Jump to content
You need to play a total of 20 battles to post in this section.
Meta_Man

Are CVs broken ? Khabarovsk

39 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles

Hello captains:cap_cool: , the question everyone either asks or assumes is ( are CVs overpowered ? ) . Lets look at numbers and math and not just feelings . Each class has challenges in the game as we all know . First let us decide what OP means . To me and most warmed blooded people would use this  as an example . A Lamborghini vs a Chevy Volt would be unfair in a race and the Lambo would be OP . In ships you would take a super powerful ship and put it in the hands of a super skilled unicum .And each class is and unicums is gonna get the equal amount of divisions . Let us say the top 5% of the player base . Simple math right ? Here is a battle I had yesterday in the Khaba which is my WORST winrate DD in the game ( no seriously worst ). Which has the worst turning ability as a dd at tier 10 , worst concealment  and by air seen at 3.6 km and I use no smoke . Against a purple CV captain who DOES attack me multiple times , and we have a point 5 % player from purple CV player on my team . Try to keep an open mind and decide for yourself are CVs OP or do they make us play differently than we would like to . My Youtube channel is Meta_Man2002 please subscribe if you find the videos helpful and happy hunting captains . :cap_rambo: 

 

Edited by Meta_Man

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
3,354 posts
17,002 battles

CVs are like the Co-op mode ship in a random battle. It's designed for "easy mode"  for unskilled players or those who don't want to worry about losing their ships during a battle. 
I don't think it takes much talent to achieve purple status in a CV

Edited by STINKWEED_
  • Cool 1
  • Meh 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
21 minutes ago, STINKWEED_ said:

CVs are like the Co-op mode ship in a random battle. It's designed for "easy mode"  for unskilled players or those who don't want to worry about losing their ships during a battle. 
I don't think it takes much talent to achieve purple status in a CV

First off thanks for the comment, next to become a purple player you would need over a 60% winrate in them. So do you say this from experience because if so there is an error on wows stats page because it says you have no games in the CV class, it must be a mistake and you should let them know . Usually my trolls have no experience in said ship or class. But thanks for the comment . I can make these videos everyday in me playing against good to great CVs . CVs are strong but you are bashing because , you can not deal with them and  your top 2 ships have no AA , convenient . Are  kamikaze and Musashi considered easy mode with out CVs ?  If CVs were removed which they will not be i would be ok ,  I play mostly DDs the last year or so , but to call a class OP is not right either with  no statistical numbers to back it up . 

Edited by Meta_Man

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
817
[CLUMP]
Members
1,165 posts
1,449 battles

In my opinion, CVs are a convenient excuse for anyone to blame anything but themselves :Smile_teethhappy: 

Edited by LastRemnant
  • Cool 2
  • Thanks 2
  • Boring 3
  • Meh 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
7 minutes ago, LastRemnant said:

In my opinion, CVs are a convenient excuse for anyone to blame anything for but themselves :Smile_teethhappy: 

Who CVs hurt most is the lone wolf unicums not the normal player . That is why they complain all the time and get people on board with the CV bashers club . The 46%--50% winrate player going lone wolf is not changing  the battle anyway so them dieing alone is not changing the win % . But take the unicum player who likes to go lone wolf to create great crossfire angles  , yes it is hurting their carry potential . 

Edited by Meta_Man
  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32
[HAI]
Members
74 posts
4,538 battles

 A lot of people might scream OP, but the real complaint is it's just not fun to play against the insane spotting and aerial harassment that leave the player with littler counter play options.    Plus many times actively maneuvering to avoid planes will put you in a much worse position (like showing broadside to one or more BBs to dodge aerial torpedos is not a good decision).  It makes it hard for DD's to do their normal role of spotting so their gameplay becomes boring too.

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
3,354 posts
17,002 battles
1 hour ago, Meta_Man said:

First off thanks for the comment, next to become a purple player you would need over a 60% winrate in them. So do you say this from experience because if so there is an error on wows stats page because it says you have no games in the CV class, it must be a mistake and you should let them know . Usually my trolls have no experience in said ship or class. But thanks for the comment . I can make these videos everyday in me playing against good to great CVs . CVs are strong but you are bashing because , you can not deal with them and  your top 2 ships have no AA , convenient . Are  kamikaze and Musashi considered easy mode with out CVs ?  If CVs were removed which they will not be i would be ok ,  I play mostly DDs the last year or so , but to call a class OP is not right either with  no statistical numbers to back it up . 

