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TheGreatBlasto

Is CE wasted on brawling BBs?

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I have the Biz, Tirp, Mass, Georgia, and Alsace. All have CE.

 

Some CC said that CE is a waste on ships that charge into the fray to get close up and personal.

 

:fish_haloween:

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In alot of playstyles & ships, CE is a waste.

I do not run it on my brawling and DPM battleships, such as GK & Yamato.

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In a way yes. If you do not share that captain with other ships, reducing your concealment to say 13km  in a BB when you play mostly closer than 12 is a waste of four captain points.

For not brawlers, with long range (e.g. Fuso), it is debatable as the moment you shoot you are seen from the moon, so you can't hide anyway.

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2 minutes ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

Man, it would cost a small fortune to respec them all for manual secondaries.

 

:Smile_sad:

On certain ships sure. French, German, and certain USN, sec spec is fine.

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For me the only ships that CE is automatic for are DD's who live and die by stealth even the gun boats when they are not gunning.

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14 minutes ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

I have the Biz, Tirp, Mass, Georgia, and Alsace. All have CE.

 

Some CC said that CE is a waste on ships that charge into the fray to get close up and personal.

 

:fish_haloween:

Maybe you should do some experiments...and free yourself from having to follow the CCs on everything...

5 minutes ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

Man, it would cost a small fortune to respec them all for manual secondaries.

 

:Smile_sad:

Take that up with WG...

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CE is pretty dead content now since cv exist, i only use conceal on a handful of dd that i barely play.

83b882824444efd03867303aa7a24dfa.png?wid

this is my chad tank build for bb and battlecruisers, pretty standard tank build with expert loader to maximise dpm when enemy ships begin to angle.

79792a07adc7e8a0f1560d1109dd44f5.png

here is my highly recommended secondary build i use on German bb and massa/georgia.

conceal just is not important anymore, cv can spot anything on the map within 15 seconds and for us damage farmers we want to be firing every chance we get so wasting 4 points on concealment is just a no brainer.

 

 

Edited by ITZ_ACE_BABY
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look it this way, in order to brawl you need to get close to the enemy, now how are you going to get close if the enemy ships see you coming from 17km  away giving them plenty of time to turn and run in the oposite direction? that being said after the CE change the concealment boost dosent make much of a diference for most BBs and large cruisers since you are still going to be spoted from far away. 

 

wish CE was -25 reduced ship detectability and -15% to maximum main guns/torpedos range, that would be something interesting to play around.

Edited by pepe_trueno

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1 hour ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

I have the Biz, Tirp, Mass, Georgia, and Alsace. All have CE.

 

Some CC said that CE is a waste on ships that charge into the fray to get close up and personal.

 

:fish_haloween:

It’s not so much that CE isn’t useful on these ships. It is, because you can use that concealment to creep closer as well as go dark when needed, because there will still be times you will need to play like a standard BB and only close in and brawl when presented with a favorable situation.

It’s more of an issue of other skills being more valuable. Basically, to run a viable secondary spec you have to sacrifice concealment or survivability to some degree. Typically you have to choose between SI and BFT as your three point skill, and at four points you can take three of the following four/five: MFCSA, AFT, FP, CE, and IFHE (questionable after the changes, and not worth it except maybe on the French 100mm). MFCSA and FP are the most valuable, IMO, so taking CE usually comes at the expense of AFT (or IFHE). Is the extra ~1.5km of concealment worth the loss of ~1.5-2km of secondary range?

The standard secondary spec I run on my German secondary BBs is PT, AR, SI, FP, MFCSA, AFT, and PM or EL, depending on the ship. Secondaries are effectively a DOT mechanic, and SI gives you an extra heal to keep all your guns firing longer, so I prefer it over BFT.

Edited by Nevermore135

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1 hour ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

I have the Biz, Tirp, Mass, Georgia, and Alsace. All have CE.

 

Some CC said that CE is a waste on ships that charge into the fray to get close up and personal.

