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Avenge_December_7

Discontinuation of MacOS Support

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https://na.wargaming.net/support/en/products/wows/article/15628/

Yes, I know, there will be the "k bye", the "lol Mac pleb", "get a PC", and other such comments. Do as you will.

I know those of us here who use Macs are a probably very small minority of the WoWs population, but this was still a slap to the face for me, a Mac user. Perhaps it does make sense from a strictly business perspective, but I would be lying if I said that makes it any bette for those of us thrown under the bus.

Although WG has in the past year or two severely damaged by trust in it and my enthusiasm for WoWs, I had still originally planned to trundle on, mainly because of how much I enjoyed using my favorite ship(s) and the variety from co-op and PvP that operations offered. But I guess WG is now forcing the issue (now that's a plot twist I didn't expect).

It's true that I could, say, buy/build a PC or install boot camp, but truth be told, in my view a company that intends to make me jump through such hoops merely to participate is simply not worth my time. Additionally, I don't have the time or money for a PC, and I don't quite have the patience or expertise to go through all the boot camp installation/troubleshooting only to then have to reboot for Mac whenever I need to do something else.

I will likely continue on in WoWs until 0.10.0 hits. I shan't spend a penny for it, but I do think I will try and get as many ships as possible before the update hits. And above all, I know my days in WoWs are numbered.

It's funny, though. I started WoWs because I wanted the USN standards. Now it looks like USN standards will be the final sub-line of ships I could possibly start working on before my WoWs career ends permanently.

It is unfortunate, but it looks as though for me, the swan song of my WoWs career has begun to play.

 

 

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Tbh as a MacBook Pro user I’m not really surprised. There has never been a native client for macOS and the wrapper ran like crap. It worked well enough in boot camp for a year but last month my Bluetooth mouse no longer worked in boot camp so I resorted to using my 10 yo desktop for the game, sad really. Maybe WG should have considered the reason there are a lack of Mac players is because they never put out a proper Mac client and their wrapper was a pathetic excuse.

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55 minutes ago, Avenge_December_7 said:

I know those of us here who use Macs are a probably very small minority of the WoWs population, but this was still a slap to the face for me, a Mac user. Perhaps it does make sense from a strictly business perspective

You hit the nail on the head. Yes, supporting multiple platforms for a complex product is costly in software development. Basically, every automated unit/integ/system-level test has to be run on MacOS (this is expensive from the test bed standpoint), you have to have Mac-dedicated developers, deal with issues unique to Macs, etc.

It is what it is, unfortunately :Smile_sad: Maybe you can run a windows emulator? I'm not familiar with Macs, but I'd be surprised if one isn't readily available.

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image.thumb.png.cfec427098768e447c1cc0c83ba96b5d.png

From Statista https://www.statista.com/statistics/265033/proportion-of-operating-systems-used-on-the-online-gaming-platform-steam/

From a development standpoint, it's remarkably difficult to develop cross-platform. The only things I've ever been able to get to run cross-platform are my own Java apps and browser stuff.

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1 minute ago, vak_ said:

It is what it is, unfortunately :( Maybe you can run a windows emulator?

Like geforce or something? Truthfully, I probably could, but a) there'd be troubleshooting involved, b) it would lack the ability to seamlessly switch from one app to the other, since most of my work involves Mac apps, and c) I'm very much of the point that if a developer throws up too many barriers, it's not worth it.

4 minutes ago, vak_ said:

You hit the nail on the head. Yes, supporting multiple platforms for a complex product is very costly in software development. Basically, every unit/integ/system test has to be run on Mac (this is very costly from test bed standpoint), you have to have Mac-dedicated devs, deal with issues unique to Mac, etc.

 

 

2 minutes ago, Compassghost said:

From a development standpoint, it's remarkably difficult to develop cross-platform. The only things I've ever been able to get to run cross-platform are my own Java apps and browser stuff.

I've little technical expertise, but I can imagine that they decided the effort to make it usable for Macs wasn't worth it. I can empathize with the business decisions made here.

