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Shrayes_Bhagavatula

Just Another Proposal: KMS Kronprinz

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Just Another Proposal: KMS Kronprinz 

H40b

( In Scottish accent ) So, you think ye lads are gonna have fun, eh? Alright then, I’ll show you the meanin’ of fun…

 

What it is: a brawler, a high speed flanker, and the biggest load of fun you’ll ever have in your life. This Kronprinz is different from the one that I mused about in a recent thread detailing an alternate German Battleship line split. This one is faster, better armored, and has two unique tools that give it a sizable advantage over the original version in combat. However, she has two rather glaring downsides, namely her lack of overmatch and a serious lack of firepower compared to her tier mates, with some Tier VIII Battleships boasting more main battery guns of a similar or larger caliber than her. 

 

Why it matters: The Germans lack any form of Tier X premium ship as of the moment, with the only thing remotely in that region being the test ship Werner Voss, which isn’t even slated to enter the game in full ( her unique skip bombing mechanics are for a later CV line ). To put it bluntly, this is a bigger, faster, and harder hitting Friedrich der Grosse at Tier X. To put it more elaborately, this is a ship that, rather elegantly, treads the line between the sleek hunter killer motifs of the Scharnhorst-class and the brutal firepower of the H-class, which is something that has only been replicated once before, with the Tirpitz, and it hasn’t been replicated since. Yes, we’ve had the Odin, we’ve had the Scharnhorst, we’ve had the Pommern, but the problem with all of these is that they do not seem to actually stand on that line, rather, they tend towards either end of the spectrum. Kronprinz is intended here to tread that line once again and become one of the more effective Tier X battleships in the process.

 

Edit: The Max Immelman, a Tier X German Premium CV, was recently announced as I wrote this, so I guess there is an incoming German Tier X premium.

But that’s enough of that, let’s get on with the show!

 


Armor

  • Tonnage: 70000 Full load
  • HP pool: 1.1812 * 70000 + 10837 = 93,500
  • Plating: 32mm
  • Superstructure: 19mm
  • Main Armor belt: 300mm @ 15 degrees
  • Upper belt: 150mm
  • Bow armor: 60mm + 150mm splinter
  • Deck armor: 50mm, 80mm over magazines
  • Turtleback slope: 120mm @ 45 degrees
  • Citadel armor: 100mm Deck / 50mm sides / 250mm Bulkheads
  • Turret Armor: 457mm Face / 283mm sides / 203mm roof
  • Torpedo protection: 25% @ 38mm
  • Fire reduction chance: 50% 

 

So, the Kronprinz is just like any other German battleship. Big, well armored, nicely built, and has a nice slab of hitpoints on top of it, though her torpedo defense is lacking. Her armor scheme allows her to shrug off most HE and AP shells slung at her when she is well angled, though she still has a large superstructure that is easy to farm HE damage and full AP penetrations on. However, her turtleback is as good as that of the Gneisenau, i.e going below the waterline, which gives her an advantage over other Tier X battleships in that she is difficult to citadel in general, even eliminating the classical weakness of German BBs being somewhat squishy in a turn. On top of this, I’ve elected to completely turn tradition on its head and give the Kronprinz a sloped armor belt of 15 degrees. This makes her far more resistant to damage at long range while also providing her with a bit more actual armor once trigonometry is applied. Don’t be fooled, however, into thinking that she is immune to actually taking any damage. A 15 degree slope means that AP shells can normalize and still punch through her armor with ease, which makes her vulnerable to large and even medium caliber AP shells slung at her. On top of that, her repair party is not improved in any way whatsoever, so she struggles to recover any massed chunks of damage that she takes. Her turrets, however, will fare much better in general. As opposed to the rather thin skinned turrets that are normally found on German Battleships, these turrets are fairly durable. 457mm faces and tough sides make them tough to disable, though her turrets are not as thick as those of Kremlin and Yamato, and the faces are still flat, which means the chance of negating most damage, never mind actually keeping your turrets in action, is still quite low.

