Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 20 battles to post in this section.
Chain_shot

Gotta admit T6 is so messed up due to MM now

64 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

1,646
[46856]
Members
1,870 posts

Used to like T6 years ago but this MM system placing it into T8's games is so poorly though out it makes me question how intoxicated the devs were when they did this.

T6 should never be higher than +1 or lower than -1. Fix this mess of a tier WG you molested it too far.

  • Cool 2
  • Boring 3
  • Meh 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,705
[WOLF9]
Wiki Lead
15,133 posts
4,766 battles
4 minutes ago, Chain_shot said:

T6 should never be higher than +1 or lower than -1. Fix this mess of a tier WG you molested it too far.

T6 hasn't changes since I've been around. 

Instead of implicitly whinging about having to play against more powerful ships, think of all that extra XP you get to farm from having higher tier ships to shoot at.

The rewards from damage scale depending on the tier disparity between ships. More is earned for damaging a higher tiered than a lower tiered ship.

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Base_Earnings

  • Cool 3
  • Confused 1
  • Meh 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
867 posts
14,150 battles
8 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

T6 hasn't changes since I've been around. 

Instead of implicitly whinging about having to play against more powerful ships, think of all that extra XP you get to farm from having higher tier ships to shoot at.

The rewards from damage scale depending on the tier disparity between ships. More is earned for damaging a higher tiered than a lower tiered ship.

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Base_Earnings

This is why I prefer T10 games in my Atago

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,646
[46856]
Members
1,870 posts
10 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

T6 hasn't changes since I've been around. 

Instead of implicitly whinging about having to play against more powerful ships, think of all that extra XP you get to farm from having higher tier ships to shoot at.

The rewards from damage scale depending on the tier disparity between ships. More is earned for damaging a higher tiered than a lower tiered ship.

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Base_Earnings

Ducky that is a tired response T6 is the worst for getting up tiered. No amount of extra xp unless it was like 100k per battle makes up for the crap game play you have to endure. You and me both know that there is big difference between T6 ships and t8's. Adding CV's into the mix does not sweeten the pot..

Edited by Chain_shot
  • Cool 3
  • Confused 2
  • Boring 1
  • Meh 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,110
[WOLFC]
Members
2,153 posts
10,518 battles

The only thing that has changed about MM recently is the implementation of the new rule where you are bottom tier no more than 40% of the time. This has made the MM much better at tier VIII, as tier VIIIs would be put into a disproportionate amount of tier X games prior to the change.

A secondary effect of this change is that tier VII (and to a lesser extent, tier VI), do not get as “good” MM as they used to because there are more tier VIII games for them to populate. Nevertheless, tier VI ships are perfectly capable of performing when bottom-tier in a tier VIII match, you just need to adjust your play appropriately. It’s no different than any other tier in that regard. 

Edited by Nevermore135
  • Cool 2
  • Meh 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,705
[WOLF9]
Wiki Lead
15,133 posts
4,766 battles
2 minutes ago, Chain_shot said:

No amount of extra xp unless it was like 100k per battle makes up for the carp game play you have to endure.

Actually, I rather like T6.  If you feel stuck grinding there, run some scenarios.  It will go by quickly enough.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,646
[46856]
Members
1,870 posts
Just now, iDuckman said:

Actually, I rather like T6.  If you feel stuck grinding there, run some scenarios.  It will go by quickly enough.

Not stuck grinding there just revisited for the epoch event and its definitely getting the shaft compared to higher most of the time. It used to be a fun tier not they sucked the fun out of that tier so badly.

  • Meh 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10,061
[SALVO]
Members
25,798 posts
28,063 battles
10 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

T6 hasn't changes since I've been around. 

Instead of implicitly whinging about having to play against more powerful ships, think of all that extra XP you get to farm from having higher tier ships to shoot at.

The rewards from damage scale depending on the tier disparity between ships. More is earned for damaging a higher tiered than a lower tiered ship.

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Base_Earnings

Duck, the "problem" (note the quotes) isn't the tier spread.  When MM was changed so that you'd never be bottom tier in a +/-2 tier battle, that meant that tier 8's would be top tier more often than in the past.  It also caused tier 7 to not be so much of a sweet spot.

Don't get me wrong.  I'm not being critical of this.  It's just a reality that if you change how often tier 7-8 ships can be bottom tiered in +/-2 tier MM, it's also going to affect ships that will see those tier 7-8 ships as top tier ships.  It may seem rough on tier 6, but I'm sure that it probably seems pretty good for tier 8's to not constantly be thrown into tier 10 battles.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10,061
[SALVO]
Members
25,798 posts
28,063 battles
6 minutes ago, Chain_shot said:

Ducky that is a tired response T6 is the worst for getting up tiered. No amount of extra xp unless it was like 100k per battle makes up for the crap game play you have to endure. You and me both know that there is big difference between T6 ships and t8's. Adding CV's into the mix does not sweeten the pot..

