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jamesCOCOcokelet

dont see how people can defend how op cv are

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Just played rank, a CV killed our dd once we snuck around the island

and even missed on a strike with torpedo's on me, i was in a secondary spec bis and he still did most of the work on me.

He was faster than me or as fast, and fast enough to stay away from the dd.

 

the only reason i can see people saying this type of crap is not op is cause they like playing exploits. It is possible they love the game and like playing all, okay ill give them that. 

But since coming back into the game,  carriers add no enjoyment to the game for the opposite team and have too much impact on the game. What is there weakness, a lot of smart players used to say rock paper scissors.

What is it for carriers. bomb? that's it probably, only scissors can stop it, so it kills the other three. anyway, average player wont stay long in he game due to carriers, again. God i cant imagine the sub gameplay. 

Edited by jamesCOCOcokelet
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Take them out, don't bring in subs, and what remains is a game of surface combatants. DD, CA/CL, and BB with each a counter. Great, huh? Pipe dream...

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Isn't there the same amount on both sides? I don't play randoms anymore, but at least I wouldn't cry every time there were CVs present. The other team has the same amount of them except in clans where you choose your ships. If you decide to play random battles just accept it and play accordingly to your best ability. Then you can go to the next battle. Don't ever put your heart and soul into a battle, accept fate and move on, it's not real.

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They ruined surface warfare in real life too. WG was smoking crack when they thought they would be balanced in a game.  Instead, they intentionally nerf ships AA further so the casual mouth breather can strike you for 6K with impunity. 

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11 hours ago, jamesCOCOcokelet said:

Just played rank, a CV killed our dd once we snuck around the island

and even missed on a strike with torpedo's on me, i was in a secondary spec bis and he still did most of the work on me.

He was faster than me or as fast, and fast enough to stay away from the dd.

 

the only reason i can see people saying this type of crap is not op is cause they like playing exploits. It is possible they love the game and like playing all, okay ill give them that. 

But since coming back into the game,  carriers add no enjoyment to the game for the opposite team and have too much impact on the game. What is there weakness, a lot of smart players used to say rock paper scissors.

What is it for carriers. bomb? that's it probably, only scissors can stop it, so it kills the other three. anyway, average player wont stay long in he game due to carriers, again. God i cant imagine the sub gameplay. 

Only people who think CVs are not OP are less skilled players. You would be hard pressed to find someone who thinks they are balanced at the Unicum level.

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On 7/30/2020 at 9:58 PM, jamesCOCOcokelet said:

Just played rank, a CV killed our dd once we snuck around the island

and even missed on a strike with torpedo's on me, i was in a secondary spec bis and he still did most of the work on me.

He was faster than me or as fast, and fast enough to stay away from the dd.

 

the only reason i can see people saying this type of crap is not op is cause they like playing exploits. It is possible they love the game and like playing all, okay ill give them that. 

But since coming back into the game,  carriers add no enjoyment to the game for the opposite team and have too much impact on the game. What is there weakness, a lot of smart players used to say rock paper scissors.

What is it for carriers. bomb? that's it probably, only scissors can stop it, so it kills the other three. anyway, average player wont stay long in he game due to carriers, again. God i cant imagine the sub gameplay. 

I'm not a pro CV player or a pro in anything else for a fact, but i am average and you know what ? CVs are hard to balance because the skill wall to get into them is not purely of tactics, its skill wall is of strategic thinking and minor tactical maneuvers in planes along with good decision making regarding risk reward and trade off of damage vs team support, the place they are in now, its not great but they aren't op, only pro players make them op  and that's because the skill wall vs skill floor is comparing the penthouse to the first floor of the Chrysler building. There simply  is no comparison due to the sheer distance and ability to perfect you can do in carriers.  I agree that they are somewhat overpowered, i would buff AA type ships like Atlanta and Wooster and the others, that's quite an atrocity the way they are now. But they screw up surface combat in game because they did in real life. the Bismark worked horribly in real life, but in  game its a monster when their aren't he spam cruisers. In a game some things are changed and some are kept the same. I think carriers aren't the problem right now, AA is. I think if you could buff AA to ships designed specifically for it, like what i mentioned earlier and left aa the same for the normal ships, hindy, yamato, italians, germans, britsih and other ships. AA is like a commodity, you trade firepower to get some, and you trade more firepower for an asset that is only useful when a CV is around, but when it is its a hammer of god. The problem isnt cv balancing itself, its that CVs, the moment they used float plane carriers in the battle of Jutland, they screwed up surface warfare rules, stealth dose'nt exist now, only the flight time of a plane does. You can only hope to fix cv's and tighten the skill gap along with kingmaker AA good on exclusively AA focused ships. AA cruisers, AA destroyers, american ships, enemy carriers. The way it is, carriers are like a duck, real surface combat slides off them, they can spot, damage, destroy and annihilate the piece of bread they want from across the pond but they are unstable and can be countered by someone throwing a rock (aa) in its general direction messing up its flight plan. And wargaming, their warships division has invested in these ducks to their zoo, the game, and these ducks they ruin their little fights, the ducks screw up and utterly destroy the narrative of firepower spotting armor, they ruin spotting making destroyers useless, making cruisers more important making he spam more potent and killing the turtles that are battleships. In the end people defend carriers because  what else could they do ? Wargaming invested heavily in a re work and the same problem emerged from before, SKILL FLOOR TOO HIGH, STALL STALL STALL, PULL DOWN [edited] [edited] [edited]!!!