Still, for those of us who draw the short straw (like with WG's recent announcement that some people won't be getting daily shipments), it feels like a massive "screw you" moment.

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If you have an Intel based Mac you do have the Boot Camp option, of course Apple has to make dual booting harder, and then you will be running it in Windows. Boot Camp is included with every Mac since 2006 so the only additional cost will be a copy of Windows 10 64 bit.

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13 minutes ago, BrushWolf said:

If you have an Intel based Mac you do have the Boot Camp option, of course Apple has to make dual booting harder, and then you will be running it in Windows. Boot Camp is included with every Mac since 2006 so the only additional cost will be a copy of Windows 10 64 bit.

It's not so much the capability to get boot camp so much as the inability to fluidly switch back and forth, not to mention I've read about some of the issues boot camp has with High Sierra.

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7 minutes ago, Avenge_December_7 said:

It's not so much the capability to get boot camp so much as the inability to fluidly switch back and forth, not to mention I've read about some of the issues boot camp has with High Sierra.

I gather you have to load into the Mac OS to use Boot Camp to reboot into Windows. :Smile_sad: It is so much easier with a non-Mac Intel machine because what OS choice is done at the BIOS level. The problem for Mac users is BC is going to be their only option other than having a Windows machine for gaming which is an even more expensive option.

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If you have good bandwidth and latency with your internet connection, you should try game streaming services like GeForce NOW.

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3 minutes ago, BrushWolf said:

I gather you have to load into the Mac OS to use Boot Camp to reboot into Windows. :Smile_sad: It is so much easier with a non-Mac Intel machine because what OS choice is done at the BIOS level. The problem for Mac users is BC is going to be their only option other than having a Windows machine for gaming which is an even more expensive option.

Nah... BootCamp is just a fancy frontend for partitioning the hard drive and getting a base set of drivers. Once the OS is installed you can choose it from the boot menu on start up, just like you could if you had multiple copies of Windows (or Linux) on a single machine. Windows on a Mac is just like Windows on any other computer once its installed and configured.

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If you ask me, the writing was on the wall for 2 yrs now... That is how long it took for them to admit what they published...

You can still use the MAC with boot camp to play... BUT no more MAC version... Fitting.

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1 minute ago, Avalon304 said:

Nah... BootCamp is just a fancy frontend for partitioning the hard drive and getting a base set of drivers. Once the OS is installed you can choose it from the boot menu on start up, just like you could if you had multiple copies of Windows (or Linux) on a single machine. Windows on a Mac is just like Windows on any other computer once its installed and configured.

Ah, I misunderstood what @Avenge_December_7 was saying.

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15 minutes ago, Avalon304 said:

Nah... BootCamp is just a fancy frontend for partitioning the hard drive and getting a base set of drivers. Once the OS is installed you can choose it from the boot menu on start up, just like you could if you had multiple copies of Windows (or Linux) on a single machine. Windows on a Mac is just like Windows on any other computer once its installed and configured.

Unfortunately I just checked and I don’t quite have the storage space for boot camp, neither do I have the means currently to get external storage.

21 minutes ago, Learux said:

Want to look good in star bucks get a Mac.

Want to play games get a PC.

Way to mock people for not having the financial capability to get new software on a whim.

Make your stats public then if you wish to trash talk.

 

13 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said:

If you ask me, the writing was on the wall for 2 yrs now... That is how long it took for them to admit what they published...

You can still use the MAC with boot camp to play... BUT no more MAC version... Fitting.

Unfortunately you speak the truth here. It is still infuriating regardless.

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It's not surprising. I mean, who knew Apple still even made computers? I thought it was all iPhones and iPads that somehow cost more but do less than an actual PC.

Edited by thebigblue
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2 hours ago, Avenge_December_7 said:

but truth be told, in my view a company that intends to make me jump through such hoops merely to participate is simply not worth my time.

I swear I am not being snarky!

The company that is making it's people jump through hoops to play a game or use apps that the rest of the world enjoys for free is not WG.

Just wait until they go with their own CPU exclusively.

Then you will see how many things you have to pay for that won't run for free anymore.

Your frustration is with the wrong Company.

