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ixovera

Florida Not Worth It for the Average Player?

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I'm posting this because I am having a much different experience with the Florida than many of the Community Contributor reviews on YouTube. My win rate across all of my games is 52%. I currently have 31 games in it with a 39% winrate... I win more in the Kansas!

Let me put up some personal BB stats for comparison:

Tier Ship Games Played Win Rate Avg Dmg Total Kills Main Batt Acc Cap Contr Def Contr XP Potential Dmg
6 Izmail 29 48% 44k 29 31% 10% 3% 1.4k 690k
6 Dunkerque 85 61% 54k 86 28% 9% 8% 1.6k 850k
6 Normandie 17 76% 54k 22 25% 5% 5% 1.7k 870k
7 Florida 31 39% 52k 28 25% 12% 10% 1.7k 660k
7 Colorado 25 48% 52k 26 26% 3% 11% 1.6k 990k
7 Scharnhorst 34 68% 47k 21 30% 6% 4% 1.3k 1m
8 Odin 64 44% 50k 49 33% 6% 9% 1.3k 1m
8 Kansas 26 46% 54k 22 22% 7% 5% 1.6k 990k
8 Richelieu 26 46% 55k 16 29% 3% 3% 1.4k 1.2m
8 Champagne 110 51% 63k 92 27% 2% 8% 1.6k 750k
9 Gerogia 44 52% 60k 36 33% 5% 9% 1.6k 1m

From my stats, we can see that I average about the same damage as I do in similar ships of similar tier. However, you can see that my average potential damage is much lower. This is because I get deleted more easily in this ship than others of similar tier. Interestingly, Dunkerque and Normandie can tank more damage on average than the Florida, and they are a tier lower.

Further, I notice that my average Cap and Def Contributions are higher in the Florida than other BBs I play. This seems to be the case because I've noticed that when I play the Florida in particular I am forced more often to enter a cap (the place a Florida does not want to go) in an attempt to save an already losing game. What most often happens is that the DDs on my team die and I am forced to fight a DD or two on a cap near the end of the game, which I pretty much always lose. I don't seem to have this issue at higher tiers. My guess is because either DD players at higher tiers are just better players, or because there is more radar and hydro at higher tiers. Regardless, at tier 7, I preform better in the Colorado and Scharnhorst most likely because they are better equipped to fight a DD at a cap when necessary. The Florida just seems too fragile to do this, and it seems to often be necessary at tier 7. Even the Champagne does this better, and everyone claims to hate the Champagne.

Lastly, as much as Community Contributors tout its accuracy, I don't find it to be as accurate as expected. My main battery accuracy is better in all but two BBs listed. The 1.7 sigma does seem to hinder my gameplay more than the good dispersion can make up for it. So many easy kills result in an enemy limping away because either half the shells land around a well-aimed broadside target (at any range), or the shell damage is just a little too low to be consistently effective, given the reload time. Many have said that it is like the Champagne, but I don't really see it as being more accurate at range than close up. My most consistent damage seems to be at around 15km. I cannot snipe a 20km broadside in the Florida like I can in the Champagne. I supposed what is a little upsetting is that many have said in their videos that the Florida is like the Champagne and Slava, but from my experience, it performs like a squishier Kansas.

In my limited opinion, I would either do something to boost the tankiness of the Florida enough that it can at least sail onto a cap in its capture or defense once in a game, or boost the sigma slightly, or actually give it the same accuracy mechanic that the Champagne has, as it doesn't feel like it has it. (But hey, US shells are easy to dodge at long ranges, so maybe that is what's affecting my ranged play.) If I was to choose from the options, I would want a little more tankiness. I also find that I get citadeled through the side of the nose and stern in areas where the citadel is not. That is bothersome, too.