I have over 15,600 battles. Musashi and Kami make up a small percentage of those battles so your comment is really dumb to begin with . My Musashi is in tier 10 battles 70% of the time against much stronger ships. I have barely played Kami in two years. Besides, CVs have made it totally useless as it relies on concealment. 

Yes, I've played at least 100-125 battles in CV in the test server. I found them to be brainless. I can teach a chimpanzee to command a CV. It's rather easy. Just find a yolo or ship separated from the others on the map and harass the crap out of it. Send torpedo bombers and drop them from one side. Perhaps some hit, floods, repairs.... then send them again from the other side as he turns and get a second unstoppable flood. Do it again and again and again. Rinse and repeat. Lose all your planes? No problem, lots more to come and it only takes them seconds to reach their target. 
You have a 95% chance that it will survive every battle. 

And yeah, anyone who spends enough time practicing with their CVs and who knows which targets to go at can easily get 3-4 kills a battle to effect the battle outcome (purple). 
The CV's after rework are simply ships designed for kids. Limit the planes like they had before and lets see how that goes.  

  • Meh 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
6 minutes ago, STINKWEED_ said:

I have over 15,600 battles. Musashi and Kami make up a small percentage of those battles so your comment is really dumb to begin with . My Musashi is in tier 10 battles 70% of the time against much stronger ships. I have barely played Kami in two years. Besides, CVs have made it totally useless as it relies on concealment. 

Yes, I've played at least 100-125 battles in CV in the test server. I found them to be brainless. I can teach a chimpanzee to command a CV. It's rather easy. Just find a yolo or ship separated from the others on the map and harass the crap out of it. Send torpedo bombers and drop them from one side. Perhaps some hit, floods, repairs.... then send them again from the other side as he turns and get a second unstoppable flood. Do it again and again and again. Rinse and repeat. Lose all your planes? No problem, lots more to come and it only takes them seconds to reach their target. 
You have a 95% chance that it will survive every battle. 

And yeah, anyone who spends enough time practicing with their CVs and who knows which targets to go at can easily get 3-4 kills a battle to effect the battle outcome (purple). 
The CV's after rework are simply ships designed for kids. Limit the planes like they had before and lets see how that goes.  

so simple questions answered,  NO you haven't played them in regular server and YES Musashi and Kamikaze are your 2 most played ships...Once again,  what is their best counter for either...CV..Dropped mic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
49 minutes ago, Falran said:

 A lot of people might scream OP, but the real complaint is it's just not fun to play against the insane spotting and aerial harassment that leave the player with littler counter play options.    Plus many times actively maneuvering to avoid planes will put you in a much worse position (like showing broadside to one or more BBs to dodge aerial torpedos is not a good decision).  It makes it hard for DD's to do their normal role of spotting so their gameplay becomes boring too.

I love your comment Sir , I agree they are not always fun to play against and that isn't my contention..if we can look at facts and not feelings we'd see the numbers don't agree with being OP....Argument about fun is subjective and I could agree with..i just hate the bad name and false propaganda...once again great post.:Smile_honoring:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
3,354 posts
17,002 battles
Just now, Meta_Man said:

so simple questions answered,  NO you haven't played them in regular server and YES Musashi and Kamikaze are your 2 most played ships...Once again,  what is their best counter for either...CV..Dropped mic

You still make no sense. I have 15,600 battles. Of those I played 2,300 battles in a Kami years ago because I didn't have a premium account and it was the only way to get enough credits to buy higher tiered ships. So what?  I've played 7,000 battles with other ships. 

Your three most played ships are Kidd, Tirpitz, and Yamato. It doesn't change the fact that CVs are easy-stupid mode ships where planes are unlimited, they fly at Mach 2, and require no skill if you understand the mechanics. end of story

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
24 minutes ago, STINKWEED_ said:

You still make no sense. I have 15,600 battles. Of those I played 2,300 battles in a Kami years ago because I didn't have a premium account and it was the only way to get enough credits to buy higher tiered ships. So what?  I've played 7,000 battles with other ships. 