 


Artillery

Primary Armament: 4 x 2 420mm L/48 SK C/42

  • Turret Layout: Balanced ( AB-XY )
  • Range: 20.7km
  • Reload: 24 seconds
  • HE Shell: 1,220kg, 5100 Alpha, 41% Fire chance, 105mm HE penetration, 800 m/s velocity
  • AP Shell: 1,220kg, 13,500 Alpha, 45-60* autobounce angles, 53mm arming threshold, 0.033 second fuse, 800 m/s velocity
  • Turret Traverse speed: 6 degrees per second ( 30 seconds per 180 degrees )
  • Dispersion pattern: USN / UK / KMS BB
  • Sigma: 1.9

Secondary Armament 6 x 2 128mm L/61 KM40, 6 x 2 150mm L/55 SK C/28

  • Layout: Wing balanced
  • Range: 7.5km
  • Reload: 3.6 seconds / 7.5 seconds
  • HE Shell: 128mm guns: 1500 Alpha, 32mm penetration, 5% fire chance, 900 m/s velocity , 150mm guns: 1,700 Alpha, 38mm penetration, 8% fire chance, 875 m/s velocity
  • Dispersion: Graf Zeppelin
  • Sigma: 1.0


 

Kronprinz is like the love child of Massachusetts and Gneisenau, in a sense. She lacks for primary armament capacity compared to her peers, wielding just 8 420mm rifles compared to her peers, which pack either the same or a greater number of equal caliber or larger rifles, with the notable exception being the Slava, which carries a single extra rifle over the Kronprinz. The point is, the Kronprinz lacks in offensive striking power from her main battery guns compared to her peers, and she has nothing to compensate for it… or does she? While her guns might be the same as the Friedrich Der Grosse's 420mm rifles, they reload a whole five seconds faster than the Friedrich, with a reload speed of 24 seconds compared to the 29 seconds of the Tier IX ship. In addition, the turrets rotate slightly faster than the Freddy, at 6 degrees per second compared to 5.5 degrees per second. Her secondary battery is also changed up from the Tier IX ship. While she does lose two barrels compared to the Friedrich der Grosse, she compensates with replacing them with 128mm KM40 guns, which boast 32mm of penetration and have better damage output than the smaller weapons. On top of this, the secondaries have the improved dispersion curve shared with the Graf Zeppelin's secondary guns. Put all of that together, and you get one hell of a brawling platform.

And that’s even before we get to her other set of weapons…


Torpedoes

Torpedo Armament: 533mm Vierling torpedo launchers

  • Configuration: 2 x 4 Wing Mountings
  • Torpedo Carried: 533mm G7 Steinbutt
  • Range: 8.0km
  • Speed: 65 knots
  • Damage: 14,400
  • Flood chance: 278%
  • Reload: 90 seconds

So...yeah, the “other” weapons. In terms of technical detail, these torpedo launchers are superior to the standard German Battleship torpedo launchers in two aspects: damage and range. The warheads are the same ones found on the Z-52, but they've been grafted on to the 8 kilometer fish found on the Graf Spee. This gives the Kronprinz a little extra breathing room compared to the other German Battleships, which need to get in closer in order to use their piddly 6km fish. 

 


AA Defense

Long Range AA Defense: 6 x 2 128mm L/61 KM40

  • Range: 6.0km
  • DPS: 121.2
  • Flak: 4+1 at 1,610 damage
  • Accuracy: 75%

Medium Range AA Defense: 12 x 2 55mm Gerat Flakzwilling, 16 x 2 37mm Flakzwilling

  • Range: 4.0km
  • DPS: 514.3
  • Flak: 0
  • Accuracy: 75%

Short Range AA Defense: 8 x 4 30mm Gerat 

  • Range: 3.0km
  • DPS: 304.4
  • Flak: 0
  • Accuracy: 70%

Access to DFAA: No

Access to Fighter: No

 

Kronprinz has what can be described as "decent" AA Defenses. You're never going to shoot down that many aircraft in a fight, especially with CVs such as Franklin Delano Roosevelt, but you can put up a solid fight against them thanks to a high powered midrange AA defense, with over 500 DPS and 4km of range. The same can be said of her short range AA defense, which has over 300 DPS to use against aircraft, but her long range AA defense is decidedly lacking. 

 


Maneuverability

Velocity Characteristics

  • Top speed: 32.3 knots
  • Acceleration: Battleship Standard
  • Turning Velocity: 25.1 knots

Handling Characteristics

  • Turning radius: 970 meters
  • Rudder shift: 17 seconds
  • Rotation Velocity: 3.9 degrees per second

Access to Engine Boost: No

 

When I said it had good maneuverability, I meant that it was capable of moving fast in a straight line, and I didn’t say anything else about it. Her turning radius is 980 meters, which is on the larger end of Tier X battleships, and her 17 second rudder shift means that she does not respond to rudder commands that well either. Her Legendary module cuts her rudder shift down by 3 whole seconds, which does do something to alleviate her issues when it comes to dodging waterborne armaments and aerial ordnance. However, don’t expect a handling god like a Thunderer or a boosted Bourgogne.

