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Whitebuster

German CVs build

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Do you have any suggestions for the optimal equipment and captain skills for German CVs (aircraft carriers)?

Thanks in advance

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Secondaries. 

 

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My current build. Consider swapping out concealment mod 1 for squadron consumables mod 1 because its fun having 20 second engine boost consumables.

image.thumb.png.e2c8d18999f97dc6f27a1e73346542b6.png

 

image.thumb.png.7b422258f071861517c0def388f6d3d8.png

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Same gear and skills as you would put on any IJN CV.

The planes are fragile, so max aircraft durability and speed.

Use modules to improve whatever your aircraft of choice is.

That's about it, they don't need IFHE or anything special, and like all CV's, they shouldn't take torpedo acceleration.

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Here mine with the Capt that gonna sit on top of the Richtofen !

 

 

shot-20.07.08_17.58.40-0346.jpg

Edited by dad003
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Last Gasp, Air Superiority, Improved Engine Boost (1 pts)
Torpedo Acceleration, Improved Engines (2 pts)
Aircraft Armor, Survivability Expert (3pts)
Concealment Expert (4 pts)

This leaves you with two points to spend as you wish. You do NOT need Sight Stabilization as your planes already aim quickly.

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1 hour ago, Whitebuster said:

Do you have any suggestions for the optimal equipment and captain skills for German CVs?

Thanks in advance

The Tier-4 Rhein and Tier-6 Weser don't have enough secondary battery guns for a full-on Graf Zeppelin meme-build.
But the Tier-8 August Parseval and Tier-10 Manfred Von Richtofen do have enough guns to make it worthwhile.

I suggest the following skills for a "CV build"
Tier-1 = Improved Engine Boost
Tier-2 = Your choice of "Last Stand" (so you won't be 'dead in the water'),  Improved Engines, Torpedo Acceleration
Tier-3 = Aircraft Armor and Survivability Expert.  These are "must have" skills to improve the chances of the planes survival while inside AA Flak bubbles.
Tier-4 = Concealment Expert

Leftover skill points, if any, can be spent on Air Supremacy and Direction Center For Fighters or Last Gasp

A secondary battery build would add in the Tier-4 Skill of Advanced Firing Training.  If there are spare points, then Basic Firing Training could be added.  At some point, the skills add up to 19 points.  But most Captain's only have 10 or less to work with.

Here's my Graf Zeppelin Captain's Skills
shot-20_07.22_23_46.16-0779.thumb.jpg.984582b1822040f3d1ae0d0bd548c40a.jpg

Edited to add my Rhein's Captain Skills
shot-20_07.22_23_57.36-0087.thumb.jpg.d61de33f785f16dec7a42b511e35d631.jpg

Edited by Wolfswetpaws
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5 minutes ago, I_Cant_Hiryu said:

Last Gasp, Air Superiority, Improved Engine Boost (1 pts)
Torpedo Acceleration, Improved Engines (2 pts)
Aircraft Armor, Survivability Expert (3pts)
Concealment Expert (4 pts)

This leaves you with two points to spend as you wish. You do NOT need Sight Stabilization as your planes already aim quickly.

Is concealment that necessary? I chose Sight Stabilization to help target DDs on the second pass with torps.

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4 minutes ago, Merc_R_Us said:

Is concealment that necessary? I chose Sight Stabilization to help target DDs on the second pass with torps.

There are ships that can *blap* another ship from 20 km away or further.  If a CV is detected, it becomes a priority target.
Reducing the detection radius improves the CV's chances of survival and reduces the plane's detection radius, too.  

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19 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

There are ships that can *blap* another ship from 20 km away or further.  If a CV is detected, it becomes a priority target.
Reducing the detection radius improves the CV's chances of survival and reduces the plane's detection radius, too.  

True true.

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45 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Tier-6 Weser don't have enough secondary battery guns for a full-on Graf Zeppelin meme-build.
 

?

Rhein, yes. But Weser? :Smile_amazed:

Weser has a total of ten 105mm guns. Parceval has twelve. I don't think having two less is a grounds for saying that she does not have enough guns. :Smile_amazed:

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Also, concealment means your fast planes are on top of enemies that much faster, giving them less chance to turn or launch catapult fighters.

Air Superiority, Improved Engines, Aircraft Armor, Concealment are the core.

That leaves 9 to play with (or 13 if you don't want concealment or if one of the line doesn't benefit well from it. I only have the GZ and the Rhein, and recommend it there).

I run AFT, BFT, Adrenaline Rush. On the GZ because I brawl with it, on the Rhein because the AA buffs matter more when you're the only ship with AA (and because survivability expert doesn't do as much down there, and its planes seem less fragile).

