19 [ERK] SHADOW_WAKE Beta Testers 84 posts 14,041 battles Report post #1 Posted June 30, 2020 X Venezia The angle at which the check for ricochets is made for her SAP shells decreased from 75 to 70 degrees. Main battery guns reload time increased from 20 to 20.5 s. Rudder shift time increased from 11.6 to 12.6 s. Awesome! Gonna be so much more enjoyable after this... thanks WG! 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,763 [CMFRT] KilljoyCutter [CMFRT] Banned 16,985 posts Report post #2 Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) Does anyone know for certain if this is because it was performing too well in detailed stats like damage, win rate, etc, etc... ...or just because it was "too popular" in a couple of niche game modes? Edited June 30, 2020 by KilljoyCutter Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,201 [SYN] Kuckoo Members 5,882 posts 13,316 battles Report post #3 Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) Commend WG on their restraint. They could have gone nuts nerfing the Venizia, but they didn't. These seem like reasonable changes. We'll see how it plays out. Edited June 30, 2020 by Kuckoo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1,543 [WMD] VeatherVitch Members 2,077 posts 11,948 battles Report post #4 Posted June 30, 2020 At least they didn't go full YY yet... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,391 [WORX] Navalpride33 Members 16,151 posts 21,842 battles Report post #5 Posted June 30, 2020 Out of all the ships that really needed the nerf bat swung on hard, the Venezia is a perfect candidate... Instead, we get a Kremlin AA nerf on her instead... Tier 10, sure are getting pampered... Any other ship in any other tier... She would've been rightfully gutted, 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
7,519 [HINON] RipNuN2 Members 14,340 posts Report post #6 Posted June 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said: She would've been rightfully gutted, Nah, it's italian bias Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,391 [WORX] Navalpride33 Members 16,151 posts 21,842 battles Report post #7 Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said: Nah, it's italian bias Two ships are not a bias, I'll just file it under high tier power creep. Edited June 30, 2020 by Navalpride33 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3,198 [WOLF5] AJTP89 Supertester 5,240 posts 4,459 battles Report post #8 Posted June 30, 2020 22 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said: Does anyone know for certain if this is because it was performing too well in detailed stats like damage, win rate, etc, etc... or just because it was too popular in a couple of niche game modes? I'm guessing the SpreadsheetTM said it was overperforming, apparently worse than Kremlin judging by the nerfs. WG isn't known to listen to player feedback, so I doubt the couple of people whining about it in CBs was the cause. Most of the good players seem to think that was more a function of CVs than anything else. I'm actually going to trust WG on this one, as a spreadsheet based change is right up their alley. And personally I agree with the nerf, it was really strong especially against other cruisers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
7,519 [HINON] RipNuN2 Members 14,340 posts Report post #9 Posted June 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said: Two ships are not a bias, I'll just file it under high tier power creep. I'll get you to laugh some day . . . 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
6,059 [WOLFG] DrHolmes52 Members 15,372 posts 16,229 battles Report post #10 Posted June 30, 2020 4 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said: I'll get you to laugh some day . . . Yeah, I'm stealing this. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,391 [WORX] Navalpride33 Members 16,151 posts 21,842 battles Report post #11 Posted June 30, 2020 1 minute ago, RipNuN2 said: 'll get you to laugh some day . . . That reminds me.. This thread needs a laugh Italian style Enjoy 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1,692 Moggytwo Members 827 posts 20 battles Report post #12 Posted June 30, 2020 They announced this nerf a week ago, and I would think it's highly likely that this is only the start of the Venezia nerf cycle. Don't forget their new method of nerfing individual ships is to apply a small change, check the data over the next patch, and then apply a further small change if necessary. This is repeated till the data they get says the ship is balanced. Quote from WG on Venezia balance: "Individual balance of ships — among which Hakuryū and Venezia stand out the most because of their excessive effectiveness in all types of battles." So clearly WG think Venezia is too good in all battle modes (something I would very much agree with), and as per usual with WG, this would be based on the no doubt very thorough data they have collected. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,839 [SIDE] thebigblue Members 4,939 posts Report post #13 Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said: Out of all the ships that really needed the nerf bat swung on hard, the Venezia is a perfect candidate... Instead, we get a Kremlin AA nerf on her instead... Tier 10, sure are getting pampered... Any other ship in any other tier... She would've been rightfully gutted, What? The cumulative effect of Nerf's to gunnery are meaningful. The darn rudder shift nerf, 10%, is going to be noticable because this ship depends on wiggling to survive. Of it isn't enough then they can always hit her again in a patch or two Edited June 30, 2020 by thebigblue Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,839 [SIDE] thebigblue Members 4,939 posts Report post #14 Posted June 30, 2020 19 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said: I'll get you to laugh some day . . . Stealing this too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,391 [WORX] Navalpride33 Members 16,151 posts 21,842 battles Report post #15 Posted June 30, 2020 1 minute ago, thebigblue said: What? The cumulative effect of Nerf's to gunnery are meaningful. The darn rudder shift nerf, 10%, is going to be noticable because the ships depends on wiggling to survive. Of it isn't enough then they can always hit her again in a patch or two On the Venezia ??? Well, now she'll move like a BB but its tier 10... BBs corner faster then cruisers... