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Bullpies322

Carriers Are Too Difficult

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I used to play carriers back in the day when it was an rts.  They were tough but you could make it work.  Now it jus makes me want to take my computer and throw it out the window.  The attack time is so small, the inability to control fighters, the damn flak clouds.  There is no way to practice this class as co-op battles are too short, and Random battles you make a mistake and you lose the entire squadron.

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Welcome to "CV life".
Straight outta "re-work".

Tier-4 Randoms offer longer time of games.  Or use the training room.

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Well... at least this isn’t another thread where someone who has never played CVs is complaining about how CVs are “easy mode.”

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I suppose I would recommend the following: 

Choose only one CV line to start. Usually folks recommend IJN or USN. The German line is better off played after you get really good with your first two choices. I will say I enjoy those RN carriers too, especially in the lower tiers. Normally though, people would recommend you start with IJN or USN. 

STICK WITH the line you choose. I would recommend you stick with a particular ship/tier/nation until you roll past at least 100 matches. By that point you should have a very thorough understanding of the particular carrier.  If you feel that is too many game, that's your call. I can only say my experience indicates the slightest differences between carriers gets really magnified, resulting in only a single torp hit instead of three, for example. 

Muscle memory plays a small role in all this too which is another good reason to pick one line and master it. 

Ultimately realize, no matter the ship/tier/class we are the biggest factor in our success. We do as much as we can when we can. If say three or four people are randomly assigned to your team with that attitude on the game, you stand a dang good chance of turning it into a victory. 

Oh, by the way... you'll find some carriers are really good for sinking destroyers, most others not so much. lf you play a CV good at hunting/sinking destroyers, then be sure to fill that role asap. Your team will expect it. 

If on the other hand you don't play such a CV, focus on the other threats your destroyers may face, primarily cruisers. Like they always tell us, practice, practice and practice... but learn from our mistakes. 

Now, I'm gonna read this again a week from now to remind myself to follow my own advice! 

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59 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Tier-4 Randoms offer longer time of games.

That's where I was going; how do you complain about the AA in a tier 4 match?

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1 hour ago, Bullpies322 said:

I used to play carriers back in the day when it was an rts.  They were tough but you could make it work.  Now it jus makes me want to take my computer and throw it out the window.  The attack time is so small, the inability to control fighters, the damn flak clouds.  There is no way to practice this class as co-op battles are too short, and Random battles you make a mistake and you lose the entire squadron.

First off, please watch my Carrier 101 video.

Secondly, Tier 4 has especially low AA to allow for players to feel out how to attack targets.  There are little/no fighters, and very little flak, so players can familiarize themselves with the controls.  You can do this in Co-Op fairly easily, as Tier 4 is often populated by newer players (with established players often staying at Tier 5 and above).

Once you've caught your rhythm as for what weapons to use against what targets, and how to make sure you're getting good hits with them... move to Tier 6.

Tier 6 has light amounts of flak, but they become strong when ships are grouped.  Also, Fighters are much more common on both surface ships and from the enemy CV.  Tier 6 is still a training ground, but it has much more fully formed gameplay.  If Co-Op is too short, and Randoms are too much to handle right away... try some Scenarios.  All the Tier 6 Scenarios allows Carriers, and provide a story-like experience to play through.  Some scenarios are very hard to complete with full marks and can offer a great challenge while you're learning.

Once you feel you've got Tier 6 under your belt, you can move to Tier 8.  Be aware though, Tier 8 is the full CV experience, and will be overwhelming at first.  Tier 10 is the same experience, but made bigger/faster/harder.

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1 hour ago, Umikami said:

That's where I was going; how do you complain about the AA in a tier 4 match?

I don't think he has played in a long time, this is a drive by rant.

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This guy can't be serious or is just trolling.  They actually dumbed CV play down to the lowest common denominator.

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3 hours ago, Nevermore135 said:

Well... at least this isn’t another thread where someone who has never played CVs is complaining about how CVs are “easy mode.”

Despite my beefs in the other thread, actually using carriers in a ‘clean’ environment is relatively easy.

As many have said in previous threads; it’s basically WASD.

What makes it hard is all the immersive distractions.

