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zubalkabir

Selecting targets for secondaries

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I take the manual control skill for some of my BBs with good secondaries, but not for others (either because I don't yet have a captain in them that has the points to spare, or because there is little benefit in that particular ship).  Some times when I'm playing a ship without the skill, my fingers resort to muscle memory on the keyboard anyway, and I'll find myself designating targets - and the game lets me do it.  At least it puts the little icon above the target ship.  But, with dispersion and secondary animations being what they are,  I can't tell if it actually causes the secondaries to focus on that ship to the exclusion of all others.  Does anyone know if designating a target actually does anything without the manual control skill?  It would be nice if it did, at least until that ship got out of range or popped smoke or something.  Occasionally I'll want to focus my secondaries on that DD that's 7 km away and ignore that BB that's only 5 km away.

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7 minutes ago, zubalkabir said:

Does anyone know if designating a target actually does anything without the manual control skill? 

For one it does force the secondaries on that side of the ship to attack that target if it is available. 

 (unsubstantiated) For some reason I also think there is an accuracy boost though I doubt it. (unsubstantiated)

 

I do not ever take manual secondaries. I find I rather have both sided of secondaries shooting if a target is available on both sides. Plus those 4 points can go to a lot better investments like Fire prevention or Concealment,. 

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I run manual secondaries on my Mass and Georgia and do the same thing with my non manual secondary ships. I click on a ship out of habit.

I thought that you get a very small buff when clicking on a ship for secondaries but I'm not sure.

Edited by CorradoG60
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15 minutes ago, eviltane said:

I do not ever take manual secondaries. I find I rather have both sided of secondaries shooting if a target is available on both sides. Plus those 4 points can go to a lot better investments like Fire prevention or Concealment,. 

I think it's a YMMV situation. I take great pains to try not to end up with with ships that close on both sides lol.

I'll take it on BBs with "meh" secondaries instead of FP, because close-in DDs cause me more grief than fires. And when one does pop up 5-6km away, I don't want my secondary gunners "praying and spraying", I want that DD gone ASAP.

 

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26 minutes ago, zubalkabir said:

I take the manual control skill for some of my BBs with good secondaries, but not for others (either because I don't yet have a captain in them that has the points to spare, or because there is little benefit in that particular ship).  Some times when I'm playing a ship without the skill, my fingers resort to muscle memory on the keyboard anyway, and I'll find myself designating targets - and the game lets me do it.  At least it puts the little icon above the target ship.  But, with dispersion and secondary animations being what they are,  I can't tell if it actually causes the secondaries to focus on that ship to the exclusion of all others.  Does anyone know if designating a target actually does anything without the manual control skill?  It would be nice if it did, at least until that ship got out of range or popped smoke or something.  Occasionally I'll want to focus my secondaries on that DD that's 7 km away and ignore that BB that's only 5 km away.

It will focus on the ship you want, but with no bonuses. 

From the wiki https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Secondary_Armament:

When the preferred target is selected, a small icon (illustrated nearby) appears above its icon. Only one target can be manually selected. When a preferred target is selected, secondary guns will fire at no other target. Designating such a target provides no bonuses of any type.

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I was wrong this is what the WIKI says:

The captain may select one enemy to fire at in preference to all others. Hold down the <ctrl> key and select the enemy ship with the left mouse button (LMB).[3] When the preferred target is selected, a small icon (illustrated nearby) appears above its icon. Only one target can be manually selected. When a preferred target is selected, secondary guns will fire at no other target. Designating such a target provides no bonuses of any type.

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7 minutes ago, lbfreitasBR said:

It will focus on the ship you want, but with no bonuses. 

From the wiki https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Secondary_Armament:

When the preferred target is selected, a small icon (illustrated nearby) appears above its icon. Only one target can be manually selected. When a preferred target is selected, secondary guns will fire at no other target. Designating such a target provides no bonuses of any type.

Cool.  Good to know.  Thanks.  

