you intend to play the game for a year. The 50% discount was only around when I was working 18 hour days at the end of the fiscal year. I never got to it until it was over... and it was only up for a couple days. They might not even offer it this year... Get ready for more outrage. Traditions around here are not sacred. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1,533 [TNG] Merc_R_Us Members 1,742 posts 20,133 battles Report post #16 Posted December 5, 2020 For y'all saying "they did this every year why are you complaining now," do you think it's remotely possible new players may have joined the game? Rocket science right 4 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
109 [TXC] Fool_of_a_Took Beta Testers 298 posts 21,489 battles Report post #17 Posted December 5, 2020 they make nice gift's for your friends for xmas ... even 30 premium signals is nice.. but these ppl spending hundred and hundreds of dollars on gambling crates is a little off the wall... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,665 [CLUMP] LastRemnant Members 2,875 posts 3,045 battles Report post #18 Posted December 5, 2020 22 minutes ago, 6thGuards said: Received the Enterprise yesterday in a Christmas crate and felt it was WG's way of getting back at me for refusing to play carriers. Yeah that's wargaming's way of telling you they know what stuff you play I bet if do get a ship it would be a DD or Cruiser Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
529 [WOLF5] CorradoG60 Members 864 posts 11,266 battles Report post #19 Posted December 5, 2020 Loot crates are just like Vegas. The house always wins 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
349 [PVE] Jim_Byrnes Members 1,333 posts 8,669 battles Report post #20 Posted December 5, 2020 It is important to remember that WG is a business run for profit and their marketing dept is there to ensure profit by enticing you with programs that are nothing less than a sow with fancy makeup and perfume... Better to offer a crate or crates that say, Missouri or a select couple of rare ships were the only payout I suspect many would pay the price for them even if it was silly... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
544 [CAZA] Torenico Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters 593 posts 9,417 battles Report post #21 Posted December 5, 2020 WG predates on people with gambling addictions so that their multi-millionaire CEO can buy another Ferrari for his dog which lives on his 7th mansion. They want addicts, it's as simple as that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
182 [ONE] 6thGuards Members 378 posts Report post #22 Posted December 5, 2020 38 minutes ago, LastRemnant said: Yeah that's wargaming's way of telling you they know what stuff you play I bet if do get a ship it would be a DD or Cruiser Just had the Benham drop from a crate and that was one of the ones at the top of my list, no complaints from me since I prefer DDs and CAs. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
26,682 [ARGSY] Ensign_Cthulhu Members 32,496 posts 34,394 battles Report post #23 Posted December 5, 2020 1 hour ago, LittleWhiteMouse said: The catch is if you're not buying these digital scratch-tickets for camo/signals/coal/free xp/doubloons but are instead hoping for not only a ship jackpot, but a specific ship jackpot, you're going to lose. I cannot agree more. My gut feeling is that the fuss is about which ships are coming up first. Three years ago, as a newbie, if I'd bought some of these crates and got even one mediocre mid tier premium ship out of them, I'd have been happier than a pig in mud. Wargaming doesn't owe you the ship of your dreams just because you bought half a grand worth of crates. Never has, never will. I've had some obscenely good luck out of crates - the Summer Sale was more generous to me than I had any right to expect - but I am WELL AWARE that that was an incredible stroke of luck that never happened before and will likely never happen again. When I buy a bunch of boxes this time around, it'll be because I have enough accumulated premium time that I've decided to spend the money on something else this year and it will be fun for my kids to open the boxes with me and see what their dad can pull out (and because my wife is actively nudging me and saying "Get yourself some boxes." I love her so much). I have to confess that if I ended up with a Makarov and a California, I would not be entirely displeased. Ochakov, on the other hand, I'm not sure what I would do with. P.S. I have quite a lot of premium ships - some won, some bought - but after all that's gone on so far, I'm more than half convinced that the Santa crate which bounced during the Summer Sale and coughed up a supercontainer with a Boise inside did so because it hit my Yudachi on the way in. 3 1 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,140 [MCWF] K1ra_Yoshikage Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters 7,026 posts 29,346 battles Report post #24 Posted December 5, 2020 1 hour ago, CatinHat said: I just wish there was sale on current ships. Maybe there will be one on Monday. You have to wait till the last 2 weeks this month. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
6,809 [GOB] Col_Nasty Members 4,821 posts 28,499 battles Report post #25 Posted December 5, 2020 THIS is what I have been saying! You CAN get lucky though. I got a RARE ship yesterday.. it's just a great BONUS! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