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6 hours ago, Blorgh2017 said:

?

Rhein, yes. But Weser? :Smile_amazed:

Weser has a total of ten 105mm guns. Parceval has twelve. I don't think having two less is a grounds for saying that she does not have enough guns. :Smile_amazed:

Thanks.  When I previously looked at the wiki stats, I focused on the "5" and forgot to do the math for the "5 x 2" = 10.  :-)

So, with a 20% range increase from Auxiliary Armaments module, the range could be extended to (5 km x 1.2) = 6 km.
Getting Advanced Firing Training skill for the Captain would further increase the firing range by 20%.  So, (6 km x 1.2 ) = 7.2 km

At Tier-6, that is very respectable.

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Weser

Edited to add:

But, at Tier-6, it is the Erich Loewenhardt that really makes a secondary-battery meme build worth it.
150 mm L/55 MLC/36    8 х 2 pcs.
105 mm L/65 Dop. L. C/31    5 х 2 pcs.


https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Erich_Loewenhardt

Edited by Wolfswetpaws

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@Wolfswetpaws, a couple of questions/points.

1) Why Last Stand?

2) At the moment, the Loewenhardt as is described in port by CCs (which they are allowed to do) has HE bombs. It occurs to me that the optimal captain for this build WOULD include demolition expert, unlike any of the others - and it might enhance the secondaries as well. 

3) If you wanted to go full meme and drop a secondary-spec captain into the two premium for last-ditch defence or trolling CV-hunter divs, remember that MFCS doesn't work anywhere near as well at Tier 6 as Tier 8.

4) Taking Aircraft Armour, Survivability Expert AND Concealment Expert requires a 13 point build. In which order do you take these skills, assuming you have a 10 pointer to start with and must build them up. I have the two that I got with the Odin and the Duplicate Graf Spee; one will go in the Weser, which I currently have, and the other in the Parseval when I get her. My Rhein is now redundant and will never be played outside of co-op.

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7 hours ago, Blorgh2017 said:

?

Rhein, yes. But Weser? :Smile_amazed:

Weser has a total of ten 105mm guns. Parceval has twelve. I don't think having two less is a grounds for saying that she does not have enough guns. :Smile_amazed:

i am still mad becouse of how few secondary guns they got, Instead of creating a line like the GZ that was actualy planned with it monster secondary guns array they give us a bunch of carriers with 2x2 / 2x3 small ones :Smile-angry:  

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17 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

@Wolfswetpaws, a couple of questions/points.

1) Why Last Stand?

2) At the moment, the Loewenhardt as is described in port by CCs (which they are allowed to do) has HE bombs. It occurs to me that the optimal captain for this build WOULD include demolition expert, unlike any of the others - and it might enhance the secondaries as well. 

3) If you wanted to go full meme and drop a secondary-spec captain into the two premium for last-ditch defence or trolling CV-hunter divs, remember that MFCS doesn't work anywhere near as well at Tier 6 as Tier 8.

4) Taking Aircraft Armour, Survivability Expert AND Concealment Expert requires a 13 point build. In which order do you take these skills, assuming you have a 10 pointer to start with and must build them up. I have the two that I got with the Odin and the Duplicate Graf Spee; one will go in the Weser, which I currently have, and the other in the Parseval when I get her. My Rhein is now redundant and will never be played outside of co-op.

1.  My CV's sail close to the action sometimes, and on occasion have been hit by gun fire from BB's Cruisers, DD's and even other CV's.  I sank a Lexington with my Shokaku in a 1 vs. 1 Ranked sprint battle.
So, the chances of *me* and *my ships* getting their engines or steering incapacitated are worth the two skill points.  I can live without the increased cruising speed for aircraft, and slower planes turn tighter anyway.  Being dead in the water is not acceptable.  :-)

2.  If the CV has HE bombs, then Demolition Expert becomes a nice option.  :-)

3.  Agreed.  Manual Fire Control for Secondary-batteries doesn't become effective until Tier-7.

4.  Aircraft Armor shaves 10% off of incoming AA damage to planes.  Survivability Expert increases the HP (before getting shot at) by 350 HP per tier of the ship and 25 hp per tier of the plane. 
These are core skills, in my opinion, for any CV build. 
One could live without one of the three (SE, A-A, CE,) for a while, especially at Tier-4 and probably Tier-6.  But at Tier-8 the range of opposing guns increases significantly and the chances of the CV's hull getting targeted increase.
Of the three, if I was short on skill points, I would live without Concealment Expert until I could get it.  At Tier-8 and up, a player may be spending Free-XP (or even buying it with doubloons) to increase the skill points for a Captain.