Yawn.  If MM was changed so that T6's didn't see tier 8's quite so often, it would also mean that tier 8's would not be top tier as often and have to endure playing tier 10's more often.

I wish people would stop whining about this and learn how to play their ships when they're not top tier.  You have to play ships differently when bottom tier compared to when you're top tier.  And it seems like there are some people who can't do that or outright refuse to do that, and instead blame MM for their inability to make the necessary adjustments in their game play.

  • Cool 2
  • Boring 1
  • Meh 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,705
[WOLF9]
Wiki Lead
15,133 posts
4,766 battles

They keep 'adjusting' MM, pretty soon Randoms will be infested with bots.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
508
[KERMT]
Members
1,067 posts
14,456 battles
Just now, iDuckman said:

They keep 'adjusting' MM, pretty soon Randoms will be infested with bots.

I think the majority of the bad players are spread across so many tiers, I am resorting to only playing when there is less than 5,000 players online,
During the day at the peak 18,000 players online, the skill of jo blogs is terrible. 
Weekends are worse. 

There needs to be skills and tactics videos to cover off ship placement on maps just as the match starts, 
Most of the stuff out there is "How to play a ship" nothing about "how to play this map" 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,879
[FML]
Members
4,118 posts
16,057 battles
1 hour ago, Chain_shot said:

Used to like T6 years ago but this MM system placing it into T8's games is so poorly though out it makes me question how intoxicated the devs were when they did this.

T6 should never be higher than +1 or lower than -1. Fix this mess of a tier WG you molested it too far.

I  understand your frustration, but to give the reply that no-one wants to hear, the +/- 2 MM also adds variety to the game.  Being put against enemies two tiers higher than you should force you to take a different strategy and approach to the ship than if you were two tiers higher than your enemies. 

Imagine you are in a T5 Omaha against T7 battleships - your only chance to do well and be influential is to sit back at long range, and support the rest of your team by keeping those battleships on fire for as long as you can.  Noone expects you to carry the team to a win, noone expects you to finish top of the table (though I typically compliment +karma anyone who does). As such, being bottom tier is low stress play - you do what you can with what you have for as long as you are able and that's it.  However, when you are in that same T5 Omaha against T4 destroyers, you can use your many guns, hydro and torps to close with enemy destroyers and bully them into submission, having a major impact on the battle and enabling your team to win. 

When top tier, it is often up to you to do well, and use your tier advantage to defeat key enemy ships. If you fail to perform its likely your team will get rolled - and it will be your fault.  So, there's higher pressure from your team who expect you to do more than 1/12 of the effort to carry them to victory.  Therefore, depending on whether it is top or bottom tier, to maximise your effectiveness your same T5 Omaha should be played in two completely different ways. Charging in might work when you're top tier, but will just get you killed when you're bottom tier.  Hence, it adds variety to the game even if other variables like maps etc are the same. 

It is also a measure of a player's skill and mindset - can they handle being bullied as well as being the bully? Can they handle the pressure and adapt to the environment to do what is necessary to win?  Can they handle just playing the supporting role instead of playing the lead role out front? As such, the matchmaking spread is also a test of one's character.  

In summary, these are some reasons (in no particular order) why you shouldnt care about being uptiered 2 levels: 

  • Noone expects you to carry your team to a win - so no pressure.  And if you do carry, then you feel a particular sense of achievement and team often sings your praises, which is a different kind of reward.  
  • Damaging and destroying higher tier ships rewards more XP and credits than the same amount of damage on same or lowered tiered ships; 
  • As explained above, learning to play the ship you are in differently based on whether you are top tier or bottom tier adds variety to the game.  The same action taken in a T8 BB vs T6 ships might be a heroic push, but that same action in the same T8 BB against T10 ships constitutes a suicide yolo charge. 
  • Gradual exposure to higher-tier ships means you have more time to get used to them - such as learning which ships have radar etc - whilst still mostly playing against familiar ships.  
  • Gradual exposure to higher-tier maps means you have time to get used to them whilst still mostly playing on familiar maps
  • From time to time, your enemies will be 2 tiers below you, so you can flex your ship to its full potential and see if you enjoy it.  
    • Strangely, most players dont complain when they are two tiers higher than their enemies 'for a change'!
  • The matchmaker was recently modified to limit how often a ship is made bottom tier after a 20 battle calibration time and to reduce how often you are the only bottom tier ship in a battle.  This means it is deeply unlikely that you are 'always' bottom tier; instead you'll be bottom tier about 40% of the time once your ship has been calibrated. 
  • Cool 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
882
[BOTES]
Members
2,235 posts
8,550 battles

This isn't WOT, saying "oh I'm down two tiers" is not an argument. It's not like ships universally get better in every respect and you can't punch above your weight. Everyone can deal damage and every ship has situational advantages.

