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SidTheBlade

CV Immunity

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I just played a match in my tier * DD, a Lighting, and came up against a tier 8 CV, a Graf Spree.

My HE shells did absolutely no damage at all. Not 1 HP. My AP shells did absolutely no damage at all. Not 1 HP. It could sail as fast as me, and so torps were off the table.

Consider what sort of ship design team did this. The CV has every conceivable advantage by every measure. It has infinite range. It has brilliant detection concealment. It has incredible secondaries.

So, on top of all these ridiculously over powered features, they also make it utterly immune to damage from a ship of the same tier. It is not enough to make the ship a relentlessly powerful attack vehicle. It also has to be immune from gun damage.

Keep in mind, this was not a case where the shells did low damage, or where they did no damage for a certain percentage of the time. In this case, every single shot, of both ammo types, did absolutely nothing at all. 100%, total immunity from harm, from a same tier ship that it can harass relentlessly.

 

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CVs in their current state are basically WGs middle finger to the rest of the playerbase.

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consider shot placement, at mid to long range, you were probably hitting the 25mm deck with HE that shattered and AP was just bouncing because of angle, while to get AP to be effective you have to be close enough to avoid the 25mm deck and flat enough trajectory to hit the 21mm sides without it bouncing due to angle of the ship or angle of the shells flightpath and combinations thereof.

 

while you being badly positioned to use your torps is not fundamentally a CV problem, that an expectation problem on your part. 

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2 hours ago, SidTheBlade said:

I just played a match in my tier * DD, a Lighting, and came up against a tier 8 CV, a Graf Spree.

 

There is no tier 8 CV named "Graf Spree". There is Graf Zeppelin and Graf Spee, a tier 6 German heavy cruiser.

If your target was Graf Spee and you attempted to engage it in a gunfight, then I'm not quite sure what you expected. Generally speaking unless a cruiser is on low health or exposing their broadside a close-range gun duel between a dd and a cruiser will only go one way.

Edited by Avenge_December_7
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The Zeppelin only does 31 knots or so, assuming it is sailing dead straight. The lightning does like 36, while also being a lot more agile. Your torpedoes would do short work of her, assuming you could get in range. 

That said, you probably should not try to get in range. It has good armor and enough secondaries to melt you quickly. Though to be honest, the problem in this matchup isn't the Zeppelin's decent armor, but the Lightning's puny guns.

Do your job, and let your teammates better equipped to combat the Zeppelin do theirs.

Edited by Telastyn
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A DD of all things, complaining about having trouble dealing with another class of ship? :Smile_smile:

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3 hours ago, SidTheBlade said:

I just played a match in my tier * DD, a Lighting, and came up against a tier 8 CV, a Graf Spree.

My HE shells did absolutely no damage at all. Not 1 HP. My AP shells did absolutely no damage at all. Not 1 HP. It could sail as fast as me, and so torps were off the table.

Consider what sort of ship design team did this. The CV has every conceivable advantage by every measure. It has infinite range. It has brilliant detection concealment. It has incredible secondaries.

So, on top of all these ridiculously over powered features, they also make it utterly immune to damage from a ship of the same tier. It is not enough to make the ship a relentlessly powerful attack vehicle. It also has to be immune from gun damage.

Keep in mind, this was not a case where the shells did low damage, or where they did no damage for a certain percentage of the time. In this case, every single shot, of both ammo types, did absolutely nothing at all. 100%, total immunity from harm, from a same tier ship that it can harass relentlessly.

 

You forgot to add that the cv one shotted every ship.  It did 1mill go of damage and single handedly spotted every torp.

You really want people to belive that you did no damage to the hull. 

Wow

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34 minutes ago, Telastyn said:

The Zeppelin only does 31 knots or so, assuming it is sailing dead straight. The lightning does like 36, while also being a lot more agile. Your torpedoes would do short work of her, assuming you could get in range. 

That said, you probably should not try to get in range. It has good armor and enough secondaries to melt you quickly. Though to be honest, the problem in this matchup isn't the Zeppelin's decent armor, but the Lightning's puny guns.

Do your job, and let your teammates better equipped to combat the Zeppelin do theirs.

One the things that upsets me is watching DD's go CV hunting.  As much as they complain about being targeted by a CV some go out of their way to do exactly that.  Once a CV gets that "spotted" notification is obvious that you're being spotted by a DD.  You're not going to last long.

Cruisers and BB's are better equipped to take out a CV.  They just need some one to spot it.  In some cases a DD can go hunt a CV but its only in certain circumstances or situations.  You will do more for your team by just having a presence near enemy ships than spending 5 minutes trying to chase down a CV.

