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Moggytwo

The upcoming clan battle season will be at tier 6, and CV's are set to remain in the mode long term

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From latest dev blog:

In the future, we aim to conduct clan battles where all four main classes in our game will be presented...

Season X will be conducted in a 7x7 format on Tier VI ships without any weather events. The restrictions remain the same: one carrier or battleship for one team.

Well I guess there are 120 or so clans that are going to be having the next season off?  Or was it a permanent boycott?

Some really interesting comments from WG here, and it's good to see them looking to address the DD issue, and they're obviously quickly onto the Haku and Venezia issues, as we knew already, and as seemed inevitable during the season.

I'm interested to see what spotting changes they'll come up with, although I don't much like the sound of the DD change, in that you're actively discouraged from using your AA at all.  It would be an exceptionally good buff for DD's with poor to average AA though.

Lastly, I just can't wait for T6 CB's - I have asked repeatedly for them to lower the tier (I suggested tier 8, but tier 6 is just as good), due to the poor cruiser to DD inter-class balance at tier 10.   The inter-class balance is fantastic at tier 6 though, particularly between DD's and cruisers, and the really strong class at that tier, BB's, are going to be very limited in numbers.

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DDs will be even more irrelevant as there is no DD with anything that could be called "good" AA at tier 6. Calling it now, Ryujo will be taken pretty much exclusively. Guessing Perth will make a heavy showing.

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1 minute ago, OseanTanker said:

DDs will be even more irrelevant as there is no DD with anything that could be called "good" AA at tier 6. Calling it now, Ryujo will be taken pretty much exclusively. Guessing Perth will make a heavy showing.

I was thinking RN CL, but perth with the creeping smoke (and two ammo types) might be better.

The top clans will probably still take a CV.

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5 minutes ago, OseanTanker said:

DDs will be even more irrelevant as there is no DD with anything that could be called "good" AA at tier 6.

AA is not the primary mechanic that protects DD's from CV's.

DD and cruisers are much closer in balance at tier 6, and many DD's at that tier can make CV's a mere annoyance with their use of air concealment, positioning, and smoke.  Icarus and Fushun in particular basically don't have to consider CV's much of a threat.

DD's are going to have a FAR better time of it at this tier, and I predict significant DD viability.

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13 minutes ago, OseanTanker said:

DDs will be even more irrelevant as there is no DD with anything that could be called "good" AA at tier 6. Calling it now, Ryujo will be taken pretty much exclusively. Guessing Perth will make a heavy showing.

Farragut can have good AA, Icarus can wing a few planes but it’s main talent is smoking up quick if planes show up.

And I am thinking we will see a lot of Graf Spee this season since it’s the closest thing to a Super Cruiser you can bring.

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Imo, the main problem of CVs is that rockets are too effective.

An easy fix would be to cut the rocket projectile speed by 1/2, or even 3/4 the current speed. This way, DDs and other targets has an actual chance of dodging rockets. 

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I love how WG continues to promote and shove CV down everyone's throat in CB and in Ranked, seems like they do it intentionally just to mess with the fan base. LOL

Edited by Xcalib3r
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16 minutes ago, RyuuohD_NA said:

Imo, the main problem of CVs is that rockets are too effective.

An easy fix would be to cut the rocket projectile speed by 1/2, or even 3/4 the current speed. This way, DDs and other targets has an actual chance of dodging rockets. 

The DD air detection change they're suggesting is going to make it extremely difficult to line up an attack run on a DD that isn't spotted by other means. Essentially, you're going to have to initiate the run on an unspotted DD almost every time. I think that's probably going to go a long way to letting the DDs avoid hits, because at best the CV is going to be firing with the reticle at full dispersion most of the time.

 

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4 minutes ago, ProfessorLumpy said:

The DD air detection change they're suggesting is going to make it extremely difficult to line up an attack run on a DD that isn't spotted by other means. Essentially, you're going to have to initiate the run on an unspotted DD almost every time. I think that's probably going to go a long way to letting the DDs avoid hits, because at best the CV is going to be firing with the reticle at full dispersion most of the time.

 

You mean this change?

Quote

Destroyers' detectability range by air will be decreased by half, but when AA defense is turned on, their detectability range by air will be equal to their AA firing range for 20 seconds after the AA guns cease firing.

Isn't this practically how things work currently? DDs air detectability range was already cut by almost half compared to its previous value compared to pre-rework.

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8 minutes ago, RyuuohD_NA said:

You mean this change?

Isn't this practically how things work currently? DDs air detectability range was already cut by almost half compared to its previous value compared to pre-rework.