If the rework that cost them probably half a million didn't work, what can, NOTHING, nothing but AA reworking for individual ships game wide could fix the problem, and they wont do that, which was our best option to make carriers balanced make individual ships that were good with AA as good as before or better so that dodging is harder and making them a no fly zone a strategic and tactical advantage for their team and teammates, somewhat balancing carriers in a game with them, but otherwise we have a constant struggle with cv's being overpowered or AA being used by every ship and having it be able to throw the game across the board against carriers.

Tl:DR Carriers are impossible to properly balance due to their strategic and tactical influence and screwing up stealth and their skill gap from skill floor to skill penthouse ceiling. An AA re balance game wide on each individual ship so that good aa is exclusive to certain ships, but  that make them death stars and making AA for average ships good if they get close enough for squad firepower. Wargaming has invested too much to straight up remove carriers and you have to live with it and try to get them to re balance AA.

 

Thanks for reading

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2 hours ago, EraserNZ1 said:

99% of people that defend cv's have really bad stats and have no clue how to play the game let alone know how balanced or good something is for the game.

Untill people stop spending money in game WG will not do anything drastic to balance them.

99% of statistics apparently are made up on the spot.

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Right their a lot of dumb DD BB players out there also that get rekt easily yet they blame CV :Smile_amazed: Could be it maybe you just need to get good :Smile_teethhappy: Also do you see CVs going into the DD forums section spreading salt when they get rekt by DDs :Smile_popcorn:Example of dumb DD player going into smoke staying in the same spot also a dumb move firing while in smoke giving your position away not turning off AA while in smoke as well :Smile_facepalm: I suck at DDs yet even I know this but apparently some tough guy DD players don't know this :fish_palm:

Edited by LastRemnant

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3 hours ago, LastRemnant said:

Right their a lot of dumb DD BB players out there also that get rekt easily yet they blame CV :Smile_amazed: Could be it maybe you just need to get good :Smile_teethhappy: Also do you see CVs going into the DD forums section spreading salt when they get rekt by DDs :Smile_popcorn:Example of dumb DD player going into smoke staying in the same spot also a dumb move firing while in smoke giving your position away not turning off AA while in smoke as well :Smile_facepalm: I suck at DDs yet even I know this but apparently some tough guy DD players don't know this :fish_palm:

Yes, someone who understands, most people in the game are mediocre most of the time, myself included.  We CV mains are the most likely to look at the game as a stragetic game of chess, next to non German ( On certain occasions, but having brawling ability makes it more tactical than strategic to play)  bb players, we are strategists, we think of the game in the long run, except graf zeppelin players, they are entirely tactical in my opinion, they know how to smack down cruisers with secondarys for gods sake. We rely on looking at the map like a board of chess where the pieces say screw you to our opinions and strategies most of the time and we only have the power to screw with the enemy ships in the form of showing them for our allys to kill and  dropping small care packages on them that do moderate to non existent damage if we are lucky. But we don't risk anything to get to it. We defend cv's because they are on another levle of play, we play chess not checkers. less so now as we have less raw firepower to put into play and less ability to do anything but kill destroyers and light cruisers precisely because they nerfed our ability to hit heavier ships. If all dd players were awesome gamer people and knew how every gun every torpedo every strategy worked, we would have a much harder time and would be near useless besides spotting from afar and being bored. Its not that the class is inherently op, its the people that play it.

Edited by Penguinattack27
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12 hours ago, LastRemnant said:

Right their a lot of dumb DD BB players out there also that get rekt easily yet they blame CV :Smile_amazed: Could be it maybe you just need to get good :Smile_teethhappy: Also do you see CVs going into the DD forums section spreading salt when they get rekt by DDs :Smile_popcorn:Example of dumb DD player going into smoke staying in the same spot also a dumb move firing while in smoke giving your position away not turning off AA while in smoke as well :Smile_facepalm: I suck at DDs yet even I know this but apparently some tough guy DD players don't know this :fish_palm:

 

9 hours ago, Penguinattack27 said:

Yes, someone who understands, most people in the game are mediocre most of the time, myself included.  We CV mains are the most likely to look at the game as a stragetic game of chess, next to non German ( On certain occasions, but having brawling ability makes it more tactical than strategic to play)  bb players, we are strategists, we think of the game in the long run, except graf zeppelin players, they are entirely tactical in my opinion, they know how to smack down cruisers with secondarys for gods sake. We rely on looking at the map like a board of chess where the pieces say screw you to our opinions and strategies most of the time and we only have the power to screw with the enemy ships in the form of showing them for our allys to kill and  dropping small care packages on them that do moderate to non existent damage if we are lucky. But we don't risk anything to get to it. We defend cv's because they are on another levle of play, we play chess not checkers. less so now as we have less raw firepower to put into play and less ability to do anything but kill destroyers and light cruisers precisely because they nerfed our ability to hit heavier ships. If all dd players were awesome gamer people and knew how every gun every torpedo every strategy worked, we would have a much harder time and would be near useless besides spotting from afar and being bored. Its not that the class is inherently op, its the people that play it.

Good posts.

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