Edited by ixovera
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Florida is like Champagne and Slava. If you have more cap contribution in Florida than Scharn you're playing one of the two very wrong. Florida, as you say, is incredibly squishy. But she has Battlecruiser accuracy. So you snipe. Play it like your Champagne. Now Champagne is T8 and has 16in guns, so you can't quite do the same things. 15km is a good range for Florida, 20km is not the proper range, but remember Florida is T7, not T8. You mention fighting around caps a lot, that is how you die in Florida. A lot. Sit back, snipe, do not get close unless you absolutely have to. Florida is overmatched by 16in and eats HE for days. You said that you're upset that people say Florida performs like Champagne and Florida, but then you say she's squishier than Kansas. All of that is true. But all of those BBs are a tier or 3 higher. So know, you're not going to sit at 20km and nuke people from across the map. That was hella OP against T5. You're going to be at 15km and paddle cruisers. I think you have two problems, you're trying to play it like it's Slava. It's LIKE Slava, but it isn't Slava. You are less capable (duh). Instead of 20km you're at 15. Instead of deleting BBs you delete cruisers. Second, it sounds like you get aggressive and die. This is working as intended, Florida isn't tanky because her armor is range. Yes, she takes practice. But if your problem is with her tanking abilities you're playing her wrong.

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Sample size matters.

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2 hours ago, AJTP89 said:

Florida is like Champagne and Slava. If you have more cap contribution in Florida than Scharn you're playing one of the two very wrong. Florida, as you say, is incredibly squishy. But she has Battlecruiser accuracy. So you snipe. Play it like your Champagne. Now Champagne is T8 and has 16in guns, so you can't quite do the same things. 15km is a good range for Florida, 20km is not the proper range, but remember Florida is T7, not T8. You mention fighting around caps a lot, that is how you die in Florida. A lot. Sit back, snipe, do not get close unless you absolutely have to. Florida is overmatched by 16in and eats HE for days. You said that you're upset that people say Florida performs like Champagne and Florida, but then you say she's squishier than Kansas. All of that is true. But all of those BBs are a tier or 3 higher. So know, you're not going to sit at 20km and nuke people from across the map. That was hella OP against T5. You're going to be at 15km and paddle cruisers. I think you have two problems, you're trying to play it like it's Slava. It's LIKE Slava, but it isn't Slava. You are less capable (duh). Instead of 20km you're at 15. Instead of deleting BBs you delete cruisers. Second, it sounds like you get aggressive and die. This is working as intended, Florida isn't tanky because her armor is range. Yes, she takes practice. But if your problem is with her tanking abilities you're playing her wrong.

I suppose I was unclear about when I die in the Florida on the cap. I only try to save caps by moving on them when most of the rest of my teammates are dead. Dead friendly DDs and Cruisers. Or if I can tell they are so oblivious to what is going on that I am forced to attempt to do their job. The alternative is losing to cap points. Most of the time I am fighting from 15-20km range. I did give possible reasons for the underperformance of the Florida as being a result of continuously poor play from ships in other roles. My recommended changes were given as a reflection of the fact that it is tier 7 and ships in lower tiers are more often forced to perform other roles when fellow teammates fail to perform them.  Again, the alternative is simply losing to cap points. I say I die a lot on cap because I refuse to give up all the caps when fellow DDs or Cruisers are either dead or hiding. 

I don't have the Slava. Playing against it, the Slava has similar shot-grouping to the Champagne. The Florida simply does not have the same grouping. Hence, it does not perform the same. The shells land like Kansas, not Champagne.

15km is about as close as you want to get in the Florida. However, that is essentially a decent range for any BB to consistently hit their target. If it can't consistently do 18-20km, then it isn't performing like the Champagne/Slava.

My Dunkerque and Normandie are also tankier than the Florida. They are tier 6, I play them much more aggressively, and I win more often in them.

What point you may have is that part of my frustration could be less directed at the Florida and more directed at the lack of map and player awareness at tier 7. The Florida just struggles more because of this whereas other T6 and T7 BBs compensate for this with their tankiness.

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2 hours ago, Lert said:

Sample size matters.

It certainly does. It could be that I've gotten a long string of bad teammates in that particular ship. All I can say is that my damage performance in the Florida has been consistently on par with BBs of similar tier that I've played.

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2 hours ago, ixovera said:

It certainly does. It could be that I've gotten a long string of bad teammates in that particular ship. All I can say is that my damage performance in the Florida has been consistently on par with BBs of similar tier that I've played.

Try it in a division. I think you are forcing it. You want to win, but your team has already died in some cases. Try playing standoff and angled. She turns great. Remember, You don't need turret 3 much if you got 8 facing front. Use #3 turret as a side job. I would use her well angled and pop the 3rd turret off on that one side flank that tries to sneak up on you. Avoid islands, you are not a DD chaser, unless there are many DDs and the cruisers are dead. Then sling HE all day then. Her AP is solid, but be careful with aim because players want you to waste shots. Anticipate quick turns and catch them not looking at you.