I fear that cutting the air detection range of DDs by half (again, as you pointed out) might be a bit much. Many DDs at high tiers already have air detection values in the 3km range, and reducing it by that much would in many cases effectively make DDs immune to carrier strikes unless they are firing their guns or spotted by another ship.

Edited by Nevermore135
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35 minutes ago, Admiral_Thrawn_1 said:

And I am thinking we will see a lot of Graf Spee this season since it’s the closest thing to a Super Cruiser you can bring.

I was thinking this as well as I read this announcement....

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19 minutes ago, RyuuohD_NA said:

You mean this change?

Isn't this practically how things work currently? DDs air detectability range was already cut by almost half compared to its previous value compared to pre-rework.

Yes, it was reduced previously. The result is that DDs with low air detectability running dark are currently fairly hard to y passed over the target. If the DD doesn't initiate AA, he will go undetected again as you loop around for another pass. While that DD is still unspotted, you have to initiate another rocket strike. IF the DD is smart, he'll maneuver so that you can't easily guess his course. If he turned into your fighters, you'll likely not be able to fire on him. When you spot him again, you have a window of a second or two to make adjustments to your course and prepare to launch rockets. As a result of this movement, your reticle isn't going to narrow and you'll be firing on him poorly aligned with sub-optimal dispersion and do fairly low damage. The work-around to this for CVs is using fighters as spotter planes, which is situational but often very effective.


With an even further reduced spotting range.. Daring's default air detection is going to be down to 1.73 km. I'm sure that extremely high-skill players with a savant-like ability to predict where to blind-fire on unspotted targets are going to be able to make that work, but for most CV players I don't think you're ever going to see a very high damage hit on most DDs unless they're being spotted by something else. It's going to be very hard to even keep that DD spotted, because you're going to be constantly over-flying it and losing it before you can adjust course. Using fighters as spotters is going to become even more prevalent, but when I'm playing DD I imagine I'll keep my AA off and scoot right out of that circle quickly enough to avoid much difficulty. 
 

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I'm just glad Clan Battles isn't tier 10 for once, tier 10 is such a drag... 

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4 minutes ago, ProfessorLumpy said:

 

Yes, it was reduced previously. The result is that DDs with low air detectability running dark are currently fairly hard to y passed over the target. If the DD doesn't initiate AA, he will go undetected again as you loop around for another pass. While that DD is still unspotted, you have to initiate another rocket strike. IF the DD is smart, he'll maneuver so that you can't easily guess his course. If he turned into your fighters, you'll likely not be able to fire on him. When you spot him again, you have a window of a second or two to make adjustments to your course and prepare to launch rockets. As a result of this movement, your reticle isn't going to narrow and you'll be firing on him poorly aligned with sub-optimal dispersion and do fairly low damage. The work-around to this for CVs is using fighters as spotter planes, which is situational but often very effective.


With an even further reduced spotting range.. Daring's default air detection is going to be down to 1.73 km. I'm sure that extremely high-skill players with a savant-like ability to predict where to blind-fire on unspotted targets are going to be able to make that work, but for most CV players I don't think you're ever going to see a very high damage hit on most DDs unless they're being spotted by something else. It's going to be very hard to even keep that DD spotted, because you're going to be constantly over-flying it and losing it before you can adjust course. Using fighters as spotters is going to become even more prevalent, but when I'm playing DD I imagine I'll keep my AA off and scoot right out of that circle quickly enough to avoid much difficulty. 
 

This. 

As a CV main, I'm perfectly fine with the change to be honest. I'm no longer going to be hunting DDs. It will be up to the CV and the DDs on a team to coordinate an attack on the enemy DDs. This time, with the DD spotting. 

I made this suggestion a while ago with the addition of weakening the AA but I think they are doing it much better. If the DD wants to keep the AA on, they're accepting a battle with rockets; if not, the captain can hide much better now.

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1 hour ago, Moggytwo said:

Lastly, I just can't wait for T6 CB's - I have asked repeatedly for them to lower the tier (I suggested tier 8, but tier 6 is just as good), due to the poor cruiser to DD inter-class balance at tier 10.   The inter-class balance is fantastic at tier 6 though, particularly between DD's and cruisers, and the really strong class at that tier, BB's, are going to be very limited in numbers.

I think you're underestimating the strength of tier 6 BB's VS tier 6 Cruisers, with no heals\armor cruisers at this tier tend to take a beating, if you remember tier 6 ranked cruisers were fairly scarce.

1 hour ago, OseanTanker said:

DDs will be even more irrelevant as there is no DD with anything that could be called "good" AA at tier 6. Calling it now, Ryujo will be taken pretty much exclusively. Guessing Perth will make a heavy showing.

Will probably see some Ark Royal in the mix, that thing decimates DD's.