Your three most played ships are Kidd, Tirpitz, and Yamato. It doesn't change the fact that CVs are easy-stupid mode ships where planes are unlimited, they fly at Mach 2, and require no skill if you understand the mechanics. end of story

Let's get back on task , shall we. Show me numbers of why they are overpowered.  I explained in my video and photos I posted in another post the top 5% of each class ...This shows that if a ship is OP it would show an anomaly in winrate..There isn't one , in actuality Smalland has the highest winrate in the game...all public information available to all...About my top 3 played ships played I do ok in Tirpitz and Kidd but raced to the Yammy with free xp as my first tier 10 as she was the reason I even started playing the game,lol. I am way bad in her,but she will slowly come up after  I am no longer a complete noob anymore,  lol..If I could take away my Yammy, Khabarovsk, Atlanta, Indianapolis,  wonder where my winrate would be,lol guilty pleasures.I'm not arguing that it is fun to play against CVs , but the false narrative of OP is wrong...i can show numbers i can post games i..in a dd vs purple CVs everyday like I did today....If you can say , hey look they are not fun to play against  , I'll buy that all day but don't sell it as something it is not.

Edited by Meta_Man
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10,057
[SALVO]
Members
25,798 posts
28,042 battles
2 hours ago, Meta_Man said:

Who CVs hurt most is the lone wolf unicums not the normal player . That is why they complain all the time and get people on board with the CV bashers club . The 46%--50% winrate player going lone wolf is not changing  the battle anyway so them dieing alone is not changing the win % . But take the unicum player who likes to go lone wolf to create great crossfire angles  , yes it is hurting their carry potential . 

Boo-frickin-hoo.  So, the unicum player has to work harder to carry.  Cry me a river.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
8 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Boo-frickin-hoo.  So, the unicum player has to work harder to carry.  Cry me a river.

Did you read my post wrong or who created this post.lol. im not defending the cv haters...im the guy who made the video..my video says what I believe, lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32
[HAI]
Members
74 posts
4,538 battles
1 hour ago, Meta_Man said:

I love your comment Sir , I agree they are not always fun to play against and that isn't my contention..if we can look at facts and not feelings we'd see the numbers don't agree with being OP....Argument about fun is subjective and I could agree with..i just hate the bad name and false propaganda...once again great post.:Smile_honoring:

Yea. It's hard to make a case for them being OP and each team gets one.  It's really more the subjective problems people have with them.  There's also the consistency problem.  For example, there's actually some cool upgrade / commander skill decisions for AA.  In particular the AA mod 1 in Slot 3 and AA mod 2 in Slot 6.  The slot 3 mod, which is particularly good with massive AA fire ( 4 point skill).  However, the problem with running AA builds is it feels real bad when you go into games with no CVs and you've picked up all these things that now nerf you because there are other really strong choices for those slots and commander points. 

 

*Edit: There should never be upgrades/commander skills that are totally dead in certain games. WG needs to find a way to add secondary things to those upgrades / skills that at least provide some other minor benefits that are always active.  Like AA mod 1 should still do something small for your turrets (but not as good as aiming systems mod), especially on DDs with dual purpose turrets.  Similar concept for slot 6 AA mod 2 and massive AA fire.  

Edited by Falran

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
13 minutes ago, Falran said:

Yea. It's hard to make a case for them being OP and each team gets one.  It's really more the subjective problems people have with them.  There's also the consistency problem.  For example, there's actually some cool upgrade / commander skill decisions for AA.  In particular the AA mod 1 in Slot 3 and AA mod 2 in Slot 6.  The slot 3 mod, which is particularly good with massive AA fire ( 4 point skill).  However, the problem with running AA builds is it feels real bad when you go into games with no CVs and you've picked up all these things that now nerf you because there are other really strong choices for those slots and commander points. 

 

*Edit: There should never be upgrades/commander skills that are totally dead in certain games. WG needs to find a way to add secondary things to those upgrades / skills that at least provide some other minor benefits that are always active.  Like AA mod 1 should still do something small for your turrets (but not as good as aiming systems mod), especially on DDs with dual purpose turrets.  Similar concept for slot 6 AA mod 2 and massive AA fire.  