 


Stealth

  • Surface Detection Radius: 17.5km
  • Aerial Detection radius: 13.7km
  • Minimum Detection Radius: 13.9km
  • Minimum Aerial Detection radius: 10.4km
  • Assured Detection Radius: 2.0km

Access to Hydroacoustic Search: Yes

 

Kronprinz’s detectability is decidedly mediocre compared to her counterparts, and while a 17.5km base detectability range sounds enticing, consider that this is actually on the worse end of the battleships in this matchmaking, with only Grosser Kurfurst and a handful of others being worse, and considering the need for Fire Prevention, it’s not really possible to pick up Concealment expert to minimise the detectability range to competitive levels. 

 


Upgrades: How to build your Bratwurst, part...something

 

Upgrades

  • Slot 1: Main Armaments Modification 1
  • Slot 2: Damage Control Systems Modification 1
  • Slot 3: Secondary Battery Modification 2
  • Slot 4: Damage Control Systems Modification 2
  • Slot 5: Concealment Systems Modification 1
  • Slot 6: Unique Upgrade: Enhanced Close Combat Modifications

 

Legendary Upgrade / UU: Enhanced Close Combat Modifications

  • - 25% to rudder shift time
  • - 15% to Secondary armament reload time
  • - 10% to Main battery reload time 
  • - 10% to Main Battery Turret Traverse speed
  • + 25% Chance to Torpedo Tube Incapacitation

Commander Skills

  • Priority Target
  • Adrenaline Rush
  • Superintendent
  • Advanced Firing Training
  • Fire Prevention 
  • Basics of Survivability*
  • Expert Marksman*

*This can be substituted with Concealment Expert or MFCSA if you so wish

 

Consumables

  • Key 1: Damage Control Party, Standard Battleship
  • Key 2: Repair Party, Standard Battleship, 4 charges
  • Key 3: Hydroacoustic Search, German Variant, 3 charges

 


Wrap Up

 

I got nothing to add here, so…

Stroheim is the best brojo - GIF on Imgur

( Dab )

Sorry I haven't had one of these out in a while, it's been tough in the past month. Normally it takes me a few hours to a couple of days to put one of these together, but this one took me a week, just to give you an illustration of the difficulties I've been facing...

Hope you enjoy

- Shrayes

Edited by Shrayes_Bhagavatula
  • Cool 5

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Honestly, I'd rather see German battlecruisers that really existed, as well as the (tier 7) L20alpha BB, which was the intended follow-on design to the Bayern.

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You made up the 406mm/55 guns, right? Did you base this design in anything that exists in paper at least or are you just making up ships now?

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1 hour ago, Fr05ty said:

You made up the 406mm/55 guns, right? Did you base this design in anything that exists in paper at least or are you just making up ships now?

The design I based this on was the H-40B project, which in itself was a derivative of H-40A, which was a variant of the H-39. Truth be told, the designs never went past the design board, and, as stated, was never considered for construction, but I've been fascinated by them for a while now. Yes, the design is modified to my specification, such as giving it an angled armor belt and thickening the deck armor from the original 50mm to 55mm, but it is otherwise unchanged from the original specification, which I can link here:

https://www.german-navy.de/kriegsmarine/zplan/battleships/schlachtschiffh/h40b.html

The Primary armament, yes, is partially made up. I based the main guns on the pre-existing 406mm L/52 guns, but I gave them a lengthened barrel and heavier shells, as well as a slightly larger HE burst charge and improved shell velocity. The secondary armament are the same KM40 guns that are found on the Gneisenau, the Siegfried, the Agir, and the Grosser Kurfurst. The Gerat 55mm AA guns are real, the 37mm Flakzwilling was real, and the Funfling torpedo launchers are based on the ones found on the recently introduced Z-44. I'm not sure how real those are, but I'm sure I could do some digging and find out.

The only things on this ship I would remotely consider ahistorical besides the improved main battery guns are the addition of the torpedo launchers and the lack of a short range 20mm Flakzwilling battery, but that's about it.

Thanks for bringing it up, though. I felt as if I had been missing something, and I couldn't quite figure out what...

-Shrayes

Edit: Also Frosty, since when am someone to make ships up?

