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Merc_R_Us

Move over American AA! Petropavlovsk & and Al Nevsky in the building!

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Countless posts about CV OP. I get it. But CV players, can we talk about how powerful these Russian Ships are at AA? The AA power is incredible or is it just me?

If you want to punish CVs, get these ships!

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Let me guess... magical extra range on roughly the same-size guns, because Russian?  

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Their AA is not bad, but I still easily manage to dumpster Nevsky's pretty easily, so I'd give it's AA a solid 7/10, not useless but not Halland.

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AA is getting stronger on all the post CV rework lines. I think Wargaming realizes that AA is not balanced after the CV rework. They will never admit it, but I think it is obvious considering how AA has gotten stronger on all these new lines.

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Just now, custer_14 said:

AA is getting stronger on all the post CV rework lines. I think Wargaming realizes that AA is not balanced after the CV rework. They will never admit it, but I think it is obvious considering how AA has gotten stronger on all these new lines.

That's just a marketing gimmick to get you to into the new ships. 

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4 minutes ago, exray0 said:

That's just a marketing gimmick to get you to into the new ships. 

 

They really just need to implement manual AA on these Cruisers and Battleships. Where they say they can't do anything, in a CV chair your thinking "they don't have to anything, it's all auto aiming auto damage all day"

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29 minutes ago, Merc_R_Us said:

Countless posts about CV OP. I get it. But CV players, can we talk about how powerful these Russian Ships are at AA? The AA power is incredible or is it just me?

If you want to punish CVs, get these ships!

 

27 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Let me guess... magical extra range on roughly the same-size guns, because Russian?  

 

3 minutes ago, custer_14 said:

AA is getting stronger on all the post CV rework lines. I think Wargaming realizes that AA is not balanced after the CV rework. They will never admit it, but I think it is obvious considering how AA has gotten stronger on all these new lines.

 

2 minutes ago, exray0 said:

That's just a marketing gimmick to get you to into the new ships. 

The misinformation is strong on these boards.  It's up to people like me to keep you guys in check.

 

TLDR:  The best of the new RU Cruisers' AA is good, but overall USN Cruiser AA is still better.

 

Tier X RU CA Petropavlovsk AA

1eHzCgZ.jpg

Tier X USN CA Des Memes AA

4uMXZ31.jpg

 

Petropavlovsk's AA will on first glance seem to have superior AA.  Her AA range goes out to 6.6km while Des Moines is 5.8km max.  But once you get past Petropavlovsk's long range flak, she starts to falter.  And do recall that savvy CV players know how to evade flak.  Her Medium AA is all she has left once you're past the flak, and even then the AA DPS left is pretty bad.

Des Moines doesn't have that long range Petro AA, but her AA suite is far more complete.  The Medium AA is fierce, almost twice the DPS of Petro, and when you get closer, you now start having the Near AA DPS piling on top of that.

 

Tier X USN CL Worcester AA

E00zIfq.jpg

Tier X RU CL Alexander Nevsky AA

HM63lrm.jpg

Ranges are identical now between the two CLs.  Nevsky repeats Petro's pattern in strong long range AA but once you get past the flak, the AA gets considerably weaker.

Worcester's AA is just straight up nastier all around.  Her Medium and Near AA DPS is the best of all 4 of these Cruisers.

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6 minutes ago, Merc_R_Us said:

They really just need to implement manual AA on these Cruisers and Battleships.

So all those AA gunners just sit there waiting for someone to tell them to shoot at the incoming planes?

Secondaries shoot without any player input.

Side note: Just remembered another of those "only in the WG universe" things. In game, guns have a set rate of fire and turret turn speed.  Changing from AP to HE takes a reload cycle. However, DP guns can somehow engage both surface and air targets simultaneously on opposite sides of the ship. Not asking for changes. Just an observation.

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16 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

 

 

 

The misinformation is strong on these boards.  It's up to people like me to keep you guys in check.

 

TLDR:  The best of the new RU Cruisers' AA is good, but overall USN Cruiser AA is still better.

 

Tier X RU CA Petropavlovsk AA

1eHzCgZ.jpg

Tier X USN CA Des Memes AA

4uMXZ31.jpg

 

Petropavlovsk's AA will on first glance seem to have superior AA.  Her AA range goes out to 6.6km while Des Moines is 5.8km max.  But once you get past Petropavlovsk's long range flak, she starts to falter.  And do recall that savvy CV players know how to evade flak.  Her Medium AA is all she has left once you're past the flak, and even then the AA DPS left is pretty bad.

Des Moines doesn't have that long range Petro AA, but her AA suite is far more complete.  The Medium AA is fierce, almost twice the DPS of Petro, and when you get closer, you now start having the Near AA DPS piling on top of that.

 

I'm not certain how this makes my comment about the magical range boost for RU AA despite being nearly the same size guns "misinformation" (RU 130mm vs US 127mm DP secondaries). 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

 

I'm not certain how this makes my comment about the magical range boost for RU AA despite being nearly the same size guns "misinformation" (RU 130mm vs US 127mm DP secondaries). 