 

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24 minutes ago, jags_domain said:

You forgot to add that the cv one shotted every ship.  It did 1mill go of damage and single handedly spotted every torp.

You really want people to belive that you did no damage to the hull. 

Wow

Due to the shell arcs it's perfectly possible for that to happen. An angled, retreating CV can be only penetrated by DD guns when the shells hit the superstructure, which more often than not is pretty damn hard 

 

9 minutes ago, HeadSplit120 said:

One the things that upsets me is watching DD's go CV hunting.  As much as they complain about being targeted by a CV some go out of their way to do exactly that.  Once a CV gets that "spotted" notification is obvious that you're being spotted by a DD.  You're not going to last long.

Cruisers and BB's are better equipped to take out a CV.  They just need some one to spot it.  In some cases a DD can go hunt a CV but its only in certain circumstances or situations.  You will do more for your team by just having a presence near enemy ships than spending 5 minutes trying to chase down a CV.

 

In sentiment, I agree, CVs should be avoided by DDs unless they are confident they can withstand it's focus or the CV is the only target left.

That said, even for cruisers and BBs it can be difficult. To penetrate the deck of an angled tier X with HE afaik you need either Thunderer with the 1/4 HE rule, or IFHE Yamato. The quick DCP and the way fire works in CVs makes it harder at times.

An angled CV is quite often one of the toughest targets to take out in any ship class.

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OP, I highly suspect you are lying right now.  You can't even get the name right.

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16 minutes ago, warheart1992 said:

Due to the shell arcs it's perfectly possible for that to happen. An angled, retreating CV can be only penetrated by DD guns when the shells hit the superstructure, which more often than not is pretty damn hard 

 

In sentiment, I agree, CVs should be avoided by DDs unless they are confident they can withstand it's focus or the CV is the only target left.

That said, even for cruisers and BBs it can be difficult. To penetrate the deck of an angled tier X with HE afaik you need either Thunderer with the 1/4 HE rule, or IFHE Yamato. The quick DCP and the way fire works in CVs makes it harder at times.

An angled CV is quite often one of the toughest targets to take out in any ship class.

Midway is the only one that can bounce sheels if its pointing away from you.  Just like any ship.

So a cv bounches some shells and its a rant but another ship bounces shells its ok.

 

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Only 12 posts in 9 hours 

 

CV screeds are not what they used to be.

 

TROLL HARDER!!!

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7 hours ago, jags_domain said:

You really want people to belive that you did no damage to the hull.

This is kinda funny actually.  Was in my Fiji yesterday and ambushed a Fubuki coming around an island.  He had just launched torps the other direction and when he popped out was only 4km from me.  I of course unloaded on him, to the tune of 45 hits total.  ZERO DAMAGE.   None.  Zip.  Nada.  

The first 5 or so hits he was completely broadside,,, then he started running.  I angled to keep all 12 guns on him and kept up the fire.  Hit after hit after hit.  No damage.   None marked as ricochets or shatters.   All as hits or penetration.

A BB Blapped me from 15km away and my match was over.  The Fubuki sailing away nicely with full HP.

Oh well.  I chalked it up to some glitch in the game.  Seen all kinds of !@@% these last 5 years.

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15 minutes ago, SeaborneSumo said:

This is kinda funny actually.  Was in my Fiji yesterday and ambushed a Fubuki coming around an island.  He had just launched torps the other direction and when he popped out was only 4km from me.  I of course unloaded on him, to the tune of 45 hits total.  ZERO DAMAGE.   None.  Zip.  Nada.  

The first 5 or so hits he was completely broadside,,, then he started running.  I angled to keep all 12 guns on him and kept up the fire.  Hit after hit after hit.  No damage.   None marked as ricochets or shatters.   All as hits or penetration.

A BB Blapped me from 15km away and my match was over.  The Fubuki sailing away nicely with full HP.

Oh well.  I chalked it up to some glitch in the game.  Seen all kinds of !@@% these last 5 years.

Yeah that is definitely not a normal situation,  Brit CLs typically wreck DDs

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1 hour ago, SeaborneSumo said:

This is kinda funny actually.  Was in my Fiji yesterday and ambushed a Fubuki coming around an island.  He had just launched torps the other direction and when he popped out was only 4km from me.  I of course unloaded on him, to the tune of 45 hits total.  ZERO DAMAGE.   None.  Zip.  Nada.  

The first 5 or so hits he was completely broadside,,, then he started running.  I angled to keep all 12 guns on him and kept up the fire.  Hit after hit after hit.  No damage.   None marked as ricochets or shatters.   All as hits or penetration.