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16 minutes ago, Skpstr said:

I think it's a YMMV situation. I take great pains to try not to end up with with ships that close on both sides lol.

I'll take it on BBs with "meh" secondaries instead of FP, because close-in DDs cause me more grief than fires. And when one does pop up 5-6km away, I don't want my secondary gunners "praying and spraying", I want that DD gone ASAP.

 

Yeah, it's fun too.  I was driving my GK last night on that map that has a huge island in the middle of C, with a small gap between it and another big island in B.  Another GK and I were in C tag teaming with our hydro, and keeping a red Halland from coming around to try to torp us.  The Halland was just sitting patiently in the gap between the islands with his bow facing us, ready to jump when our hydro ran out.  So, since I could see him and he couldn't see me, I decided to do an old fashioned LA gang banger style drive-by.  I loaded HE in the main guns, designated the Halland as my target for the secondaries, then got the low rider up to speed to run across his bow from C to B.  Whacked half his HP with a salvo from the main guns, and the secondaries finished him off before he could move.  Crossing the T still works in this game against DDs.  LOL

Edited by zubalkabir
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I switched over to running manual secondaries after going one on one with a Massachusetts with a Massachusetts.

I was running auto-secondaries and my foe was running manual. 

Even though I had more main gun hits. He ate me alive. Our ship layouts and captain skills were almost the exactly the same. Nice guy for talking to me after the battle.

After that, I started practicing selecting the target for my secondaries even though they were still all auto. When I got to where it was automatic for me to pick a target. I switched all my BB Captains with enough skills to manual and extended sec. range.

To this day I have a couple still running auto but I'm selecting targets anyway.

 

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34 minutes ago, lbfreitasBR said:

It will focus on the ship you want, but with no bonuses. 

From the wiki https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Secondary_Armament:

When the preferred target is selected, a small icon (illustrated nearby) appears above its icon. Only one target can be manually selected. When a preferred target is selected, secondary guns will fire at no other target. Designating such a target provides no bonuses of any type.

Very cool to know.  So, the only reason to target a ship if you don't have MFCSA is IF you have multiple ships on one side of your ship, and none on the other (i.e to concentrate fire on one ship, rather than spread it around to all ships on your port/starboard side.)

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In my experience,

If you don't have manual 2nd skill and designate target, 2nd will shoot the target (if the target is in range) and opposite will keep shooting any closest enemy. If you target an enemy that is out of range, it will shoot at the closest and change the target when the focused target gets in range. You can try it from the training.

If you have manual 2nd skill, for USN BBs like Mass, it is effective against DD and CA, because it's accuracy increases. For BBs it will shoot at the center of the ship at close range and it won't be effective, almost useless. If you don't have manual 2nd skill for the Mass, it is effective against BBs and CAs, because of a little less accuracy, it hits supers occasionally and starts fire, but it won't hit long/mid range DDs.

For germans, the accuracy is not quite good even if you have manual 2nd skill, for me it seems like accuracy with German ship and 2nd skill is almost equal to USN non-manual 2nd skill.

 

 

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Double_Doody said:

I switched over to running manual secondaries after going one on one with a Massachusetts with a Massachusetts.

I was running auto-secondaries and my foe was running manual. 

Even though I had more main gun hits. He ate me alive. Our ship layouts and captain skills were almost the exactly the same. Nice guy for talking to me after the battle.

After that, I started practicing selecting the target for my secondaries even though they were still all auto. When I got to where it was automatic for me to pick a target. I switched all my BB Captains with enough skills to manual and extended sec. range.

To this day I have a couple still running auto but I'm selecting targets anyway.

 

If you run the same test with close range, manual 2nd won't kill you as fast, because it will focus on your main armor belt and do no damage.

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1 minute ago, TYPHOON0216 said:

If you run the same test with close range, manual 2nd won't kill you as fast, because it will focus on your main armor belt and do no damage.