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,839 [SIDE] thebigblue Members 4,939 posts Report post #16 Posted June 30, 2020 6 minutes ago, Moggytwo said: They announced this nerf a week ago, and I would think it's highly likely that this is only the start of the Venezia nerf cycle. Don't forget their new method of nerfing individual ships is to apply a small change, check the data over the next patch, and then apply a further small change if necessary. This is repeated till the data they get says the ship is balanced. Quote from WG on Venezia balance: "Individual balance of ships — among which Hakuryū and Venezia stand out the most because of their excessive effectiveness in all types of battles." So clearly WG think Venezia is too good in all battle modes (something I would very much agree with), and as per usual with WG, this would be based on the no doubt very thorough data they have collected. Anything but a YY hammering. Please WG. The ship lacks a Henri exploit so it probably will take a few minor adjustments on a few gunnery and handling specs over a few patches to dial it in. I like what they did so far. Pulled back a little without taking away everything that makes it great. Remember, this ship is blind without spotting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1,692 Moggytwo Members 827 posts 20 battles Report post #17 Posted June 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, thebigblue said: Anything but a YY hammering. Please WG. The ship lacks a Henri exploit so it probably will take a few minor adjustments on a few gunnery and handling specs over a few patches to dial it in. I like what they did so far. Pulled back a little without taking away everything that makes it great. Remember, this ship is blind without spotting. Completely agree. I do think they have to specifically address Venezia's effectiveness towards DD's though - having nearly double the alpha of the next best T10 cruiser against DD's is too much. Having said that, the SAP angle nerf to bring it in line with the rest of the tech tree will be a fairly decent help for DD's in particular. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2,533 [TDRB] kgh52 Members 5,787 posts 13,780 battles Report post #18 Posted June 30, 2020 52 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said: Out of all the ships that really needed the nerf bat swung on hard, the Venezia is a perfect candidate... Instead, we get a Kremlin AA nerf on her instead... Tier 10, sure are getting pampered... Any other ship in any other tier... She would've been rightfully gutted, I think it is better to apply small nerfs & repeat if necessary vs the swinging pendulum of extremes we have seen in the past. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,391 [WORX] Navalpride33 Members 16,151 posts 21,842 battles Report post #19 Posted June 30, 2020 1 minute ago, kgh52 said: I think it is better to apply small nerfs & repeat if necessary vs the swinging pendulum of extremes we have seen in the past. That is why I stated at tier 10 "should" do it, instead its not going to do so.. Out of all the tiers the nerf bat needs to be swung at... Its tier 10. That means, those of us that want fair play at high tiers?? Not going to happen anytime soon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9,763 [CMFRT] KilljoyCutter [CMFRT] Banned 16,985 posts Report post #20 Posted June 30, 2020 44 minutes ago, thebigblue said: Anything but a YY hammering. Please WG. The ship lacks a Henri exploit so it probably will take a few minor adjustments on a few gunnery and handling specs over a few patches to dial it in. I like what they did so far. Pulled back a little without taking away everything that makes it great. Remember, this ship is blind without spotting. What was done to Henri seems to have been too much... but in that case I think it was done out of refusal to nerf or remove the engine boost gimmick, so the base capability of the ship took at major hit instead. (I tested out Henri in PTS before and after the nerf, in anticipation of unlocking it, and now it's like trying to accelerate through tar specially from a dead start... to the point that I haven't bothered spending the credits on it yet on the Live server, other things seem more fun/important to add to the fleet.) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
706 [UFFA] Sparviero Members 2,116 posts 75 battles Report post #21 Posted June 30, 2020 41 minutes ago, Moggytwo said: Completely agree. I do think they have to specifically address Venezia's effectiveness towards DD's though - having nearly double the alpha of the next best T10 cruiser against DD's is too much. Having said that, the SAP angle nerf to bring it in line with the rest of the tech tree will be a fairly decent help for DD's in particular. Almost like they shouldn’t have shoved out the cruiser line before properly balancing SAP? Instead getting T10 and pre-T10 variants. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
919 [WOLFG] Captain_Rawhide Members 1,355 posts Report post #22 Posted June 30, 2020 This nerf has more to do with Clan battles and how Venezia was being 'exploited' there. This is the result of Clan battles. Unicum Clans look for 'any' advantage they can find and they found one with Venezia. Unfortunately, everybody has to live with the nerf. 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
380 BlackAngelCom Beta Testers 1,115 posts 5,568 battles Report post #23 Posted June 30, 2020 1 hour ago, AJTP89 said: I'm guessing the SpreadsheetTM said it was overperforming, apparently worse than Kremlin judging by the nerfs. WG isn't known to listen to player feedback, so I doubt the couple of people whining about it in CBs was the cause. Most of the good players seem to think that was more a function of CVs than anything else. I'm actually going to trust WG on this one, as a spreadsheet based change is right up their alley. And personally I agree with the nerf, it was really strong especially against other cruisers. Venezia is another situation like Kremlin where it has really good synergy with a national commander. It's effectively going to always have the right shell loaded. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4,050 [SYN] MrDeaf Members 16,027 posts 12,803 battles Report post #24 Posted June 30, 2020 here, read https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/40 https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/38 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
23 [DBM] Shoot_That_Other_Guy Members 7 posts 6,991 battles Report post #25 Posted June 30, 2020 Yet another reminder why I’m never buying premium camo again I guess. 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
