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Dr_Venture

German AP Rockets - discuss

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I've been struggling to make the AP rockets really shine here. Mainly the planes themselves are fragile and even the slightest turn from the target makes them almost worthless. I've honestly hit ships in the side for five citadels for like...5k damage...which tbh is kinda bad. 

Cruisers the higher you go can dodge torpedos and ap bombers pretty easily if they have half a brain. The AP rocket in my mind is the go to weapon, yet...the damage again...terrible...easy to mitigate. 

The German CV is forced to rely on the torpedo plane more than ever in this situation. I recently had a fight where I focused on torp bombers 1st, ap bombers second, rockets last. 

I've seen a few people go after weak bow armor on BB's and cruisers to really get them to work...but again...slight turn and the drop is wasted. 

Manfred von Richthofen is still in testing, and rightly so because the AP rockets are trash against most if not all targets.

I'm curious what other people are doing to make this work?

Or we can just mount the GZ rocket planes for the line as an additional research module and just ignore this whole topic. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werfer-Granate_21

image.thumb.png.51fc3b295b83e774d76e21d5aed88f90.png

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The AP rockets are over tuned in my opinion. One tier down and they devastate cruisers. One tier up and they are 100% useles from a Parseval perspective. Need improved penetration angles to bridge this huge gap between tiers. It's really too bad because I really wanted this ship to be viable in ranked. Its not just sub optimal Its not viable at all.

Edited by Ban_CV_Complainers

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 Find a mountain, the mountain is your friend. 

But seriously now, I still haven't had the chance to personally drop a load yet, so I'm guessing those AP missiles aren't meant for DDs but rather CLs and maybe CAs instead. The double AP system is probably problematic, but maybe the speed of the missiles are supposed to compensate somehow. 

Oh and side note, I tried this same tactic on USN missile bombers and it works there too, just not at 15km range...we're looking more at 7 km range which is still enough to be outside of AA pockets.  

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5 minutes ago, Ban_CV_Complainers said:

The AP rockets are over tuned in my opinion. One tier down and they devastate cruisers. One tier up and they are 100% useles from a Parseval perspective. Need improved penetration angles to bridge this huge gap between tiers. It's really too bad because I really wanted this ship to be viable in ranked. Its not just sub optimal Its not viable at all.

I've ground out Lexington, and the Shōkaku...and with Parseval....I'd take the other two before Parseval. The rocket planes are too much of a liability to ignore IMHO. You need to be able to do consistent damage and you just can't do it with the German AP rockets. 

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3 minutes ago, Roken1 said:

 Find a mountain, the mountain is your friend. 

But seriously now, I still haven't had the chance to personally drop a load yet, so I'm guessing those AP missiles aren't meant for DDs but rather CLs and maybe CAs instead. The double AP system is probably problematic, but maybe the speed of the missiles are supposed to compensate somehow. 

Oh and side note, I tried this same tactic on USN missile bombers and it works there too, just not at 15km range...we're looking more at 7 km range which is still enough to be outside of AA pockets.  

I've literally hit a Baltimore in the side for 5 citadels and done 5k damage. It's honestly not that great tbh. 

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8 minutes ago, Ban_CV_Complainers said:

The AP rockets are over tuned in my opinion. One tier down and they devastate cruisers. One tier up and they are 100% useles from a Parseval perspective. Need improved penetration angles to bridge this huge gap between tiers. It's really too bad because I really wanted this ship to be viable in ranked. Its not just sub optimal Its not viable at all.

I just picked up the Weser from the missions.  I don't play CVs, but took it in to a training room and tried it against a few T5 cruisers and it just ripped them in half.  I know, training room.  I was just looking to get an idea of what they could do.

I need to try tier 6 next.

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1 minute ago, DrHolmes52 said:

I just picked up the Weser from the missions.  I don't play CVs, but took it in to a training room and tried it against a few T5 cruisers and it just ripped them in half.  I know, training room.  I was just looking to get an idea of what they could do.

I need to try tier 6 next.

The higher you go, the worse they get. I'm honestly hoping the Tier 10 can do serious damage to a cruiser that gets caught in the side. Tier 8 just struggles. 

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7 minutes ago, Dr_Venture said:

The higher you go, the worse they get. I'm honestly hoping the Tier 10 can do serious damage to a cruiser that gets caught in the side. Tier 8 just struggles. 

Was in a game earlier in my Seattle and someone had the tier 10 German CV. He took me down to half HP with one rocket volley. I'd say in the right hands they will punish the heck out of people.