Unsuspecting targets are the best targets. 

 

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I'm going to go with the "needs  division, a great player, or great RNG" to work.

 

I find the accuracy is notably better than most BB's- even with the 1.7 sigma- although there are a LOT of times as the OP mentioned that that sigma seems to screw up an almost perfect shot.

The issue I seem to have is- even though more of my shells are hitting, a good chunk of them bounce or shatter, pretty much on any target. So Yes, I fire 12 guns and get 7 hits, but 2 will ricochet, and 3 or 4 will shatter.

I think a lot of people read "battlecruiser accuracy" and think "OMG Georgia has that, and I love that ship" yes , but it has big guns that overmatch quite a few armor profiles. The Florida does not .

The number of times I've lined up a shot at 18km, fired, and had +/-9 bounces/shatters is ..disheartening . The ship can absolutely hit targets ,damaging them is sometimes another matter.

The armor is another thing to beware of, this is so easy to citadel it's like sailing a BB size Neptune.  YOu will be blapped if you give someone your side, (which happens to every other BB so I'm not sure why reviewers mention it) 

 You'll also be citadeled through the nose by pretty much any size of gun you face in T8 or T9 matchups.  

You'll read comments like "you have to stay at range and maneuver " which helps- but I find a pretty decent chunk of the hits you take from BB's-- even at range, manage to find the citadel.  Just had a game where a Bismarck tagged me once at 18km ,citadel,  then he repeated it 30 seconds later.

Basically the Florida is a mid-long range sniper than NEEDS a perfectly broadside (not angled even a little) target (within reason, I have dev struck a full health angled Neptune in it...but I'm not sure a Neptune has armor..) in order to deal damage.

ANd don't get shot at. Even long range.

All that being said the guns do absolutely work wonders sometimes,  the AA is fantastic (as fantastic as T7 AA can be) and the concealment lets you pull off some great ambushes as well as making it easy to go dark- as long as there are no CV's.

 

I also think as more and more people learn about it's armor, it's going to become more and more of a target. Already I've addedthem to my "shoot British Cruisers for fun and profit" list, and given the amount of people in randoms I have firing at me, I think a number of other people have as well.

It can be a fun ship, but I'm pretty convinced the number of "OMG this thing is so awesome" reviews I've seen, are people who hope other people will buy them so they can shoot at them.

 

Edited by Canadian_Reaper

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Florida is not an easy ship to do well in.  It is fragile and has smaller guns for its tier.  The armor means you will be overmatched by anything 380mm or bigger, and with only 356mm guns you will have a tougher time punching citadels on enemy BBs.  She turns pretty tightly though, and if you boost her rudder shift you can react more quickly.  I find that Florida is best played more like an upgunned, clumsy cruiser; stay near the edge of your detection range and fade in and out.  Look for flanks or create opportunities to capitalize on broadside enemies.  Against cruisers, smash the citadel; against BBs aim for the upper belt.  She's not a great firestarter, but don't be afraid to reach for HE against heavily angled targets if there are no broadsides to abuse. 

The only situation I find Florida really struggles with is being pulled into a tier 9 match.  BBs in t9 just outperform Florida in so many metrics that its honestly kind of laughable.  Best you can do if its t9 MM is focus the cruisers/DDs then sling HE at the top tier BBs.

I am no unicum, but through my first 20 battles in Florida I have a 65% WR, 67.7k average damage, and a 30.3% MBHR.  Yes, its a small sample size but I have no reason to think I cannot maintain or improve upon those numbers.

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What does your target selection look like?  12 14” guns with good dispersion ought to wreck DDs contesting caps.  That seems like it would help your team contest caps better and live longer. Maybe the slower reload is causing you to fire the guns as soon as they are loaded, even if the available targets aren’t the most impactful?

Florida is a pretty stealthy BB, isn’t she?  Are you taking advantage of that to surprise enemy ships?

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On 11/18/2020 at 11:33 PM, ixovera said:

I'm posting this because I am having a much different experience with the Florida than many of the Community Contributor reviews on YouTube. My win rate across all of my games is 52%. I currently have 31 games in it with a 39% winrate... I win more in the Kansas!

