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todo_free

Tell me this is not a bug...

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Please tell me what consider the match making to chose players on the teams and if this is not a bug then explain to the newcomers why they need to accept this thing...

yourmmisgarbage.jpg

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That is not a bug just a bad streak which happens with any game.

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The Math behind MM, and no its not a bug.

Spoiler

The math behind MM revolves behind 3 math principles and an affect which are...

  • Principle of chance
  • Principle of Random
  • Principle of probability

The Effect in play because of the above named math principle

  • The snowball affect.

Other math laws in play but relative to statistics analysis.

  • Bell's curve composition on players WR%
    • In the percentile representing the players of all server regions as follows.
      • %56 and up = %5
      • %44 and below = %5
      • %45 to %55 = %90 of the player base.

That is it...

 

Edited by Navalpride33
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28 minutes ago, todo_free said:

Please tell me what consider the match making to chose players on the teams and if this is not a bug then explain to the newcomers why they need to accept this thing...

yourmmisgarbage.jpg

Just to clarify...w/almost 12k games...are you 1 of the "newcomers"?

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After 4 losses, try going into co-op so you don't lose your mind/cool/destroy your comp.

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16 hours ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said:

Just to clarify...w/almost 12k games...are you 1 of the "newcomers"?

No... i saw this kind of behavior in other account... and i try to imagine what a new player going to think... because the probability of give up after something like that is real...

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15 hours ago, Tingent said:

After 4 losses, try going into co-op so you don't lose your mind/cool/destroy your comp.

Yeah, i know... but why someone going to need to change the kind of game because have some losses?

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16 hours ago, Navalpride33 said:

The Math behind MM, and no its not a bug.

  Hide contents

The math behind MM revolves behind 3 math principles and an affect which are...

  • Principle of chance
  • Principle of Random
  • Principle of probability

The Effect in play because of the above named math principle

  • The snowball affect.

Other math laws in play but relative to statistics analysis.

  • Bell's curve composition on players WR%
    • In the percentile representing the players of all server regions as follows.
      • %56 and up = %5
      • %44 and below = %5
      • %45 to %55 = %90 of the player base.

That is it...

 

Thanks for explain that... but i don't think that a probability of win is given by lucky here... because is a team each time... and i do the comparison to have a coin flip and have face more than 2 times...

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17 hours ago, AJTP89 said:

Who says MM had anything to do with that?

All the players in the game... no joke... every time i login someone says something about the mm, and why is selecting certain players in one team and not spreading even...

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4 minutes ago, todo_free said:

All the players in the game... no joke... every time i login someone says something about the mm, and why is selecting certain players in one team and not spreading even...

Flip a coin twelve thousand times and record how many streaks of either heads or tails you get.

Another thing it keep in mind, getting frustrated with a loss tends to lead to bad play, which tends to influence the result to a loss. Thus losing streaks happen a bit more than winning streaks.

I see nothing here that even suggests more than random MM. People say something about MM causing it because people in general don't understand what 'random' means and refuse to admit there's no great big evil moustache twirling intelligence keeping them down for some nefarious reason even they can't explain.

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1 minute ago, Lert said:

Flip a coin twelve thousand times and record how many streaks of either heads or tails you get.

Another thing it keep in mind, getting frustrated with a loss tends to lead to bad play, which tends to influence the result to a loss. Thus losing streaks happen a bit more than winning streaks.

I see nothing here that even suggests more than random MM. People say something about MM causing it because people in general don't understand what 'random' means and refuse to admit there's no great big evil moustache twirling intelligence keeping them down for some nefarious reason even they can't explain.

No, the account on which happens this have like 500 battles... in my account once 16 to 19 in a row

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Just now, todo_free said:

No, the account on which happens this have like 500 battles... in my account once 16 to 19 in a row

Still doesn't suggest anything porpoiseful and evil from MM.

I think the highest losing streak I ever had was like 12 or so? Similar win streak.

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1 minute ago, Lert said:

Still doesn't suggest anything porpoiseful and evil from MM.

I think the highest losing streak I ever had was like 12 or so? Similar win streak.

be sure is more than that,... and yes i think the mm have something to do with this... in the sense of the choice that he takes in account for each player on the team..