By itself, learning to lead and drop properly with the various aiming reticles is moderately difficult, but that difficulty increases exponentially because of the need to dodge AA, and just plain not being able to see, (the aforementioned ‘immersive’ distractions. Maybe because the pace is faster, they bother me more than the same things when I drive a ship?)

1 hour ago, Viper069 said:

This guy can't be serious or is just trolling.  They actually dumbed CV play down to the lowest common denominator.

They may have made them too dumb?

I could handle RTS, but I can’t use this supposedly ‘easier’ version of carriers in any way that justifies all the whining and kvetching. I watch my planes being slaughtered quite often, despite everything I try to do, and it leaves me with very little sympathy for those claiming they’re OP.

Are there issues? Even I would agree, but, carriers OP? :fish_palm:

Not in my experience.

Edited by Estimated_Prophet
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I recommend playing a bunch of co-op. Yes, they are done in five minutes or so but you get some good practice in and nobody is yelling at you...

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There's just no way to get better at this class.  I had five losses in a row at tier 4.  I try to go after the dd's but that doesn't work.  They are so maneuverable and the planes are not so I miss or do very little damage.  The battleships may not be able to maneuver well but they can still miss all but one torpedo if not all of them.  I have never been afraid of carriers in my battleships.   I don't see how anyone can do anything significant in these things.  

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As with every other class in the game, practice helps you improve. From what I'm reading, it seems like you are either using A and D keys to adjust your aim or you're not giving enough lead or you aren't giving the attack run enough distance. What I recommend is to watch a stream or a YouTuber do it and then try it out on your own in co-op or in a custom match playing against bots with their AA turned off but maneuvering.

Learning carriers is not something as simple as "How to Battleship/Cruiser/Destroyer" with a simple "lead this much ahead" or "position this way and kite out". Carriers are about a sense of Feel and knowing when to drop, when to start the run, and how to go about it. It's a class that takes time to learn and not something you'll be able to fully understand and perform in under 100 games. Carriers, like Destroyers, are in my opinion the most technical class to understand in terms of Thought Process. Sure anyone can dab  on a ship for 20k+ damage full of bombs and rockets, but it's about GETTING THERE to achieve that. Last thing you want to do is to beat yourself up and stay negative.

Watch YouTube videos, catch some streams and ask questions, then try it out on your own. We have lots of great carrier players who also provide content for players who wish to improve or learn the class. Ahskance provides twitch streams, I provide YouTube videos for example: linked here. I have videos of gameplay, commentary, and started a new series called CV Academy. Hope it helps and you get better games in the future

 

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On 10/24/2020 at 12:07 PM, Bullpies322 said:

I used to play carriers back in the day when it was an rts.  They were tough but you could make it work.  Now it jus makes me want to take my computer and throw it out the window.  The attack time is so small, the inability to control fighters, the damn flak clouds.  There is no way to practice this class as co-op battles are too short, and Random battles you make a mistake and you lose the entire squadron.

Yeah but according to the CV haters RTS CVs where not OP or broken :Smile_teethhappy: Even though you could rekt G.K and sink in a successive wave of planes :Smile_trollface:

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On 10/24/2020 at 2:36 PM, Viper069 said:

This guy can't be serious or is just trolling.  They actually dumbed CV play down to the lowest common denominator.

I actually find myself agreeing with the last part, HOWEVER, the old RTS system is how the majority of carrier primaries learned the game.

As a result of learning to play carriers as they were intended, most of us look at the new system as a mistake of the highest level.

It leads people to believe the devs don't care about the playerbase, even those of us who put real money into the game.

If you think about it, all the devs did was simply cater to the part of the playerbase that simply HAS to whine about something, usually because they can't seem to realize that simply YOLOing out by yourself is not only stupid but is also a really good way to be dead really quickly. The old system rewarded teamplay, communication, and situational awareness. Carriers had to chose: air superiority/surface strike capability. You couldn't have both, it was one or the other, as well as forcing players in general to pay attention to the map, there teammates, and generally what was going on around them. I see WAY too many moments with the current system where it simply encourages people to go solo simply because they don't get punished for it. At the end of the day: yes it is just a game but then so are many others.

Just remember we are here to have fun, and maybe just maybe learn something along the way. 

