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John370

Tallinn Help

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So I lucked out and got Tallinn after a very high payoff container, but I'm finding the ship is very difficult for me to play. The worst was an Epicenter game earlier today where in the melee in the middle I didn't see Mass and was deleted as I went broadside to him. 5 hits did 35k+ damage.  The only other cruiser I play regularly is Cleve, but I can't seem to play Tallinn like her as she doesn't have the rate of fire or trajectory to shoot over islands.  I'm trying to kill cruisers with my AP, but can't seem to find a spot where the BBs don't mangle me.  Should I play this ship as a fringe merchant?  Any suggestions as to how to play Tallinn, and what modules to install would be most welcome.

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Start with watching this vid, it's only 12 minutes:

 

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You may want to play the existing Russian cruiser line to get a better feel for these cruisers rather just jump into T8 as they are much different than US cruisers.

 

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14 minutes ago, 1SneakyDevil said:

You may want to play the existing Russian cruiser line to get a better feel for these cruisers rather just jump into T8 as they are much different than US cruisers.

 

Thanks. That would make sense, but I don't have the port slots, and figured I'd give a free premium a ride.  Not having done the grind up the line I'm paying the price for the shortcut.

 

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6 minutes ago, John370 said:

Thanks. That would make sense, but I don't have the port slots, and figured I'd give a free premium a ride.  Not having done the grind up the line I'm paying the price for the shortcut.

 

Tallinn isn't a premium ship. She is the tech tree T8 ship that you got early access to by having enough tokens to purchase.

Russian cruisers have much different ballistics than US cruisers. So their shells will arrive quicker to the target than the float in the air have a 2nd cup of coffee arcing US shells. So you need to find more low lying islands to shoot from behind and need to become good at shooting from near max range or while kiting away from ships.

Their armor is extremely weak on the sides so a broadside salvo from a BB can be very devastating. Some of them can do well angled but you literally need to know all the directions you can be targeted from.

Since you don't have the port slots to play the existing Russian cruiser line, my suggestion is to play the ship in coop for a bit until you are more comfortable with how she handles in a variety of situations.

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These new Russian cruisers should be played at med to long range, in open water, and always angled to the enemy. Remember those things and you'll have success. They aren't island huggers like some of the others that have more lofty shell trajectories. I love these new boats. Start the games at longer range and then move in to take out targets of opportunity late game. These aren't HE boats. The HE alpha and fire starting ability is very underwhelming. Use the excellent AP as much as possible. They have improved angles. Not US levels but pretty good. Penetration is also outstanding. 

I had a bit of a learning curve too. But, I'm having success with the Riga after initially having a hard time with it. 

The coal radar module is a must. 

Edited by General_Lee_Miserable
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17 minutes ago, General_Lee_Miserable said:

These new Russian cruisers should be played at med to long range, in open water, and always angled to the enemy. Remember those things and you'll have success. They aren't island huggers like some of the others that have more lofty shell trajectories. I love these new boats. Start the games at longer range and then move in to take out targets of opportunity late game. These aren't HE boats. The HE alpha and fire starting ability is very underwhelming. Use the excellent AP as much as possible. They have improved angles. Not US levels but pretty good. Penetration is also outstanding. 

I had a bit of a learning curve too. But, I'm having success with the Riga after initially having a hard time with it. 

The coal radar module is a must. 

Thanks. Sounds like good advice if I can execute it.  Just played Bismarck and our Tallinn racked up 2000+ xp, so the ship can be effective it seems. What is the this coal radar module?  I didn't see that in the 5 modules on the ships page in port. 

 

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24 minutes ago, General_Lee_Miserable said:

These new Russian cruisers should be played at med to long range, in open water

They're actually designed to played at close range given their poor long range dispersion and all around anemic HE.  You *can* play them at long ranges, but they're nothing special in that regard and there are much better options for that sort of play style. 

Edited by yashma
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8 minutes ago, John370 said:

Thanks. Sounds like good advice if I can execute it.  Just played Bismarck and our Tallinn racked up 2000+ xp, so the ship can be effective it seems. What is the this coal radar module?  I didn't see that in the 5 modules on the ships page in port. 

 

You buy it in the armory then it swaps in 1 of the upgrade slots, it's in the upgrades section.

Edited by bosco1111
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1 hour ago, yashma said:

They're actually designed to played at close range given their poor long range dispersion and all around anemic HE.  You *can* play them at long ranges, but they're nothing special in that regard and there are much better options for that sort of play style. 