True.  But I think the effect starts tapering off once the range is greater than 5-6 km or so.  At least that's what it seems like, but I haven't done a scientific test.

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1 hour ago, Skpstr said:

I take great pains to try not to end up with with ships that close on both sides lol.

Haha   well when you secondaries go out beyond 11km I get that moment once per match or so.  

 

1 hour ago, Skpstr said:

ll take it on BBs with "meh" secondaries instead of FP, because close-in DDs cause me more grief than fires. And when one does pop up 5-6km away, I don't want my secondary gunners "praying and spraying", I want that DD gone ASAP.

 I really haven't found it to make that much of a difference in testing.   Really I find it rather stupid that one side won't fire when you have manual secondaries.   Its like one of those rules some dev made up back in the day when coming up with the skills in the first place.  Then no one ever questioned it and looking at it now years later it just looks arbitrary and daft.    

 

In all brutal honesty,  I have not seen an actual good or great player recommend manual secondaries in years, I have only heard negative comments from the skilled side of the fence ( see comment below).

Edited by eviltane

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1 hour ago, eviltane said:

(unsubstantiated) For some reason I also think there is an accuracy boost though I doubt it. (unsubstantiated)

I've never seen any confirmation to this regard. IMO, there is no accuracy boost.

And yeah, when you have two ships in range on the same side, designating one makes sure your secondaries pew at it, e.g. if it's a destroyer and your secondaries are shooting a BB instead.

PS I wholeheartedly recommend manual secondaries for some brawlers, because memes > efficiency. Also, on Mass in particular, Man Sec + AFT might actually be the best build for randoms.

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1 hour ago, vak_ said:

I've never seen any confirmation to this regard. IMO, there is no accuracy boost.

And yeah, when you have two ships in range on the same side, designating one makes sure your secondaries pew at it, e.g. if it's a destroyer and your secondaries are shooting a BB instead.

PS I wholeheartedly recommend manual secondaries for some brawlers, because memes > efficiency. Also, on Mass in particular, Man Sec + AFT might actually be the best build for randoms.

Wiki was linked & quoted above in the thread...you are corect... there's no benefit of any kind other than all 2nds concentrating only on the ship you select...w/out manual 2nds skill.

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2 hours ago, eviltane said:

Haha   well when you secondaries go out beyond 11km I get that moment once per match or so.  

Good point. I don't take AFT though, because the main focus of my secondaries is dealing with DDs, and I found that, even with MFCS, the dispersion at 10+km meant that DDs were just being tickled, so to me, ot wasn't worth the 4 pts.

At 7.6-9.4km, (the range of all my MFCS ships) DDs start taking effective fire right away.

2 hours ago, eviltane said:

 I really haven't found it to make that much of a difference in testing. 

To be fair, it probably depends on the ship. I saw the biggest difference with Nagato. Charging DDs used to be the bane of my existence. Not so much now.

I don't doubt that good/great players tend not to use it, but I need the crutch lol.

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2 hours ago, TYPHOON0216 said:

In my experience,

If you don't have manual 2nd skill and designate target, 2nd will shoot the target (if the target is in range) and opposite will keep shooting any closest enemy. If you target an enemy that is out of range, it will shoot at the closest and change the target when the focused target gets in range. You can try it from the training.

If you have manual 2nd skill, for USN BBs like Mass, it is effective against DD and CA, because it's accuracy increases. For BBs it will shoot at the center of the ship at close range and it won't be effective, almost useless. If you don't have manual 2nd skill for the Mass, it is effective against BBs and CAs, because of a little less accuracy, it hits supers occasionally and starts fire, but it won't hit long/mid range DDs.

For germans, the accuracy is not quite good even if you have manual 2nd skill, for me it seems like accuracy with German ship and 2nd skill is almost equal to USN non-manual 2nd skill.

 

 

 

 

You're right. Just did the test in training room (captain without manual control) and secondaries from the opposite side kept shooting.

Tks!

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