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Just now, Colonel_Potter said:

Was in a game earlier in my Seattle and someone had the tier 10 German CV. He took me down to half HP with one rocket volley. I'd say in the right hands they will punish the heck out of people.

 

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15 minutes ago, Dr_Venture said:

I've literally hit a Baltimore in the side for 5 citadels and done 5k damage. It's honestly not that great tbh. 

I recall getting some 10-14K drops on broadside T10 CLs and a Baltimore so far in the T8 German CV.  Overall it is easily mitigated by CLs as they have 10 second rudders that easily counter the drop i have to start 5-7kms out since the radical is so far out if front of the planes.

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25 minutes ago, AdmiralThunder said:

reticule absolutely SUCKS 

For me, it comes down to this. I can't tell you how good the rockets are, because the behaviour of the reticle and its contrast/visibility against the water (because the trajectory is flat) make it too difficult to hit anything consistently.

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maybe we should just get rid of all the rocket planes just to make it even. I vote yes right now

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Fix the reticle on the rockets and dive bombers and then we can talk.

Until then the farthest I'll go is the Wesser and that German trash boat will be a port queen.

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They suck plain and simple. They can theoretically do good damage but they basically require the target to just sit there broadside on top of a favorable RNG roll. Even the slightest angle basically neuters them.

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8 minutes ago, Jitta77 said:

I recall getting some 10-14K drops on broadside T10 CLs and a Baltimore so far in the T8 German CV.  Overall it is easily mitigated by CLs as they have 10 second rudders that easily counter the drop i have to start 5-7kms out since the radical is so far out if front of the planes.

No, you don't have to to start anywhere near that far out.  You can start the drop as close as 3km, to be comfortable its ~3.5km.  With a little more practice you'll get it down.

 

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Fooling around with VIII Von Parseval in PVE, the Attack Planes / Rockets are very finicky.  Get a good broadside and they'll do well.

A Co-op game catching a VI Nurnberg and VIII Hipper on the sides.

I didn't have a problem with the reticle for the Attack Planes.  What I did have a problem was that as soon as the Cruiser target is angled, the fancy Citadel strikes just evaporate.  You'll ricochet, bounce, etc.  What I was doing in Co-op getting those Citadel hits is fine against dumb bots that refuse to protect themselves, but it's going to be a completely different matter against a player.

 

The other new German CV I have is IV Rhein.  It's the same story.  She's very effective against the poorly armored Cruisers in the Tier IV MM bracket but again, it demands straight broadside attack runs.  Fine in PVE when the bots are just sailing stupid, but players would be a different matter, I imagine. Also, Rhein's AP rockets can Citadel other Tier IV CVs.  Von Parseval in Tier VIII?  I haven't been able to do that against other CVs.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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I would take HE rockets, similar to GZ ones, over the current AP rockets any day. They are much more versatile.

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1 minute ago, brpas said:

I would take HE rockets, similar to GZ ones, over the current AP rockets any day. They are much more versatile.

IMHO that was probably the reason they went AP rocket route. - Too useful, and too many people complained. 

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All the other CV Rockets do more damage to ships than the German AP rockets. If the AP rockets are the norm, then they really need to nerf all the other CV's HE rockets.

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Just now, Dr_Venture said:

IMHO that was probably the reason they went AP rocket route. - Too useful, and too many people complained. 

Yeah. Also, keep in mind that we are talking about german CVs. German ships can't go above average, haha! Let's wait for the russian CVs...

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1 minute ago, Gemlin said:

All the other CV Rockets do more damage to ships than the German AP rockets. If the AP rockets are the norm, then they really need to nerf all the other CV's HE rockets.

Or they need to add ammo change type actions to rockets and bombers so that all CVs have options to swap to the "correct ammo type for the job/mission" instead of locking CVs into ammo type gimmicks. 

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Well one of the benefits of them is that they make cruisers turn like mad.

I was in Weser engaging a full HP Leander. In its effort to evade eating the rockets they instead ate a full hot load from a Texas. Insta deleted.

Let's face it though, they are like the Euro DDs. They don't want CVs touching up DDs any longer.

Edited by Sumseaman

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34 minutes ago, Dr_Venture said:

IMHO that was probably the reason they went AP rocket route. - Too useful, and too many people complained. 

This is too far in the other direction. They are basically useless against anything other than potato cruisers. Once people realize that the pen angles on these suck and that even a slight angle defeats them they won't even be useful there.

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Who knows.

Haven’t drawn a mission yet. Never mind actually completing one.

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