This. The closer you can get the more of those heavy AP hit. On softer BBs you can even cit them. At further ranges the shells loose punch and you’ll get far more bounces. It’s not uncommon in my Riga to get a 20k salvo on a broadside BB at 10km. If you use the armor right it’s very strong. I 1v1d an Izumo tanking his shots and won lol. Against cruisers that aren’t Super they can tank a lot. The HE is still laser like so it’s good for DDs. Radar helps to get a couple hits. not sure if the coal mod is worth the extra 3 seconds of radar but it’s what I got equipped. They’re high alpha low RoF ships. The play style is assassin as in you dive on distracted targets. BBs already engaged? Go in on it’s side at 10km and watch him melt. Light Cruiser solo camping behind an island? Pop hydro and angle on in there. I’ve had a couple 150k plus games in my Riga but she requires opportunity and BB support to really shine. 

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1 hour ago, yashma said:

They're actually designed to played at close range given their poor long range dispersion and all around anemic HE.  You *can* play them at long ranges, but they're nothing special in that regard and there are much better options for that sort of play style. 

Not with 25mm upper bow armor and overmatch.  Same reason you don't play a Kron in that close. Sure, it performs better at closer ranges in terms of dealing chunk damage (like the Kron)  but it survives a whole heck of a lot longer playing at 12km or more out. 

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Opinions on whether it would be worth it to spend 110k FXP to unlock the Tallinn?

 

Tallinn looks like a Russo-Hipper, and I like both Hipper and PE. 

Did not enjoy Shchors at all, it's one of the few ships I sold off when I was done grinding through to the next ship... I think I may have used FXP for the last several thousand just to avoid any more battles in the damn thing. So, I'm not buying Shchors again, grinding another tier VIII ship, and enduring all that.

Currently sitting at ~350k FXP, and have the FXP ships I want at present. 

 

 

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I just got the Riga and i find her very hard to play so i am not surprised Tallinn is as well.. I expected the Armor to be better then it is but unless you are well angled or bow in around 15K you can get Citd pretty easy by most BB's. The guns are pretty good but you can't get close enough unless you play peek a boo behind an island otherwise you are back to port quickly. To me it seems like a poor turning Irian one tier higher without torps. I wanted to play it aggressive around radar range and i find it hard to do that the way Riga behaves. It sure as hell isn't OP, in fact i think it should be Tier 8 or 8.5

Edited by Steeler_Nation_USA

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Riga is just another tier nine paywall.  Designed to take your free experience, flags, money, camos or an inordinate amount of time.  Tier nine is the black hole of WoW.  Allot of tier nines are actually downgrades/sidegrades to the preceding tier eight.

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7 hours ago, Captain_Rawhide said:

Riga is just another tier nine paywall.  Designed to take your free experience, flags, money, camos or an inordinate amount of time.  Tier nine is the black hole of WoW.  Allot of tier nines are actually downgrades/sidegrades to the preceding tier eight.

Yeah i jumped back into my Bart and i was like hell this is what a 9 (or 10) lol should feel like. Messing people up right and left. 

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8 hours ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Opinions on whether it would be worth it to spend 110k FXP to unlock the Tallinn?

 

Tallinn looks like a Russo-Hipper, and I like both Hipper and PE. 

Did not enjoy Shchors at all, it's one of the few ships I sold off when I was done grinding through to the next ship... I think I may have used FXP for the last several thousand just to avoid any more battles in the damn thing. So, I'm not buying Shchors again, grinding another tier VIII ship, and enduring all that.

Currently sitting at ~350k FXP, and have the FXP ships I want at present. 

 

 

I enjoyed Schohrs a lot more than Tallinn. It's actually more fun to grind Colorado in coop than Tallinn, while Schors was a blast in coop...

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1 minute ago, Taichunger said:

I enjoyed Schohrs a lot more than Tallinn. It's actually more fun to grind Colorado in coop than Tallinn, while Schors was a blast in coop...

I loath the "can't take a hit, can't evade a hit" thing that most RU light cruisers have, and Shchors was way up the list on being a total backliner. 

I've been playing Derpy Donkey a little (it's tier IX so it counted for the EU capt campaign, and it has open XP now that doesn't just sit there uncoverted forever, it might go to unlocking a ship someday), and I've been reminded of how much I hate most of that line.

 

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51 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

I loath the "can't take a hit, can't evade a hit" thing that most RU light cruisers have, and Shchors was way up the list on being a total backliner. 

I've been playing Derpy Donkey a little (it's tier IX so it counted for the EU capt campaign, and it has open XP now that doesn't just sit there uncoverted forever, it might go to unlocking a ship someday), and I've been reminded of how much I hate most of that line.