Name the ships you're struggling with at T6 and I'll tell you how annoying they can be to deal with.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
854
[WOOKY]
Beta Testers
1,766 posts
1 hour ago, Chain_shot said:

Used to like T6 years ago but this MM system placing it into T8's games is so poorly though out it makes me question how intoxicated the devs were when they did this.

T6 should never be higher than +1 or lower than -1. Fix this mess of a tier WG you molested it too far.

did you use to like it 5 years ago when T6s could face T10s?

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10,391
[INTEL]
Members
13,459 posts
37,680 battles

I play Fuso and sometimes Shino almost every time I get in game. It's funny because I was thinking the opposite, that T6 has improved, along with T5, based on my last few months experience with Fuso. I seem to see a lot more games where I am the top tier BB.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3,059
[-K-]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
7,466 posts
9,751 battles
4 hours ago, Shannon_Lindsey said:

Pretty sure T6 has always been able to face T8.

I think the point could be that T6 see high tiers too often, because of the ripple effect that protected T4/T5 ships have. This is exacerbated by the fact that qualitatively T6/T8 disparity is probably one of the worst in game. For instance, New Mexico vs NC is a much worse match-up than NC vs Montana.

But the issue isn't really new, of course. 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
584
[-TKS-]
Members
1,265 posts
9,844 battles

Honestly I think the larger issue currently with Tier VI mm is the Epoch event going on that’s bringing a larger variety of players to the same one or two brackets. Such an event tends to cause games to be lopsided at least, and complete blowouts at most.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,015
Members
2,440 posts
5,404 battles

T6 ship against a T8 CV? Might as well just log out of match and start another. Is basically a free kill for the CV player.

  • Cool 1
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,152
[BONKS]
Members
957 posts
3,779 battles

We are just assuming players learning the game at T6 should just be happy and accept that their Mutsuki is regularly having to going up against Enterprise, Massachusetts, Clevelands and Akizukis. On an almost every game basis. It really is btw. I've just ground 30 Farragut games. 22 of them I was against T8's. For me? Not an issue. But I'm an experienced player who plays at a high level. And I found it.... challenging, to say the least. Now put yourself in the shoes of a player who have only gotten to T6/7 with maybe a 12 point captain. Can you not see their points that maybe, just maybe MM needs a little tweek. They did it for the T8 cry babies. And there was no need as by T8 at least ships are competitive when bottom tier. 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
3,648 posts
42,248 battles

Well, it is the reality of what a low tier player suddenly realizing that they are probably not ready to play any higher.

I can hear the sinister Dr Evil laughs as tier 8 players rip the 6s to pieces.

It's a harsh lesson. But sadly a necessary one. Or these new ones might get funny ideas and ruin high tier matches.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6,104
[FOXEH]
Banned
14,364 posts
20,266 battles
6 hours ago, Chain_shot said:

You and me both know that there is big difference between T6 ships and t8's. Adding CV's into the mix does not sweeten the pot..

Not much different from tier 5s seing tier 7s, or tier 7s seeing tier 9s; getting uptiered sux regardless of the tiers. And tier 6 has always been able to see tier 8.

6 hours ago, iDuckman said:

They keep 'adjusting' MM, pretty soon Randoms will be infested with bots.

Randoms ARE infested with bots .... and I blame YOU!!

6 hours ago, Dareios said:

did you use to like it 5 years ago when T6s could face T10s?

Not as much as I "liked" it when they had CVs and we didn't; that was always so very much of a good time!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3,450
[YORHA]
Members
5,192 posts
10,344 battles

It's possible that this is a temporary problem caused by Asymmetric Battles sucking all the tier VIs out of regular randoms.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14,039
[ARGSY]
Members
22,219 posts
16,189 battles
1 hour ago, TorpedoBonk said:

We are just assuming players learning the game at T6 should just be happy and accept that their Mutsuki is regularly having to going up against Enterprise, Massachusetts, Clevelands and Akizukis.

If you're going to pick out a specific example, you really should try to get your facts straight. Mutsuki is Tier 5, and without the dubious benefit of a fail-div she will NEVER face ANY of the ships you have mentioned. 

2 hours ago, Legio_X_ said:

T6 ship against a T8 CV? Might as well just log out of match and start another. Is basically a free kill for the CV player.

Here's New Mexico, bottom tier in a match with T8 carriers. 

I didn't like the matchmaking one little bit, but I refused to consider myself as helpless prey.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×