 

:fish_haloween:

I’m in the minority because I say no, its not a waste. Plenty of times CE has helped me to retreat and heal up.

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1 hour ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

Some CC said that CE is a waste on ships that charge into the fray to get close up and personal.

To each its own, but I personally dont think it's a waste.

CE allows you to get into the brawling range more effectively to begin with, and also to disengage much more effectively. Plus you can't always charge into brawls, if you do that you'll get focused and killed fast quite often.

I run CE on Mass, Scharn, Tirpit, etc. All ManSec brawling BBs.

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 CE is GREAT on some BBS.  Nothing like creeping up to secondaries range ( practically )  and yelling SURPRISE!!

200 (2).gif

Edited by Col_Nasty
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CE even for a Brawling Battleship makes a big difference if incorporating a Stealth Build, to be able to push closer without getting spotted so far away.  It also helps defensively, when things aren't looking so good. Also remember that if you are on Fire, it adds 2km to your detection range.  So if you got some mediocre 14km+ detection range, it's going to be 16km+ while on Fire and you're going to have a difficult time breaking contact.

 

Consider Bismarck with Camo + CSM1 is 14.3km detection range.

Now that same Bismarck with CE on top of that is 12.87km.

 

Massachusetts with Camo + CSM1 is 14.46km detection range.

Massachusetts with CE on top of that is 13km.

 

 

GK with Camo + CSM1 is 15.87km.

GK with CE on top of that is 14.28km.

 

Even a Brawling Battleship still needs to control its engagements.

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So this thread cleared up nothing as far as CE use goes in a brawling BB . It seems split right down the middle with good points on both side . 

 

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I would say the points are better used elsewhere for brawlers. Ships like Bismarck would rather a secondary or fire prevention build to assist them in CQC, but I still install at least the concealment mod on them.

From experience, I find CE helpful to surprise ships with AP salvos and disengage. My favorite CE BBs are Odin, North Carolina, and Iowa. Most ships don't expect you that close, and they have almost no time to react to a well-timed shot :cap_haloween:

 

Another sidenote, but my criteria for putting CE on BBs relies on playstyle, maneuverability, and base detection.

Ex: If I have a ship with decent concealment, accurate guns, and decent speed --> CE

If the ship is slow, overly huge, has poor base concealment --> FP or AFT, MS build

I find that the German ships don't benefit as much as their detection is already so high and their guns are unreliable. Odin is the exception as she needs it to save HP and disengage.

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2 hours ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

Man, it would cost a small fortune to respec them all for manual secondaries.

 

:Smile_sad:

You don't have to respec with doubloons, there is a drop-down to use XP.

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2 hours ago, TheGreatBlasto said:

have the Biz, Tirp, Mass, Georgia, and Alsace. All have CE.

No need for GA.  Her speed substitutes well.

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Personally, I would much rather have FP than CE. When I play a brawler, it seems that fire is the biggest contributor to being destroyed. Anything I can do to help mitigate that is a win. With so many CV's in game right now I find CE somewhat useless. I have found as much, if not  more success, taking a slower more methodical approach to brawling range. Use islands as much as possible to mask your approach, and pick your ranged shots carefully accounting for gun bloom. Try to time it so that they have lost track of you until you come around that last island and your secondaries open up. Odin different with it's small hp pool and relatively squishy armor for a brawler. I would def run CE in place of FP on her.

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Adding my vote to the pile: I don't run it on my brawling battleships. I don't mind being shot at since I can usually dodge and that gets red to reveal his position.

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On 8/8/2020 at 4:43 PM, TheGreatBlasto said:

I have the Biz, Tirp, Mass, Georgia, and Alsace. All have CE.

 

Some CC said that CE is a waste on ships that charge into the fray to get close up and personal.

 

:fish_haloween:

CE is an absolute must on any BB.

Edited by Leopard_IX

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3 hours ago, SteelRain_Rifleman said:

You don't have to respec with doubloons, there is a drop-down to use XP.

Thanks, I'm sure I've seen this but have forgotten.

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