Let me put up some personal BB stats for comparison:

Tier Ship Games Played Win Rate Avg Dmg Total Kills Main Batt Acc Cap Contr Def Contr XP Potential Dmg
6 Izmail 29 48% 44k 29 31% 10% 3% 1.4k 690k
6 Dunkerque 85 61% 54k 86 28% 9% 8% 1.6k 850k
6 Normandie 17 76% 54k 22 25% 5% 5% 1.7k 870k
7 Florida 31 39% 52k 28 25% 12% 10% 1.7k 660k
7 Colorado 25 48% 52k 26 26% 3% 11% 1.6k 990k
7 Scharnhorst 34 68% 47k 21 30% 6% 4% 1.3k 1m
8 Odin 64 44% 50k 49 33% 6% 9% 1.3k 1m
8 Kansas 26 46% 54k 22 22% 7% 5% 1.6k 990k
8 Richelieu 26 46% 55k 16 29% 3% 3% 1.4k 1.2m
8 Champagne 110 51% 63k 92 27% 2% 8% 1.6k 750k
9 Gerogia 44 52% 60k 36 33% 5% 9% 1.6k 1m

From my stats, we can see that I average about the same damage as I do in similar ships of similar tier. However, you can see that my average potential damage is much lower. This is because I get deleted more easily in this ship than others of similar tier. Interestingly, Dunkerque and Normandie can tank more damage on average than the Florida, and they are a tier lower.

Further, I notice that my average Cap and Def Contributions are higher in the Florida than other BBs I play. This seems to be the case because I've noticed that when I play the Florida in particular I am forced more often to enter a cap (the place a Florida does not want to go) in an attempt to save an already losing game. What most often happens is that the DDs on my team die and I am forced to fight a DD or two on a cap near the end of the game, which I pretty much always lose. I don't seem to have this issue at higher tiers. My guess is because either DD players at higher tiers are just better players, or because there is more radar and hydro at higher tiers. Regardless, at tier 7, I preform better in the Colorado and Scharnhorst most likely because they are better equipped to fight a DD at a cap when necessary. The Florida just seems too fragile to do this, and it seems to often be necessary at tier 7. Even the Champagne does this better, and everyone claims to hate the Champagne.

Lastly, as much as Community Contributors tout its accuracy, I don't find it to be as accurate as expected. My main battery accuracy is better in all but two BBs listed. The 1.7 sigma does seem to hinder my gameplay more than the good dispersion can make up for it. So many easy kills result in an enemy limping away because either half the shells land around a well-aimed broadside target (at any range), or the shell damage is just a little too low to be consistently effective, given the reload time. Many have said that it is like the Champagne, but I don't really see it as being more accurate at range than close up. My most consistent damage seems to be at around 15km. I cannot snipe a 20km broadside in the Florida like I can in the Champagne. I supposed what is a little upsetting is that many have said in their videos that the Florida is like the Champagne and Slava, but from my experience, it performs like a squishier Kansas.

In my limited opinion, I would either do something to boost the tankiness of the Florida enough that it can at least sail onto a cap in its capture or defense once in a game, or boost the sigma slightly, or actually give it the same accuracy mechanic that the Champagne has, as it doesn't feel like it has it. (But hey, US shells are easy to dodge at long ranges, so maybe that is what's affecting my ranged play.) If I was to choose from the options, I would want a little more tankiness. I also find that I get citadeled through the side of the nose and stern in areas where the citadel is not. That is bothersome, too.

What your stats are telling me is that you need to work on situational awareness and not overextending.  I see your best ships are mid-tier fast BB's and I am guessing it is because they are more forgiving of misplays because they allow you to get out of dodge when you over-extend.  You don't see this in Richelieu and Georgia because those are high tier matches which are generally less forgiving.  Also am I correct in assuming you target cruisers more in those ships due to low caliber guns?  That is actually the most effective use of BB guns of all calibers and may explain why you have higher win-rates with them but similar damage across the board.

A good rule-of-thumb is this.  engage at ranges just beyond detection, you should go undetected between salvos this gives you the chance to disengage if things become to hot. 

If you don't go undetected consider your situation are you isolated or do you have friends?  If you are isolated start retreating, if you aren't keep with your team-mates but consider an exit strategy.

Is the nearest spotted enemy within your detection?  If it isn't that means its probably a DD spotting you.

When you are spotted you should have 1 or 2 targeting you depending on your situation, you want to take some aggro off your team since you are a BB and can handle it, but if it hits 3 or more disengage.

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