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40 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

@Wolfswetpaws, a couple of questions/points.

...

...assuming you have a 10 pointer to start with and must build them up.

Here's my 10-point Captain's Skills for my Rhein
shot-20_07.22_23_57.36-0087.thumb.jpg.095a744585f2986561925509af4eb0c7.jpg

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13 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Of the three, if I was short on skill points, I would live without Concealment Expert until I could get it. 

That's what I was after. Thanks.

If I end up grabbing a few extra dubs to get myself the Kaga, I will probably take CE first. As I learned last time I rented her, the stealth of those planes is very close to their torpedo range and surprise attacks are possible.

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30 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

That's what I was after. Thanks.

If I end up grabbing a few extra dubs to get myself the Kaga, I will probably take CE first. As I learned last time I rented her, the stealth of those planes is very close to their torpedo range and surprise attacks are possible.

[Wolfswetpaws]  "Adjutant."
[Herbert Laue]  "Alpha?"
[Wolfswetpaws]  "Gunzo Chihaya is in command of the Kaga, pending the arrival of a suitable submarine for him to command.  After some correspondence with @Ensign_Cthulhu, I'm curious about a capability to aerial attack from stealth.  Bring me Gunzo's personnel file, please."
[Herbert Laue]  "At once."



 

 

Edited by Wolfswetpaws

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33 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

That's what I was after. Thanks.

If I end up grabbing a few extra dubs to get myself the Kaga, I will probably take CE first. As I learned last time I rented her, the stealth of those planes is very close to their torpedo range and surprise attacks are possible.

 

6 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

[Wolfswetpaws]  "Adjutant."
[Herbert Laue]  "Alpha?"
[Wolfswetpaws]  "Gunzo Chihaya is in command of the Kaga, pending the arrival of a suitable submarine for him to command.  After some correspondence with @Ensign_Cthulhu, I'm curious about a capability to aerial attack from stealth.  Bring me Gunzo's personnel file, please."
[Herbert Laue]  "At once."
 

[Wolfswetpaws]  "Hmmm.  Not enough skill points currently available for adding Concealment Expert.  Gonna have to live without it for a while."

shot-20_07.23_09_22.49-0768.thumb.jpg.d6afc73fd829570a80c83592a365d6fc.jpg

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1 hour ago, pepe_trueno said:

i am still mad becouse of how few secondary guns they got, Instead of creating a line like the GZ that was actualy planned with it monster secondary guns array they give us a bunch of carriers with 2x2 / 2x3 small ones :Smile-angry:  

It's still a respectable suite of secondaries that are good as a DD repellent, when you specc for it. GZ's secondaries are awesome, being able to tackle just about anything, but in exchange her planes are pretty lackluster. The tech tree German CV's suffer less from this problem, as their planes aren't as bad as GZ's... rather they're just very wonky to use. Still, you can set fires with the 105mm pop guns of the tech tree German CV's just fine, on a non-DD target, should you choose.

That's just me though, as YMMV.

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12 hours ago, Ban_CV_Complainers said:

My current build. Consider swapping out concealment mod 1 for squadron consumables mod 1 because its fun having 20 second engine boost consumables.

image.thumb.png.e2c8d18999f97dc6f27a1e73346542b6.png

 

image.thumb.png.7b422258f071861517c0def388f6d3d8.png

Would it be worth it to swap out secondary battery modification at slot 3 for any aircraft-related upgrade options?

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22 minutes ago, Whitebuster said:

Would it be worth it to swap out secondary battery modification at slot 3 for any aircraft-related upgrade options?

Only if you intend to stay out of harm's way.
If you plan on getting in to secondary-battery clashes ( "sail me closer, I want to hit them with my sword" ), then having the range of secondary batteries maxed out for performance makes sense.

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2 hours ago, Blorgh2017 said:

It's still a respectable suite of secondaries that are good as a DD repellent, when you specc for it. GZ's secondaries are awesome, being able to tackle just about anything, but in exchange her planes are pretty lackluster. The tech tree German CV's suffer less from this problem, as their planes aren't as bad as GZ's... rather they're just very wonky to use. Still, you can set fires with the 105mm pop guns of the tech tree German CV's just fine, on a non-DD target, should you choose.

That's just me though, as YMMV.

I would honestly disagree. GZ has 2/3 squadrons better than the tree ships(we don't talk about her AP bombers though).  Hell, her TB squads are pretty much straight upgrades from the T10's.

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Can't wait to test these builds once I finally get my hands on some of these...and the mountain 7km missile bombing runs...

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