Edited by Shrayes_Bhagavatula

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8 hours ago, Shrayes_Bhagavatula said:

The design I based this on was the H-40B project, which in itself was a derivative of H-40A, which was a variant of the H-39. Truth be told, the designs never went past the design board, and, as stated, was never considered for construction, but I've been fascinated by them for a while now. Yes, the design is modified to my specification, such as giving it an angled armor belt and thickening the deck armor from the original 50mm to 55mm, but it is otherwise unchanged from the original specification, which I can link here:

https://www.german-navy.de/kriegsmarine/zplan/battleships/schlachtschiffh/h40b.html

The Primary armament, yes, is partially made up. I based the main guns on the pre-existing 406mm L/52 guns, but I gave them a lengthened barrel and heavier shells, as well as a slightly larger HE burst charge and improved shell velocity. The secondary armament are the same KM40 guns that are found on the Gneisenau, the Siegfried, the Agir, and the Grosser Kurfurst. The Gerat 55mm AA guns are real, the 37mm Flakzwilling was real, and the Funfling torpedo launchers are based on the ones found on the recently introduced Z-44. I'm not sure how real those are, but I'm sure I could do some digging and find out.

The only things on this ship I would remotely consider ahistorical besides the improved main battery guns are the addition of the torpedo launchers and the lack of a short range 20mm Flakzwilling battery, but that's about it.

Thanks for bringing it up, though. I felt as if I had been missing something, and I couldn't quite figure out what...

-Shrayes

Edit: Also Frosty, since when am someone to make ships up?

Wouldn't it be better if you kept the normal 406mm guns which are fairly decent but give them a 22 second reload? Don't think there's a need to make up a new weapon just for the sake of it. If you want to give it a bigger punch, just upgun it to the 420mm guns instead, WG has already shown that according to their designs, they pretty much fit in the same barbette.

Additionally, the source you linked gives your design a speed of 32.3kts, any reason why you took that down to 31.5kts? That way you accentuate a bit more the differences between the GK and the Kronprinz. You'd have GK for hitpoints and alpha strike, while the Kronprinz is faster and has faster-firing guns with a better sigma. Also, where are the 150mm secondaries? Just a technical aside regarding torpedoes, I don't think they're needed, but if you insist on giving them torpedoes, a quad launcher is the largest launcher that was fitted on German ships that weren't DDs.

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5 hours ago, Fr05ty said:

Wouldn't it be better if you kept the normal 406mm guns which are fairly decent but give them a 22 second reload? Don't think there's a need to make up a new weapon just for the sake of it. If you want to give it a bigger punch, just upgun it to the 420mm guns instead, WG has already shown that according to their designs, they pretty much fit in the same barbette.

Additionally, the source you linked gives your design a speed of 32.3kts, any reason why you took that down to 31.5kts? That way you accentuate a bit more the differences between the GK and the Kronprinz. You'd have GK for hitpoints and alpha strike, while the Kronprinz is faster and has faster-firing guns with a better sigma. Also, where are the 150mm secondaries? Just a technical aside regarding torpedoes, I don't think they're needed, but if you insist on giving them torpedoes, a quad launcher is the largest launcher that was fitted on German ships that weren't DDs.

Thank you for your insights. I will factor these into my proposal after evaluating their viability.

-Shrayes

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UPDATE TO PROPOSAL

Balancing Changes

  • 406mm L/55 replaced with 420mm L/48.
  • Secondary Battery updated to 6x2 150mm + 6x2 128mm. 
  • Torpedo Armament Changed from 2x5 533mm G7 a T1 to 2x4 G7 Steinbutt
  •  Long Range AA Reduced from 179.9 to 121.1 DPS, Flak Decreased from 6+1 to 4+1. 
  • Midrange AA Ring increased from 484.9 to 514.3 DPS
  • Addition of Short Range AA Ring. 8x4 30mm Gerat ( same as Pommern and Z-44 ). 304.4 DPS out to 3.0km
  • Maximum Top Speed increased from 31.5 knots to 32.3 knots

These changes will accentuate the differences between the Grosser Kurfurst and the Kronprinz, where the Grosser Kurfurst will be larger and more durable, with a heavier Alpha Strike, while the Kronprinz will be more agile and faster hitting. 

- Shrayes

  • Cool 2

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very interesting, definitely better than what I've thought of in the past, the only thing that I'd see needing to be changed is for it to be upgunned to 4 x 2 480-mm with a 32-second reload

  • Meh 1

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On 12/25/2020 at 11:55 PM, Titanicman2012 said:

very interesting, definitely better than what I've thought of in the past, the only thing that I'd see needing to be changed is for it to be upgunned to 4 x 2 480-mm with a 32-second reload

Slight problem with that, this is actually the completely wrong hull for the 480mm guns to be mounted on. This is the H-40B ( AKA the slightly larger FdG ), not the H-42 Design, which carried the Twin 480mm mount.

The 18.9 inch guns are also another problem since we have literally zero data on it, meaning that it is difficult to actually create such an artillery system for the H-42 in game without some serious number crunching.

-Shrayes

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