With all the disclaimers you wrote before during and throughout your post makes me think you already knew that.

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12 minutes ago, Col_Nasty said:

I swear I am not being snarky!

The company that is making it's people jump through hoops to play a game or use apps that the rest of the world enjoys for free is not WG.

Just wait until they go with their own CPU exclusively.

Then you will see how many things you have to pay for that won't run for free anymore.

Your frustration is with the wrong Company.

With all the disclaimers you wrote before during and throughout your post makes me think you already knew that.

Hmm, you may have a point.

A conflict between WoWs and the other activities that necessitate the Mac I use

Still, it’s unfortunate that it has come to this :(

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4 minutes ago, Avenge_December_7 said:

Hmm, you may have a point.

A conflict between WoWs and the other activities that necessitate the Mac I use

Still, it’s unfortunate that it has come to this :(

like yes, wg is at points a really [edited] company, and i also see some reasons why someone would rather use a mac instead of a windows or linux machine, but i despise apple as a company... their pratices for anything involving not going to an apple shop and paying in the hundreds for repairs is [edited] and should be condemned and i may not be a fan of epic but by god i support that lawsuit...

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1 hour ago, Avenge_December_7 said:

Like geforce or something?

WG: " World of Warships is available via GeForce NOW. "

Have you tried GeForce NOW?  It's not an emulator - the client runs remotely and serves video to your machine.  For me it works better than running a local client.  You should at least try it.  We'd prefer not to lose you.

Edited by iDuckman
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2 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

WG: " World of Warships is available via GeForce NOW. "

Have you tried GeForce NOW?  It's not an emulator - the client runs remotely and serves video to your machine.  For me it works better than running a local client.  You should at least try it.  We'd prefer not to lose you.

it does cost money, if i remember correctly. but yeah, had a buddy with mac who used it when it was free. worked perfectly fine for him

 

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Mmm.  It does now.  Some small like $5/month?  I was using it when it was free.  I think there's a trial period still.

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1 hour ago, Navalpride33 said:

If you ask me, the writing was on the wall for 2 yrs now... That is how long it took for them to admit what they published...

You can still use the MAC with boot camp to play... BUT no more MAC version... Fitting.

You are right Naval. This is the reason I kept posting here in the forums,  that Mac users should not spend money on the game since the ability to play could end at any time. It didn't take a rocket surgeon to realize that a company based in Russia/Belarus/Cyprus would not have the technical ability or experience to provide a product that could be used on both platforms. Only western countries really have that expertise pool to draw on. 

 

49 minutes ago, Qilang said:

good.

No one cares Apple computers.

Well I wouldn't say "no one". Apple has a nice chunk of the market unless you live in a third world country. IIRC, they have made a good bit of money with their products so your statement is demonstrably false. You really should be more truthful and just say you don't care. 

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57 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

Mmm.  It does now.  Some small like $5/month?  I was using it when it was free.  I think there's a trial period still.

I used GeForce NOW when it first went public. It worked surprisingly well. I was able to run at max quality on my Mac and 7 yo Dell. It convinced me game streaming is feasible. So I signed up for Shadow PC since GFN doesn't support any resolution above 1080p and I have 1440p ultrawide. GFN also doesn't allow mods since you don't have access to the game files.

Shadow PC has been great for me. It does have hiccups here and there but works well in general.

I does have FIOS connection and hardwire to my machines. So that makes a more stable experience.

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11 minutes ago, Taylor3006 said:

It didn't take a rocket surgeon to realize that a company based in Russia/Belarus/Cyprus would not have the technical ability or experience to provide a product that could be used on both platforms. Only western countries really have that expertise pool to draw on. 

 

It's all about saving money. Maintaining and updating the game for one OS instead of two takes less work.

I'm going to say that, since they know how many players are using Macs, they know whether or not it's worth their while to continue to offer the game for 2 OSs, or rework all their existing coding for cross-platform capability.

I'm pretty sure that if WG wanted to do it, and didn't have the talent in-house, they'd just hire somebody from Finland, who could work from there, and make occasional short jaunts to St. P if needed.

 

 

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