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30 minutes ago, Nevermore135 said:

I fear that cutting the air detection range of DDs by half (again, as you pointed out) might be a bit much. Many DDs at high tiers already have air detection values in the 3km range, and reducing it by that much would in many cases effectively make DDs immune to carrier strikes unless they are firing their guns or spotted by another ship.

For some this will be ideal. But not so for the health of the game. As DDs has normally no way to counter CVs, this will leave the CV with close to no options to counter the DDs in a match. The fighters (the only option available to light them up) is limited in numbers of use, and if you have to use them all just for spotting you leave your team unprotected.

With the current state of the game, good CV players have no problem striking DDs with whatever ammunition they have available, so (despite the issues I mentioned before) I think the change is not that bad. They will probably test the viability of this mechanic, nd they have to test it A LOT. 

 

On the other hand, they recognized the near useless state the Defensive AA consumable is in right now, so we can expect changes in that regard too.

@BasedCoomer is a 7v7 with only 1 CV or 1 BB per team. In normal composition you have up to 4 cruisers per team, sometimes even 5. All those targets vs one BB (leaving you with no CV) will tax him considerably. You can delete 1 or even 2, but dont count on deleting 4 cruisers per match.

Edited by hanesco

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"Many players note the weakness of AA defense and/or the consumable “Defensive AA Fire”. We recognize that some improvements in the AA mechanics are possible. It's too early to talk about the details, but we will be happy to share them with you as they are developed."

 

I'm really interested what comes from this point. I'm crossing my fingers for manual controlled AA guns to some degree. Let's make that interaction more interesting, while creating a better opportunity for there to be a degree of skill involved with shooting planes down.

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1 minute ago, Merc_R_Us said:

"Many players note the weakness of AA defense and/or the consumable “Defensive AA Fire”. We recognize that some improvements in the AA mechanics are possible. It's too early to talk about the details, but we will be happy to share them with you as they are developed."

 

I'm really interested what comes from this point. I'm crossing my fingers for manual controlled AA guns to some degree. Let's make that interaction more interesting, while creating a better opportunity for there to be a degree of skill involved with shooting planes down.

I dont see it happening as you are hoping they do. Manually controlled AA would be too much for DDs to handle, even for cruisers and battleships, unless you want them distracted from enemy salvoes. Instead, I am expecting some change to the Defensive AA Fire consumable. Right now it is in a sorry state.

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38 minutes ago, DJC_499 said:

I was thinking this as well as I read this announcement....

Yeah you get 11” guns, decent mobility, the ability to heal, and with Aiming Mod 1 mounted the Graf Spee can accurately fire up to its max range. Plus with the dockyard event pretty much everyone will be able to field the ship. Also the 8km torpedoes are very nice as well. The AA is a bit weak, but with Def AA and Cat Fighters you can down some planes.

Only other ship I could see being used is the Leander because it can also heal and is able to break line of sight with smoke much like the Venezia is able to. But Leander’s armor and citadel are very weak so we will have to see.

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5 minutes ago, hanesco said:

I dont see it happening as you are hoping they do. Manually controlled AA would be too much for DDs to handle, even for cruisers and battleships, unless you want them distracted from enemy salvoes. Instead, I am expecting some change to the Defensive AA Fire consumable. Right now it is in a sorry state.

Yeah the idea of manually controlling AA sounds nice until you were to try it and then would realize how much work it is. WOWs Blitz the manually fired secondary guns feel very taxing compared to WOWs PC, and certainly less efficient I think than auto secondary guns. I would shudder to think of the hardships of having to manually use the AA guns in WOWs.

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13 minutes ago, hanesco said:

I dont see it happening as you are hoping they do. Manually controlled AA would be too much for DDs to handle, even for cruisers and battleships, unless you want them distracted from enemy salvoes. Instead, I am expecting some change to the Defensive AA Fire consumable. Right now it is in a sorry state.

I don't see it happening either but I do wish it would be implemented. At the very least, something like that of a torpedo planes reticle, where you can concentrate your AA or the flak guns specifically.

I don't see it working for DDs, but I think it could add a layer of skill to the BB and CA play. They can let their guns continue automatically and at least set priority sector, or they can take over and focus it where they want. In this way, higher skilled players can apply their knowledge of reload times, quick hands, and more control (especially when they are just being engage by a CV). 

Just an idea, we'll see what they do.

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Quote

With the lack of radar and no heal for cruisers, Tier VI Clan Battles ...

And if they bothered to play their game, they would realize this statement is false.

There are T6 cruisers with heal.

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T6 Clan Battles... Wow!!

Is it time for me to join a Clan? Are you talking to me WG? you cheeky... don't tempt me that way...

 

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