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25 minutes ago, todo_free said:

Thanks for explain that... but i don't think that a probability of win is given by lucky here... because is a team each time... and i do the comparison to have a coin flip and have face more than 2 times...

That is Probability of chance AND the probability of Random, in play.

  • Its random, so the fleet make up is highly dependent on the population of the queue.
  • The chance of MM putting the same 12 people you lost with, on the next match is highly unlikely.
    • In other words using your losing streak as an example, if you lost the first match.. Those 12 people will not be in the same fleet as you, for the 2nd match (they might be in the red team or not be in the same match anymore).

I do have to point out, since we dont have the team results for the matches you pointed out... I will go out on a limb, using the principles of math stated in my last post, to state the obvious... The big guns fatsos did not produce to pass the threshold to win. 

Basically, what I am saying here, I dont think its a MM issue.. I am leaning more to the player, not producing for whatever reason... (Like a batter in baseball having a slump).

I recommend to rethink your tactics. Even baseball players in a slump, will hit a home-run.

Edited by Navalpride33

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2 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said:

That is Probability of chance AND the probability of Random, in play.

  • Its random, so the fleet make up is highly dependent on the population of the queue.
  • The chance of MM putting the same 12 people you lost with, on the next match is highly unlikely.
    • In other words using your losing streak as an example, if you lost the first match.. Those 12 will not be in the same fleet as you, for the 2nd match (they might be in the red team).

I do have to point out, since we dont have the team results for the matches you pointed out... I will go out on a limb, using the principles of math stated in my last post, to state the obvious... The big guns fatsos did not produce to pass the threshold to win. 

Basically, what I am saying here, I dont think its a MM issue.. I am leaning more to the player, not producing for whatever reason... (Like a batter in baseball having a slump).

I recommend to rethink your tactics. Even baseball players in a slump, with hit a home-run.

I agree in those points... But even in the parameters you point out, there must be enough variations for a game to be determined by the skill of the players... but even having a slump you cant fail so many times...

Many times i finish between the first 4th places and sometimes having more than 3 kills and more than 150k of dmg... it can not happens one behind the other so many times... Taking in account that not the same players was on the same teams....

And yes, some times i do a yolo or i got wiped in the first round, im a very regular player... but that's the point... if i was so bad then i not come here talking about this... 

By the way as I say in other comment it happens me 16 times once before the game crashed... is funny because some times the game crash after a series of games like this... and in the moment i reconnect it happens again... 6 to 8 times... that means sometimes if i not take the crashes in account it goes to the 18 + losses in a row....

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35 minutes ago, todo_free said:

be sure is more than that

Based on what?

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1 minute ago, Lert said:

Based on what?

8 minutes ago, todo_free said:

By the way as I say in other comment it happens me 16 times once before the game crashed... is funny because some times the game crash after a series of games like this... and in the moment i reconnect it happens again... 6 to 8 times... that means sometimes if i not take the crashes in account it goes to the 18 + losses in a row....

 

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4 minutes ago, todo_free said:

I agree in those points... But even in the parameters you point out, there must be enough variations for a game to be determined by the skill of the players... but even having a slump you cant fail so many times...

Many times i finish between the first 4th places and sometimes having more than 3 kills and more than 150k of dmg... it can not happens one behind the other so many times... Taking in account that not the same players was on the same teams....

And yes, some times i do a yolo or i got wiped in the first round, im a very regular player... but that's the point... if i was so bad then i not come here talking about this... 

By the way as I say in other comment it happens me 16 times once before the game crashed... is funny because some times the game crash after a series of games like this... and in the moment i reconnect it happens again... 6 to 8 times... that means sometimes if i not take the crashes in account it goes to the 18 + losses in a row....

Few things, DMG and kills do not = wins... I've won games just by spotting and playing the decoy... Which points out your other flaw... There is more then one way to win the match other then kills and high DMG totals.

With the math, I am not implying your a bad player... Just a misguided one.

So, until we see a team detailed report to see where you're messing up... Its not a MM conspiracy or issue.. The math behind it, disagrees with you.

 

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1 minute ago, Navalpride33 said:

Few things, DMG and kills do not = wins... I've won games just by spotting and playing the decoy... Which points out your other flaw... There is more then one way to win the match other then kills and high DMG totals.