 

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On 10/25/2020 at 12:30 AM, Bullpies322 said:

There's just no way to get better at this class.  I had five losses in a row at tier 4.  I try to go after the dd's but that doesn't work.  They are so maneuverable and the planes are not so I miss or do very little damage.  The battleships may not be able to maneuver well but they can still miss all but one torpedo if not all of them.  I have never been afraid of carriers in my battleships.   I don't see how anyone can do anything significant in these things.  

Enclosed are some recent Victory screen shots.
I was running extra signal flags and the Decepticon's camo for the bonuses.
So, just look at the damage done and the types of hits that achieved it.
First, these are (very) above average games for me.  The Kraken is the first I've ever gotten in a CV.  

The point is that it is *possible* to do well with a CV.
But it does take effort to study the concepts and practice the how-to, and patience & experience to refine and apply the concepts in a battle.
Gotta walk before running and gotta run before flying.  

Seriously, I studied how aerial attacks on ships were done in WW-II by reading Naval History and Training Manuals and watching Training Films on youtube.
I also watched youtube videos from official WOWs how-to guides along with videos from various community contributors to see how the details compared.

CV's in WOWs are in a role of close-air support and also sometimes in an "Oh :etc_swear:!" close-quarters battle like the DD's & CV's with the famous "Taffy 3".
Instead of being 50 or more miles from the nearest enemy ship, we're situated less than 25 km away at the start, and things go from there.

CV's were heavily nerfed by the RTS-to-*rework* change-over.  And they've been steadily nerfed here & there since then.
So, getting to the point where you feel you're contributing to your team's success will involve a journey of discovery.

Welcome to "CV-Life".  :Smile_glasses:

shot-20_10.26_21_51.12-0415.thumb.jpg.ed5cd7b2e5e7756568e42a591cca77b8.jpg
shot-20_10.26_22_36.40-0112.thumb.jpg.c3fefbf0c119b5ddd63dc1fc8c603646.jpg
 

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57 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Enclosed are some recent Victory screen shots.
I was running extra signal flags and the Decepticon's camo for the bonuses.
So, just look at the damage done and the types of hits that achieved it.
First, these are (very) above average games for me.  The Kraken is the first I've ever gotten in a CV.  

The point is that it is *possible* to do well with a CV.
But it does take effort to study the concepts and practice the how-to, and patience & experience to refine and apply the concepts in a battle.
Gotta walk before running and gotta run before flying.  

Seriously, I studied how aerial attacks on ships were done in WW-II by reading Naval History and Training Manuals and watching Training Films on youtube.
I also watched youtube videos from official WOWs how-to guides along with videos from various community contributors to see how the details compared.

CV's in WOWs are in a role of close-air support and also sometimes in an "Oh :etc_swear:!" close-quarters battle like the DD's & CV's with the famous "Taffy 3".
Instead of being 50 or more miles from the nearest enemy ship, we're situated less than 25 km away at the start, and things go from there.

CV's were heavily nerfed by the RTS-to-*rework* change-over.  And they've been steadily nerfed here & there since then.
So, getting to the point where you feel you're contributing to your team's success will involve a journey of discovery.

Welcome to "CV-Life".  :Smile_glasses:

shot-20_10.26_21_51.12-0415.thumb.jpg.ed5cd7b2e5e7756568e42a591cca77b8.jpg
shot-20_10.26_22_36.40-0112.thumb.jpg.c3fefbf0c119b5ddd63dc1fc8c603646.jpg
 

i think if you ask me WG made a big mistake going from RTS to rework which was obviously catered to casual dumbs. all they really needed was some minor tweaks plus unlimited planes which makes it more forgiving for new players and you're all set but instead we got...this.

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Just now, The_Big_Red_1 said:

i think if you ask me WG made a big mistake going from RTS to rework which was obviously catered to casual dumbs.

I opposed the "re-work" and stated my case in several posts (some of which are years old, as of today).

I'm simply making the best of what I have, nowadays.

I still miss my Zuiho.

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1 minute ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

I opposed the "re-work" and stated my case in several posts (some of which are years old, as of today).

I'm simply making the best of what I have, nowadays.

I still miss my Zuiho.

i thought rework was cool at first but now i know too late it was a dumb idea to begin with. =(

whoever in WG thought rework was a great idea was clearly not in their right mind if you ask me even if surface ships rakes in more dough for them.

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