I totally agree with your comments...i play mostly DD with sprinkled in all other classes including CV the last couple years....i believe the 2 classes most affected by skill gap is the CV and the DD....Now i can get on the skill gap bandwagon but CV OP no....thanks for commenting. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
510
[KMS]
[KMS]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
3,679 posts
12,225 battles
4 hours ago, STINKWEED_ said:

CVs are like the Co-op mode ship in a random battle. It's designed for "easy mode"  for unskilled players or those who don't want to worry about losing their ships during a battle. 
I don't think it takes much talent to achieve purple status in a CV

Did you do it?  I have an account just for cv play.. I'm nowhere close to purple.  Tier 8 in Tier 10 games. Just brutal. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
510
[KMS]
[KMS]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
3,679 posts
12,225 battles
2 hours ago, Meta_Man said:

Let's get back on task , shall we. Show me numbers of why they are overpowered.  I explained in my video and photos I posted in another post the top 5% of each class ...This shows that if a ship is OP it would show an anomaly in winrate..There isn't one , in actuality Smalland has the highest winrate in the game...all public information available to all...About my top 3 played ships played I do ok in Tirpitz and Kidd but raced to the Yammy with free xp as my first tier 10 as she was the reason I even started playing the game,lol. I am way bad in her,but she will slowly come up after  I am no longer a complete noob anymore,  lol..If I could take away my Yammy, Khabarovsk, Atlanta, Indianapolis,  wonder where my winrate would be,lol guilty pleasures.I'm not arguing that it is fun to play against CVs , but the false narrative of OP is wrong...i can show numbers i can post games i..in a dd vs purple CVs everyday like I did today....If you can say , hey look they are not fun to play against  , I'll buy that all day but don't sell it as something it is not.

I wonder what my winrate would be if I just played tier 5 too...  Lol.  Always looking for that challenge.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
12 minutes ago, Nachoo31 said:

I wonder what my winrate would be if I just played tier 5 too...  Lol.  Always looking for that challenge.

I rhink there would be a lot more unicums,😆 

Edited by Meta_Man

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10,057
[SALVO]
Members
25,798 posts
28,042 battles
3 hours ago, Meta_Man said:

Did you read my post wrong or who created this post.lol. im not defending the cv haters...im the guy who made the video..my video says what I believe, lol

I read your post, but didn't watch the video.  I'm not a fan of people creating posts where the entire content of the post is embedded in a video, and thus rarely watch said videos.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
On 9/23/2020 at 4:17 PM, Crucis said:

I read your post, but didn't watch the video.  I'm not a fan of people creating posts where the entire content of the post is embedded in a video, and thus rarely watch said videos.

didnt take the time to watch the video but took the time to post ,lol . 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
250
[CYNIC]
Members
572 posts
33,198 battles

Based on YOUR definition of OP they are not OP . Now let's see the real world .  does spotting count ? it sure does . Can I shoot the planes down NO . Can I kill that CV ? 99 % of the time no . Why because the planes spot me and somebody else shoots me before I can even get close to that CV .  Rocket planes are OP .Nice video but I don't have a 26 K health DD with heal . How many times did the rocket planes miss you ? From what I saw none . torpedo bombers and dive bombers rarely hit a Dd it's the rocket planes . Add in the fact that since the rework everyone else's AA got nerfed  in an AA rework nerf  at the same time with an introduction of the OP rocket planes The Dds do not stand a chance . In your  video you commented that if a CV wanted you dead you were going to be dead . That IS the definition of OP .  The rework  changed the fighter planes role  so much that a CV rarely bothers defending his team mates any more . Have I ever played a CV  No . I have no wish to play the most Over powered class ship in the game . All they have done is create more Cv players that are Bad . If you get the good one your team wins If you get the bad one  your team loses  If you get equal skill good players you are hunted down by planes and either killed by rockets or by another ship that sees you because of the planes . If you get equal skill bad players you are still spotted and killed by other ships .  Getting skinny with rocket planes has not worked for me as the avg  hit I receive is 25 % of my health . They get up to 3 drops on me . with the hit rates I am describing that leaves me with only 25 % health left and a new set of rocket planes headed to me to finish the job .They have such a big payload they can saturate bomb me in a smoke cloud even if they never saw me but know I am there . It's not all about win rate Game play of a DD is always about stealth . The only thing I didn't see in your video was the reality of other ships destroying you because you were spotted . That is the reality of today's meta . 