 

I didn't really find Tallinn to be a fragile cruiser..     I really think its armor is quite trolley...It plays sort of like the Moskova .... strong bow in, and bounces a lot.  As well it's AP mains and their laser like ballistics are tricky to get used to.   Biggest problem for a lot of players with it.. myself included, is its HE is terrible, so you can't play that kite and HE spam play style and its gun trajectory is so flat it can't live in the island humping meta.  However.. its deadly medicine against other cruisers.    Riga which I had played once last night... Got Tallinn last event and put enough XP on it to get Riga immediately, plays very similar.  The heal really helps it.    both of their AA is efficient enough as well to at least be a less desirable target.   

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9 hours ago, Captain_Rawhide said:

Riga is just another tier nine paywall.  Designed to take your free experience, flags, money, camos or an inordinate amount of time.  Tier nine is the black hole of WoW.  Allot of tier nines are actually downgrades/sidegrades to the preceding tier eight.

I grinded 240k XP on Riga to unlock Petropavlovsk on the first day she was available... and I actually had a fairly enjoyable grind. 

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14 minutes ago, iRA6E said:

I didn't really find Tallinn to be a fragile cruiser..     I really think its armor is quite trolley...It plays sort of like the Moskova .... strong bow in, and bounces a lot.  As well it's AP mains and their laser like ballistics are tricky to get used to.   Biggest problem for a lot of players with it.. myself included, is its HE is terrible, so you can't play that kite and HE spam play style and its gun trajectory is so flat it can't live in the island humping meta.  However.. its deadly medicine against other cruisers.    Riga which I had played once last night... Got Tallinn last event and put enough XP on it to get Riga immediately, plays very similar.  The heal really helps it.    both of their AA is efficient enough as well to at least be a less desirable target.   

Yeah, I'm hoping Tallinn is different from the CL line, and you make it sound quite a bit different.  

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On 6/7/2020 at 8:51 AM, John370 said:

So I lucked out and got Tallinn after a very high payoff container, but I'm finding the ship is very difficult for me to play. The worst was an Epicenter game earlier today where in the melee in the middle I didn't see Mass and was deleted as I went broadside to him. 5 hits did 35k+ damage.  The only other cruiser I play regularly is Cleve, but I can't seem to play Tallinn like her as she doesn't have the rate of fire or trajectory to shoot over islands.  I'm trying to kill cruisers with my AP, but can't seem to find a spot where the BBs don't mangle me.  Should I play this ship as a fringe merchant?  Any suggestions as to how to play Tallinn, and what modules to install would be most welcome.

Most Russian cruisers  have flat trajectories. The Cleveland is a light cruiser where the Tallinn is a heavy so they will not play the same.

BB's AP is the bane of cruisers. Although I would think the Cleveland would take priority over the Tallinn if I was facing both in a BB. Longer acting radar & thinner skin are the reasons.

The worse is usually in a epicenter battle. You do not have as many options because the objective is in a confined section of the map.

Remember the Tallinn main guns are 180mm, not the usual 203mm of most other heavy cruisers. 4650 max AP damage for the Tallinn while the Hipper AP max damage is 5900.

 

 

Edited by kgh52

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1 minute ago, kgh52 said:

Most Russian cruisers  have flat trajectories. The Cleveland is a light cruiser where the Tallinn is a heavy so they will not play the same.

BB's AP is the bane of cruisers. Although I would think the Cleveland would take priority over the Tallinn if I was facing both in a BB. Longer acting radar & thinner skin are the reasons.

The worse is usually in a epicenter battle. You do not have as many options because the objective is in a small section of the map.

Remember the Tallinn main guns are 180mm, not the usual 203mm of most other heavy cruisers. 4650 max AP damage for the Tallinn while the Hipper AP max damage is 5900.

Hipper also has a faster ROF, slightly better raw pen on AP, and of course much better HE pen with better per-shell fire chance.   

Tallinn has more barrels, and slightly better pen angles on its AP, and more chances to hit and burn with HE due to those extra barrels.  

 

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4 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Hipper also has a faster ROF, slightly better raw pen on AP, and of course much better HE pen with better per-shell fire chance.   

Tallinn has more barrels, and slightly better pen angles on its AP, and more chances to hit and burn with HE due to those extra barrels.  

 

I prefer the Hipper over the Tallinn. As they say, your mileage may vary.

 

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2 minutes ago, kgh52 said:

I prefer the Hipper over the Tallinn. As they say, your mileage may vary.

"Better than Hipper" is, for me, a bar so high to clear that it might be an unfair standard to judge other ships by.   Hipper is one of my favorite ships.  

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So, went ahead and got Tallinn. 

It's not bad, and it doesn't aggravate me the way the RU CLs so, but I don't see what the hype is about these new Russian cruisers.

Maybe it's one of those ships that really suffers for being stock.

 

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