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Midnitewolf

Republique - Opinions on secondary build in the current meta

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So just wanted to see what people though about a secondary build on the Republique currently.   

I am currently running a bit of a hybrid build with my captain set up as full secondaries while my upgrades are more focused on long range and survivability and to be blunt I can't figure out if a secondary build is worth it or not.

Generally speaking I kind of tend to use  and hybrid style of play too with the Republique by using the range advantage and accuracy the Republique has early game but closing into my current secondary range of 10.6 km toward the latter parts of the game.  Obviously I am having mixed results.  Some games I don't do any secondary damage but others, like my last match for example, secondaries accounted for 36k damage of a 128k damage game.  That is pretty significant.   I have also had the enhanced secondaries save me twice against DDs in less than 20 battles so there is that.

The way I see it there are three ways to build it.

One, Jack of all trades, kind of like I have it now.  Enhanced secondaries at the expense of survival skills on my captain while focusing Main Armaments mod,  aiming mod and reload with my upgrades.  It so far seems to be working OK but I do miss my enhanced turret traverse that I can't fit into the secondary build for my captain and often times not specializing means your somewhat bad at everything compared to what you could manage if you specialized.

The second would be full secondaries replacing Main Armament, Aiming and Reload mods with their respective secondary enhancement mods and maybe dropping Concealment for IFHE.  Of course this is betting all on the secondaries on a ship that isn't exactly the best brawler though, I have been a bit surprised at just how good she can actually brawl.

The third would be a more traditional build giving up BFT, AFT and Manual Secondaries for Turret Traverse, Fire Prevention and Superintendent. Of course then the secondaries go back to being rather useless in those times of need and I would have to probably be a bit less aggressive at times.

Oh and a message to wargaming.  It would be really nice if testing out various builds wasn't a pain the cost tons of credits, xp and/or doubloons.....just saying.

So what are everyone's opinions now?

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Repub eats too much damage to be dealing with secondaries or brawling builds. Plus, she doesnt get the quarter pen. All she has going for her is the fire chance on the secondaries and range. No way worth it for random battles. In competitive/ranked sprints/ranked/clan brawls and MAYBE CBs (if Repub is your thing), possibly. Only because the engagement range is closer and there is fewer ships to focus you. Even then I would advise against it unless it is a super DD potent meta (which it usually isnt especially with CVs)

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Secondaries that only pen 21/25mm without IFHE at tier X and a hull covered in 32mm armor is not a good combination for a secondary build. Richelieu and Alsace have the same problem, as their numerous 100mm guns only pen 19mm. IMO IFHE is not worth it on secondary builds after the change, but if you do decide to take it you can’t take any survivability skills. This is a big problem because cruisers love shooting HE at French (and British) battleships. Republique and other high tier French BBs just aren’t durable enough to spend a lot of time engaging enemies within their secondary range.

Edited by Nevermore135

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33 minutes ago, _BBaby said:

Repub eats too much damage to be dealing with secondaries or brawling builds. Plus, she doesnt get the quarter pen. All she has going for her is the fire chance on the secondaries and range. No way worth it for random battles. In competitive/ranked sprints/ranked/clan brawls and MAYBE CBs (if Repub is your thing), possibly. Only because the engagement range is closer and there is fewer ships to focus you. Even then I would advise against it unless it is a super DD potent meta (which it usually isnt especially with CVs)

I think you might be right.  I am playing ranked right now and even in that environment, the secondaries are turning out to be very situational for me.  When the situation occurs where they really come into play, they offer a significant increase in damage however, those situation aren't happening too often.

Here are some stats for anyone interested.

9 Battles.

Total damage for all 9 battles was 1,012,400

Secondaries accounted for 97,931 damage total so slightly less than 10% of the total.

59,121 of that damage came from fires set by the secondaries.

38,810 damage from shell hits alone.

In 3 of the 9 battles, Secondaries accounted for less than 1000 damage total.

In 1 of the 9 battles, Secondaries did zero damage.

In 6 of the 9 battles, secondaries did less than 6500 damage total combined with fires and shell hits.

Only in 3 battles did secondaries significantly contribute to my total damage numbers.   These 3 battles accounted for 88,398 of the total damage.

This is with a captain build using BFT, AFT and Manual Secondaries.   No ship upgrades were devoted to secondaries so not a full secondary build.