What is the counter to a CV ?  Nothing  that's OP

No matter what ship you play now you MUST build for AA . If you don't you just get clobbered by them . That was the other nerf . They got rid of the ability to upgrade your AA range  in both commander skills and as a ship upgrade as well as sticking us with the terribly useless sector air defense . AA getting spread across the entire squadron is worthless . Only damage/ kills to attacking planes matters . but they changed that capt skill too and replaced it with massive damage . 

So  I hear what you are saying but your video is the exception . Why that Des Moines didn't pull out and kill you I have no Idea  . Nice game  or as  should be pointed out  GG 

update  WG can't even get MM right at T 3   I ended up in a double CV match with 0 AA 

 

Edited by Capt_Q_Sparrow
  • Cool 1
  • Meh 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
On 9/30/2020 at 2:42 AM, Capt_Q_Sparrow said:

Based on YOUR definition of OP they are not OP . Now let's see the real world .  does spotting count ? it sure does . Can I shoot the planes down NO . Can I kill that CV ? 99 % of the time no . Why because the planes spot me and somebody else shoots me before I can even get close to that CV .  Rocket planes are OP .Nice video but I don't have a 26 K health DD with heal . How many times did the rocket planes miss you ? From what I saw none . torpedo bombers and dive bombers rarely hit a Dd it's the rocket planes . Add in the fact that since the rework everyone else's AA got nerfed  in an AA rework nerf  at the same time with an introduction of the OP rocket planes The Dds do not stand a chance . In your  video you commented that if a CV wanted you dead you were going to be dead . That IS the definition of OP .  The rework  changed the fighter planes role  so much that a CV rarely bothers defending his team mates any more . Have I ever played a CV  No . I have no wish to play the most Over powered class ship in the game . All they have done is create more Cv players that are Bad . If you get the good one your team wins If you get the bad one  your team loses  If you get equal skill good players you are hunted down by planes and either killed by rockets or by another ship that sees you because of the planes . If you get equal skill bad players you are still spotted and killed by other ships .  Getting skinny with rocket planes has not worked for me as the avg  hit I receive is 25 % of my health . They get up to 3 drops on me . with the hit rates I am describing that leaves me with only 25 % health left and a new set of rocket planes headed to me to finish the job .They have such a big payload they can saturate bomb me in a smoke cloud even if they never saw me but know I am there . It's not all about win rate Game play of a DD is always about stealth . The only thing I didn't see in your video was the reality of other ships destroying you because you were spotted . That is the reality of today's meta . 

What is the counter to a CV ?  Nothing  that's OP

No matter what ship you play now you MUST build for AA . If you don't you just get clobbered by them . That was the other nerf . They got rid of the ability to upgrade your AA range  in both commander skills and as a ship upgrade as well as sticking us with the terribly useless sector air defense . AA getting spread across the entire squadron is worthless . Only damage/ kills to attacking planes matters . but they changed that capt skill too and replaced it with massive damage . 

So  I hear what you are saying but your video is the exception . Why that Des Moines didn't pull out and kill you I have no Idea  . Nice game  or as  should be pointed out  GG 

update  WG can't even get MM right at T 3   I ended up in a double CV match with 0 AA 

 

Winrate is winrate , if something is overpowered and you put the unicums in them they'll dominate in winrate..and CV is not the highest winrate class amongst unicums...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
359
[RDS-A]
Beta Testers
347 posts
8,578 battles
19 hours ago, Meta_Man said:

Winrate is winrate , if something is overpowered and you put the unicums in them they'll dominate in winrate..and CV is not the highest winrate class amongst unicums...

Seen as you keep saying cv's are not op answer this question for me.

Why is it by adding cv's to clan battles completely removed dd's from lineups from clan battles?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
733
[META_]
Members
1,660 posts
17,317 battles
2 hours ago, EraserNZ1 said:

Seen as you keep saying cv's are not op answer this question for me.

Why is it by adding cv's to clan battles completely removed dd's from lineups from clan battles?

CVs change the dynamics of the game but are not overpowered , if they were OP their winrate of the unicums would be higher than other ships at the unicum level...I completely agree CVs are universally despised by most  but not  OP , the numbers don't agree with you . If CVs left today I wouldn't care , but I won't jump on the OP bandwagon , they change game dynamics is all.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×