With the math, I am not implying your a bad player... Just a misguided one.

So, until we see a team detailed report to see where you're messing up... Its not a MM conspiracy or issue.. The math behind it, disagrees with you.

 

Yes, i have done that too... no i'm not saying that you imply anything, I as i say a regular player.... Team detailed report i can show you latter just i need to take screenshots... in the moment this happens again i can post those here if you want... D'not get me wrong, i'm not saying that is a mm conspiracy... i say something is wrong with that... maybe a comma or period in the wrong place in the code...

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2 minutes ago, todo_free said:

i say something is wrong with that... maybe a comma or period in the wrong place in the code...

Nope. The math is clear.  You get both long win and loss streaks... Which is normal.

Random is a 12 vs 12 format, that means... Someone wins in order for others to lose.

If the math shows something out of the ordinary, I am on it like sticky rice on sushi.

So far, nothing out of the ordinary.

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6 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said:

Nope. The math is clear.  You get both long win and loss streaks... Which is normal.

Random is a 12 vs 12 format, that means... Someone wins in order for others to lose.

If the math shows something out of the ordinary, I am on it like sticky rice on sushi.

So far, nothing out of the ordinary.

This is the only game where that happens... i'm not a new player, and i played a lot of games... in no other game happens something like this... ever.... your maths are wrong...

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36 minutes ago, todo_free said:

This is the only game where that happens... i'm not a new player, and i played a lot of games... in no other game happens something like this... ever.... your maths are wrong...

Unfortunately, I dont know any other games, nor would I know if the math principles will work ever there as well.

I am pointing out the math of WOWS that affects everyone who plays WOWS. The principles of math were not made by me, if you have a disagreement. Take it up with

  • Archimedes
  • John GrauntWilliam Petty

Like I said, the math doesn't says you're a new player. Just a misguided one. Totally different.

GL,

if you do have team detailed reports... We here at the forums, have all the time in the world to give you our opinions on where you can improve.

 

 

Edited by Navalpride33

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12 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said:

Unfortunately, I dont know any other games, nor would I know if the math principles will work ever there as well.

I am pointing out the math of WOWS that affects everyone who plays WOWS. The principles of math were not made by me, if you have a disagreement. Take it up with

  • Archimedes
  • John GrauntWilliam Petty

Like I said, the math doesn't says you're a new player. Just a misguided one. Totally different.

GL,

if you do have team detailed reports... We here at the forums have all the time in the world to give you our opinions on where you can improve.

 

 

Ok,  so according to you it is not a problem in the system or the characteristics of ships or wr or "ship wr" or whatever other thing that is taken in account for a given match maker in a beta game... is the player?

I not need to go to Archimedes Jhon Graunt or William Petty, you can say that is math all what you want, but i don't think that is the same math applied correctly or in a way that is fair to select the teams... 

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31 minutes ago, todo_free said:

Ok,  so according to you it is not a problem in the system or the characteristics of ships or wr or "ship wr" or whatever other thing that is taken in account for a given match maker in a beta game... is the player?

I not need to go to Archimedes Jhon Graunt or William Petty, you can say that is math all what you want, but i don't think that is the same math applied correctly or in a way that is fair to select the teams... 

Then its "selective MM" not Random MM...

The math principles expressed in my previous post are not meant to incorporate "fairness" or "what is fair." Its only to show Random MM is that Random.

I recommend, read over my previous post... Goggle the principles and the affects... It has terms in applied math, now you may not understand completely whats going on..

That's ok.

If you want to equate "fair" into the principles.. I would venture to say, due to the randomness of the population of queue to create a match in the first place... IMO its impossible for a MM program to quantify the definition of "fair" "fairness" or "fair selection of teams".

  • I would also add, MM dont give you the same 24 guys every game, is that fair ? Yes its random
  • MM dont give you the same ships AND players for the number of battles you posted... Is that fair ??? Yes Its Random.
  • From what I can tell, MM is giving you all the chances to find a way to win...Is this fair ?? Yes its Random.
    • I am definitely leaning towards player performance issues.

Just so you know, "Selective MM" have been a death sentence by games whom adapted it. I will not change long win or losing streaks.

 

Edited by Navalpride33

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