 

So by this small sample size, I found that the enhanced secondaries were next to useless in around 65% of the battles though in the 3 where they were useful, they averaged adding around 30k or around 30% more damage to my final total in those battles.  Overall having a fairly strong secondary build did increase my total damage output by around 10% over all battles.  I would guess going full secondary build might add 5% to that total maybe.  On the other hand, I  have to ask myself if losing a -10% chance to get set on fire, 1 less fire max, an extra heal, an extra engine boost, 3500 more hitpoints and a full 8 second faster turret rotation speed is worth a very situational 30% extra damage in roughly 35% of my matches and just 10% extra damage overall.   Kind of thinking it isn't worth it.

Edit:  This is based on my play style which I outlined in the original post, another play style might very well get more out of it.  As I mentioned, I don't close in till late game so someone more aggressive might get more use out of the secondaries.  Just wanted to add that.

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18 minutes ago, Midnitewolf said:

Decided to switch my build but need advice.

Basics of Survivability or Survivability Expert?

BOS, SE isnt worth it on any BBs.

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49 minutes ago, Midnitewolf said:

Decided to switch my build but need advice.

Basics of Survivability or Survivability Expert?

30 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

BOS, SE isnt worth it on any BBs.

What Rip said; SE is little more than a single pen by a BB caliber shell at any tier.

Usually just 3,500-4,000 hp at T10, depending on a few options. Big for a destroyer, not so much for anything else.

Edited by Estimated_Prophet

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On 9/16/2020 at 8:26 PM, Midnitewolf said:

So just wanted to see what people though about a secondary build on the Republique currently.   

I am currently running a bit of a hybrid build with my captain set up as full secondaries while my upgrades are more focused on long range and survivability and to be blunt I can't figure out if a secondary build is worth it or not.

Generally speaking I kind of tend to use  and hybrid style of play too with the Republique by using the range advantage and accuracy the Republique has early game but closing into my current secondary range of 10.6 km toward the latter parts of the game.  Obviously I am having mixed results.  Some games I don't do any secondary damage but others, like my last match for example, secondaries accounted for 36k damage of a 128k damage game.  That is pretty significant.   I have also had the enhanced secondaries save me twice against DDs in less than 20 battles so there is that.

The way I see it there are three ways to build it.

One, Jack of all trades, kind of like I have it now.  Enhanced secondaries at the expense of survival skills on my captain while focusing Main Armaments mod,  aiming mod and reload with my upgrades.  It so far seems to be working OK but I do miss my enhanced turret traverse that I can't fit into the secondary build for my captain and often times not specializing means your somewhat bad at everything compared to what you could manage if you specialized.

The second would be full secondaries replacing Main Armament, Aiming and Reload mods with their respective secondary enhancement mods and maybe dropping Concealment for IFHE.  Of course this is betting all on the secondaries on a ship that isn't exactly the best brawler though, I have been a bit surprised at just how good she can actually brawl.

The third would be a more traditional build giving up BFT, AFT and Manual Secondaries for Turret Traverse, Fire Prevention and Superintendent. Of course then the secondaries go back to being rather useless in those times of need and I would have to probably be a bit less aggressive at times.

Oh and a message to wargaming.  It would be really nice if testing out various builds wasn't a pain the cost tons of credits, xp and/or doubloons.....just saying.

So what are everyone's opinions now?

Imho, despite its reputation for having 12.1km secondaries and what appeared to be good firing angles, the Republique was never a great secondary ship.  And it isn't the 32mm armor, as the Alsace is in the same boat, and it used to be a great secondary ship, too.  No, the issue with the Republique is two-fold:

  • All-forward, but very flimsy secondary mounts that get trashed very early in battle.
  • The IFHE rework gutted French secondary builds as their 152mm guns no longer penetration 32mm of armor with IFHE.  In a test against 12x Amagi's @ 8km,
    • Pre-IFHE Rework parsed 14,704pm
    • Post-IFHE Rework parsed 10,292dpm

That's a massive loss in secondary DPM vs battleships, which are your most important target.  Go full survival and don't look back.

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Republique is my favorite BB, but randoms made me evolve from my initial hybrid survivability/secondary build to a straight survivability build.

The hybrid survivability/secondary build was fun in clan battles, though.

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A full secondary build Republique while fun is a big no no outside of coop.

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