 

 

It's all part of the clowns around here proclaiming something is OP, making all else obsolete because it is simply Russian.

And the facts presented disprove that.

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37 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

 

 

 

The misinformation is strong on these boards.  It's up to people like me to keep you guys in check.

 

TLDR:  The best of the new RU Cruisers' AA is good, but overall USN Cruiser AA is still better.

 

Tier X RU CA Petropavlovsk AA

1eHzCgZ.jpg

Tier X USN CA Des Memes AA

4uMXZ31.jpg

 

Petropavlovsk's AA will on first glance seem to have superior AA.  Her AA range goes out to 6.6km while Des Moines is 5.8km max.  But once you get past Petropavlovsk's long range flak, she starts to falter.  And do recall that savvy CV players know how to evade flak.  Her Medium AA is all she has left once you're past the flak, and even then the AA DPS left is pretty bad.

Des Moines doesn't have that long range Petro AA, but her AA suite is far more complete.  The Medium AA is fierce, almost twice the DPS of Petro, and when you get closer, you now start having the Near AA DPS piling on top of that.

 

Tier X USN CL Worcester AA

E00zIfq.jpg

Tier X RU CL Alexander Nevsky AA

HM63lrm.jpg

Ranges are identical now between the two CLs.  Nevsky repeats Petro's pattern in strong long range AA but once you get past the flak, the AA gets considerably weaker.

Worcester's AA is just straight up nastier all around.  Her Medium and Near AA DPS is the best of all 4 of these Cruisers.

Don't forget Minotaur and Goliath ( okay, maybe not Goliath )

-Shrayes

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9 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

It's all part of the clowns around here proclaiming something is OP, making all else obsolete because it is simply Russian.

And the facts presented disprove that.

Welp, thanks for lumping me in with the clowns for pointing out something factual. 

Have a good one. 

 

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1 hour ago, KilljoyCutter said:

 

I'm not certain how this makes my comment about the magical range boost for RU AA despite being nearly the same size guns "misinformation" (RU 130mm vs US 127mm DP secondaries). 

 

 

Because the Russian 130mm had a longer range irl than the 5"/54.

Took 30sec to google that. Try it next time. Nothing magical about it.

Edited by GetSchwifty01
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1 hour ago, Shrayes_Bhagavatula said:

Don't forget Minotaur and Goliath ( okay, maybe not Goliath )

-Shrayes

I remember them, but this thread was initiated on the premise that these new RU Crusiers' AA supplanting US.  The facts clearly shows them otherwise.

 

But you did make me curious.  My guess is the disappearance of RU Cruiser AA once you get closer is going to be their downfall.  So I pulled the info for Goliath and Minotaur also.  Here they are, alongside my previous ones for Petropavlovsk and Alexander Nevsky.

c0gzZhl.jpgwgUSpX0.jpg

97MLni1.jpgWG5ZfMy.jpg

 

DM & Worcester again to make it easier and not have to scroll up.

Spoiler

2CrpfKk.jpgfFD4sAG.jpg

Nevsky vs Minotaur is the same as Nevsky vs Worcester.  The RU has great long range flak and DPS there, but once you get underneath that, Minotaur's Medium and Near AA really ramp up, just like Worcester did.  Mino's AA is even better than Worcester's at Medium, but Worcester's gets better at the Near AA bracket.

Edit:  There is one thing I forgot to mention, an old game fact.  Minotaur doesn't have Defensive Fire, but all the other Cruisers in this post do.  Minotaur isn't looking good compared to Worcester's AA, but I'd still place her higher than Nevsky in AA, despite Nevsky having Defensive Fire still.  Once Nevsky's DF is on cooldown, she's in big trouble, while for Minotaur, it was never a concern.  Worcester's AA is just fantastic, strong with and without DF.

The values for Defensive Fire bonus to AA are the same, it's just charges that vary.

 

In the 3 CAs, Petropavlovsk repeats her issues against Goliath's AA, as it did with Des Moines.  Again, Petro has better long range flak and DPS, but once you're past that, it's easy.  Both Goliath and Des Moines have ferocious AA at Medium & Near AA brackets.  Goliath does lose out in Medium AA range, the furthest is 3.5km while DM & Petro is 4km.  DM rules here in Medium AA with her good range and very strong DPS.  Goliath's shorter range and DPS lose out firmly to DM.  Petro's isn't even worth mentioning.

But to keep DM from running away with this, Goliath's Near AA of 2km skyrockets in DPS, the last line of defense.

Petro again, doesn't even have Near AA bracket.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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2 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

The misinformation is strong on these boards.  It's up to people like me to keep you guys in check.

TLDR:  The best of the new RU Cruisers' AA is good, but overall USN Cruiser AA is still better.

 

And we really appreciate your efforts and expertise Haze. Thanks again!

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