A BB Blapped me from 15km away and my match was over.  The Fubuki sailing away nicely with full HP.

Oh well.  I chalked it up to some glitch in the game.  Seen all kinds of !@@% these last 5 years.

Wow.  I have no lt unsed British in a long time.  But there suppose to be amazing vs DD.

Next time take Itialian SAP murders DD at all angles.

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9 minutes ago, jags_domain said:

Wow.  I have no lt unsed British in a long time.  But there suppose to be amazing vs DD.

Next time take Itialian SAP murders DD at all angles.

I don't think it was ship type involved here.  Had to be some sort of glitch.  On any other day, the Fubuki would've been swiss cheese.

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12 hours ago, SidTheBlade said:

no damage at all. Not 1 HP.

As designed. This is Russian Balance.

yes yes.. we all know it is whackadoodle, but they insist that it is all balanced. Ask them, they will tell you.. all is balanced.

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13 minutes ago, SeaborneSumo said:

I don't think it was ship type involved here.  Had to be some sort of glitch.  On any other day, the Fubuki would've been swiss cheese.

Desync maybe? Because a Fiji is normally a buzzsaw against DD's.

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12 hours ago, admiralsexybeast said:

CVs in their current state are basically WGs middle finger to the rest of the playerbase.

 

12 hours ago, SidTheBlade said:

I just played a match in my tier * DD, a Lighting, and came up against a tier 8 CV, a Graf Spree.

My HE shells did absolutely no damage at all. Not 1 HP. My AP shells did absolutely no damage at all. Not 1 HP. It could sail as fast as me, and so torps were off the table.

Consider what sort of ship design team did this. The CV has every conceivable advantage by every measure. It has infinite range. It has brilliant detection concealment. It has incredible secondaries.

So, on top of all these ridiculously over powered features, they also make it utterly immune to damage from a ship of the same tier. It is not enough to make the ship a relentlessly powerful attack vehicle. It also has to be immune from gun damage.

Keep in mind, this was not a case where the shells did low damage, or where they did no damage for a certain percentage of the time. In this case, every single shot, of both ammo types, did absolutely nothing at all. 100%, total immunity from harm, from a same tier ship that it can harass relentlessly.

 

CVs are a Super class that has had training wheels installed permanently.  Over all they are one of the worst balanced classes in gaming history.  Average damage competing but just behind the highest damage class in the game. Able to reach everywhere. Highest game influence ( according to WG). And then to put the cherry on top "battle survived" stats widely exceeding and sometimes doubling other classes. http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20200606/na_week/average_ship_u.html   That is a super class.

 

 

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10 hours ago, jags_domain said:

You really want people to belive that you did no damage to the hull. 

Wow

 

9 hours ago, Formous said:

OP, I highly suspect you are lying right now.  You can't even get the name right.

The entire Graf Zeppelin hull is 21 mm. Only a tiny superstructure barely worth mentioning is less.

Lightning has 20 mm of HE penetration.

 

You do the math.

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First of all, you have got to be the maddest person in the world to go chasing after a Graf Zeppelin (  A GRAF ZEPPELIN ) in a Destroyer ( and that too, in a Lightning of all things ).

Second, Zeppelin is one of those rare CVs that is almost totally immune to the large majority of DD-caliber HE spam, with the exception of the Germans ( 1/4 HE pen ), the Soviets ( 22 mm HE pen ), and the French ( 23 mm HE pen + Reload Booster ).

Lightning, with it's piddly little British 120 mm guns, can't muster enough penetration to actually get through the hull. In any case, you should have stayed out of detection range and just torpedoed him, unless you wanted to get turned into creme brulee by that ( frankly absurd ) secondary battery

Like,  u w0t m8!?

:SerB:

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10 hours ago, jags_domain said:

Midway is the only one that can bounce sheels if its pointing away from you.  Just like any ship.

So a cv bounches some shells and its a rant but another ship bounces shells its ok.

 

Hak and Audacious can too with the deck armor. 
Other ships give up firepower to run away angled like that, cv isn’t giving up anything.

Edited by GandalfTehGray

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36 minutes ago, GandalfTehGray said:

Other ships give up firepower to run away angled like that, cv isn’t giving up anything.

assuming a CV is forced to run and manual control has to be used in order to dodge incoming, they are giving up ALL their firepower bar secondary's, unlike all other ship classes who don't have to babysit their shells along the entirety of a flightpath and can wiggle to dodge incoming while also bringing forward guns to bare on rearward targets.

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